It is definitely nonsense as broadcasters have already heard it as they have access to, at least, the VAR feed
TOT v LIV
- Thread starter GraemeS
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I thought they only had the "open mic" bits when the VAR is specifically holding a button to talk to the ref? In which case, all they would have heard is "checking possible offside" and "check complete", which doesn't add anything.
If they have the whole feed, even if they don't have permission to release it then I don't understand why they seem so unclear as to what happened? Neville was audibly shocked as the statement was read out - if he knew there was discussion about "confirming an onside", why would that be a shock? And similarly, Carragher on MNF was speculating as to what might have happened - he doesn't need to do that if he's literally heard the whole chat?
Gone to find that clip and it definitely sounds like he just gets the open mic bits. He talks about suddenly hearing "check complete" but none of the build-up, so I suspect it is the case that all the behind the scenes VAR/AVAR/RO chat isn't available to them currently.
you may have a point with understanding if performance may be impacted by travel time/fatigue
Sorry this is wilfully ignorant because that private fund is obviously set up as a tool of the state to avoid any accusations of state ownership!
Liverpool now have the audio to review, and fully expect their next statement will be along the lines of
‘We are happy that a genuine mistake was made, but PGMOl must now implement measures to ensure this isnt repeated, for the integrity of the game….this includes officials being allowed to officiate games 48hrs after lengthy trips abroad’
I don’t think they will mention the UAE/Saudi potential conflict of interest, but will maybe hint at it.
From what I have read, this is all Liverpool have wanted, since the initial explanation.
‘We are happy that a genuine mistake was made, but PGMOl must now implement measures to ensure this isnt repeated, for the integrity of the game….this includes officials being allowed to officiate games 48hrs after lengthy trips abroad’
I don’t think they will mention the UAE/Saudi potential conflict of interest, but will maybe hint at it.
From what I have read, this is all Liverpool have wanted, since the initial explanation.
That would be Sheikh Mansour, who last time I checked was an individual and is therefore incapable of also being a state. Look at it another way, Rishi Sunak has various companies that he runs and operates with personal wealth. None of those companies are state owned.
I don't want to derail the wider point here, but to be very clear, what is it that you want an independent review to address? Wellbeing and fatigue is a legitimate issue for debate, but to suggest that the decision making of those officials is then influenced by the UAE (or Saudia Arabia to extend the point) is dangerous territory and has absolutely no grounding in fact or reality. Hwang scored the winning goal for Wolves v City at the weekend when he should have been dismissed - that wasn't any kind of conspiracy or interference, it was a mistake by the referee, which happens every weekend and impacts various teams every weekend.
To be state owned, the club would have to be a commercial enterprise owned by a government entity, which is not the case. Regardless of what you believe, it is simply factually incorrect to say that City are state owned.
RefIADad
RefChat Addict
I’m genuinely asking here, as it’s been 21 years since I lived in Europe and regularly took flights out of Frankfurt. Outside of Russia, what is the longest flight within UEFA from London or Manchester?
In the US, we obviously have some long flights for match officials. With the PRO/MLS VAR hub (our Stockley Park) in Atlanta, we normally have referees from California and Utah making flights to Atlanta for VAR duty. Our longest flights are usually in 5 1/2 to 6 hour range if you’re going from Vancouver (they do have a MLS team despite being in Canada) to Miami. Two of MLS’ better referees live in the San Francisco area, so they have 5 hour flights if they are working somewhere in the US northeast like Boston or New York.
Just trying to get a feel for how often referees working UEFA duty would regularly have long flights like this. I know it’s something that PRO needs to account for, particularly when MLS has midweek games or they have officials working international duty (which often involves long flights with stops to less-developed places, so travel is a big issue for US FIFAs).
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R
Runner-Ref
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I think Kazakhstan is probably the furthest, off the top of my head. Looks like flight time can be done in 6h30 if you manage to get a direct flight
I travel to Astana (and Almaty) a fair bit with work. From Gatwick, via Istanbul, is about 13 hours (in the air for 9, wait in Turkey is about 90 mins) from arrival at Gatwick to getting in a taxi at the other end. Quite used to flying, but it's mentally gruelling. On the way out, usually get there around breakfast time. On the way home, depends if you want to get up at 5am to fly back, or land in London about 10am. Zzzzz.
I was always under the impression that was the case otherwise no doubt it be too distracting if the commentators constantly heard chat in their ear from the VAR/AVAR.
I hope it does get released to the public because I am interested in the communication from the on field officials to the people at Stockley Park in respect was it clear that the on field decision was offside. The media really needs to be made aware from the PGMOL the VAR only sees live play from one live feed from the main camera with NO sound and they DO NOT have the host broadcaster feed which will stop this nonsense of people(and pundits) saying of how the guys didn't see the image of the linesman with his flag up. You don't see on the main camera feed the linesman putting his flag up so it is either the on field communication was not clear enough to the VAR or everyone in the VAR room lost concentration which would be staggering.
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
No. Liv fan here. VAR is rubbish. You never forget the first time VAR ruins a goal celebration live (Dan Burn overhead kick for me). Prem assistants are amazing. I can handle a few wrong decisions a season. It’s only human. VAR is just a tragic waste of money. Who in the WSL will pay? Who in Latvia, Bolivia or Somalia will pay? It’s part of the gross distortion of a simple game by vultures.
R
Runner-Ref
Guest
I agree. I have never wanted VAR and still don’t.
But the clubs, fans and pundits call for it when it’s not in use and then hate it when it is in use.
You could put an ex-pro in the VAR hub as Clattenburg has mentioned. But I don’t think this would really improve things either. It’s a no win situation as it will always upset someone
Agree there isn’t enough money in WSL to cover it due to them not playing at the men’s stadiums each week. But this was mentioned after Chelsea’s game against spurs over the weekend.
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
Next on RefChat ownership news:
Moshiri is his own man and not a front for Usmanov.
Abramovich is his own man and in no way “indivisible” from Putin.
Yasir al Rum his own man and Newcastle in no way connect to the Kingdom of Saud.
And of course Manchester City’s financial affairs, pending court appearances, massive investments etc. in no way a state mechanism.
Lord give me strength.
Amazing that modern football ownership can make evil like Ashley look good!
Oi! Leave the Saudis out of it
I fear the day we hear live audio from VAR.......
Their Operating Procedures are far from ready for that addition to the Circus Act
It's just nothing like Rugby.... a game which is very technical and warrants constant explanation of decisions.... and a game in which umpires were mic'ed up for years before the Bunker came along. The biggest difference being, the culture. Hearing the VAR and all their mistakes live at this time would be fraught with risk. 24/7 news channels will need more than 24 hours in a day for their analysis
I don't know where all this is heading TBH.... sick of hearing about time needed to 'bed in'. Fed up of hearing' it's the people and not the process'. Nonsense, all of it. No way will VAR ever be banished to history and I'm not sure we've seen the worst of it yet for a number of reasons
Scrap it... take a few years off to completely rethink it. Huge lessons learned, come back with something better
I accept it's the future BTW. An unstoppable inevitability, but they need to take a step back, not march on
Read my comment again. I didn't say anything like that - all I have said is that it is not factually accurate to describe City as state owned because the ownership structure means that they do not fit into that definition. You can and are entitled to think and assume whatever you want in relation to ownership.
RefGod
Active Member
If you come under the PGMOL, (2b Referee/Step 1 AR and up) you have access to the Portal where there are weekly clips from the Premier League to Step 1. These have the comms between all officials, including VAR. I have to accept that the entirely unprofessional manner and constant use of nicknames is not helping the image or actual communication taking place. The VVD red card recently was incredibly interesting to watch.
bester
RefChat Addict
PGMOL release VAR audio from Spurs v Liverpool
Process leading to incorrect offside decision against Luis Diaz not being overturned explained as well as PGMOL statement
www.premierleague.com
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