A&H

Unsure of sanction...

alexgr said:
Irrelevant, we’re talking non consensual. Reaction doesn’t matter
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So if the player on the receiving end laughs it off and says something like "save it for your wife" whilst smiling, you'd get the red out?

As much as we like to say 'this is always a red card no matter what', OFFINABUS is contextual and will always be so.
 
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alexgr said:
Irrelevant, we’re talking non consensual. Reaction doesn’t matter
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And you know its non consensual because .....

"Send him off ref. The only reason I put my arms around him, kissed him back and slip my tongue in is because I didn't know how to react"
 
JH said:
So if the player on the receiving end laughs it off and says something like "save it for your wife" whilst smiling, you'd get the red out?

As much as we like to say 'this is always a red card no matter what', OFFINABUS is contextual and will always be so.
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That's same as saying "that punch never hurt me"

The other players reaction is not a factor here, the offence is the offence regardless

"Spit on me some more, I like it", equals no red? the spitting act is what we are punishing
"f off you (insert racial/disabled/homophobic) slur..... and is met with a rendition of "Sticks and stones.....", equals no red?
SFP is SFP regardless of whether the other guy gets up and goes "ref am fine"

Completely bizarre to gauge your sanction on the reaction of the other player, an offence is an offence.

What to do you 2 mins later when he kisses someone else, who does not take it so well? You are the one who has opened the gates to it being acceptable by not punishing the first act.
 
JH said:
So if the player on the receiving end laughs it off and says something like "save it for your wife" whilst smiling, you'd get the red out?

As much as we like to say 'this is always a red card no matter what', OFFINABUS is contextual and will always be so.
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Yes. It’s sexual assault. No ifs, no buts
 
Interesting debate to follow am sure on whether we now judge sexual assault on whether the other person enjoyed it or not...........
 
Is the card really that relevant in the grand scheme of the incident? We can argue sexual assault or if there's no complaint you can argue that it was misguided humour. Red, yellow, nothing, you give what you think (the law is not specific with these incidents obviously) but the key would be to put it in a misconduct report would it not? Then those of us with alot more knowledge and experience can sanction appropriately after the game.
 
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Ben448844 said:
Is the card really that relevant in the grand scheme of the incident? We can argue sexual assault or if there's no complaint you can argue that it was misguided humour. Red, yellow, nothing, you give what you think (the law is not specific with these incidents obviously) but the key would be to put it in a misconduct report would it not? Then those of us with alot more knowledge and experience can sanction appropriately after the game.
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Disagree. If you don't give the send off because you erroneously think there is no complaint (perhaps because the victim is embarrassed by what happened), you risk retaliation and escalation. This is the kind of act that is demeaning and can lead to simmering. We can come up with changes to the OP that might not be a send off, but reread what as actually posted:

Peach said:
Scenario: OA mens game. A gobby, erratic, wind-up merchant who never fails to get a caution every game as a minimum is marking a player at a throw in, constantly talking and attempting to get in the players head... all of a sudden he kisses the opponent on the mouth! What on earth do you give there?! please don't reply 'your number' :D...
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The OP is an easy send off--and perhaps there is a lurking suggestion that the R might have been able to step in sooner to settle things down before it happened.
 
socal lurker said:
Disagree. If you don't give the send off because you erroneously think there is no complaint (perhaps because the victim is embarrassed by what happened), you risk retaliation and escalation. This is the kind of act that is demeaning and can lead to simmering. We can come up with changes to the OP that might not be a send off, but reread what as actually posted:



The OP is an easy send off--and perhaps there is a lurking suggestion that the R might have been able to step in sooner to settle things down before it happened.
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IMO I agree with the points made and it's a red card. But I've been able to read a variety of opinions from better and more experienced refs than me. In the heat of the moment, with no real reaction from the players involved, I think had I not read this I may well have shown no card or gone yellow. Remember, forums allow you to consider what you'd do for the best and not necessarily what you would do in the heat of a very strange moment that you've not experienced before
 
Forums also allow you to consider what you'd do without knowing the full context.
 
Takes me back to this.

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