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one said:
Does anything in the LOTG or the FA rules requires the referee to play the exact or minimum amount of added time displayed by the 4O? I know the LOTG doesn't, Does the FA rules? Genuine question.

The time displayed can be a rough (rounded to the minute) indication of the amount of added time accumulated so far.
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Has to be a rounded down.
Law says the fourth official must show a minimum which can only be extended and not reduced. So if you show a minute, that's a minimum amount the referee must allow.


"The fourth official indicates the minimum additional time decided by the
referee at the end of the final minute of each half. The additional time may be
increased by the referee but not reduced."
 
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JamesL said:
Has to be a rounded down.
Law says the fourth official must show a minimum which can only be extended and not reduced. So if you show a minute, that's a minimum amount the referee must allow.


"The fourth official indicates the minimum additional time decided by the
referee at the end of the final minute of each half. The additional time may be
increased by the referee but not reduced."
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Interesting. So if the referee has decided 55 seconds the display is 0 minutes? Never seen a 0 minutes display. Surley as @Quarryref already mentioned added times don't magically add up to be exact minutes.

On a tangent, from what I have seen added times are always decided by the referee and displayed before the end of the final minute not at the end as required by law.

I still think storm in a teacup. More value in talking about how to do the coin toss 🤣
 
one said:
Interesting. So if the referee has decided 55 seconds the display is 0 minutes? Never seen a 0 minutes display. Surley as @Quarryref already mentioned added times don't magically add up to be exact minutes.

On a tangent, from what I have seen added times are always decided by the referee and displayed before the end of the final minute not at the end as required by law.

I still think storm in a teacup. More value in talking about how to do the coin toss 🤣
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In PL it is mostly done as the clock turns 90 mins.
Agree that stoppage time doesn't normally add up..
Very rare in these games that at least 2 substitution events don't happen - I Dont think it in law but I am almost certain refs add on 30 seconds per substitute so it would be very unlikely be under 1.
I have noticed that it always seems to be on a definitive minute rather than minutes and seconds.
In my games, if I have been good with the watch stopping and starting I play it to the second. If I've had a balls up, I go on feeling but usually get it right (I am sole timekeeper remember 😉) and will play to a. Exact minute.
 
JamesL said:
In PL it is mostly done as the clock turns 90 mins.
Agree that stoppage time doesn't normally add up..
Very rare in these games that at least 2 substitution events don't happen
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Or as it turns 45 minutes... and very seldom substitutes happen in the first half :)
Edit: and in fact there are games with a single sub in the first half and nothing else to add on.

I'm with you for the rest of the post. More or less the same for me.
 
I checked the footage again. He last checked his watch (probably started the timer) 4 seconds before the ball was kicked. That was probably the reason why he blew earlier.
 
Personally, I'd like to abolish the practice of showing added time. But I think that genie, like VAR, is out of the bottle and never going back.
 
socal lurker said:
Personally, I'd like to abolish the practice of showing added time. But I think that genie, like VAR, is out of the bottle and never going back.
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It was introduced precisely because of these kinds of arguments though. It seemed entirely arbitrary how much time was to be added so at least now everyone can get a clue as to what they might expect.
 
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Martiju said:
It was introduced precisely because of these kinds of arguments though. It seemed entirely arbitrary how much time was to be added so at least now everyone can get a clue as to what they might expect.
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Unless it's a minimum of and the ref ignores it!

I'd rather talk the missing Minaminio than the missing minimum!
 
Martiju said:
It was introduced precisely because of these kinds of arguments though. It seemed entirely arbitrary how much time was to be added so at least now everyone can get a clue as to what they might expect.
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I understand why it was added. That doesn't mean I think it is a good idea. And how much didn't get any less arbitrary.
 
GraemeS said:
Constantly baffles me that managers don't seem to run their own clocks at grassroots level. If I was managing a side, I'd want to know the time before making any sub, but yet I still get constantly asked from the sidelines.
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or, even more annoying they just assume they you have kicked off at the exact kick off time - usually the reason we haven't is because one or both, teams take too long to come out of the changing rooms!

Managers will moan about anything, I've heard a manager of a team that has lost 6-0 - in a friendly - moan about too little time added on!
 
Referees at higher levels only stop their watches for injuries that are clearly going to take a long time. The added time is then estimated, so if there was a 1 minute injury stoppage and 4 subs they'll add 3 minutes. Often the 4th official is asked to record a stoppages log and that serves two purposes: it helps to calculate the stoppage time, so he will say down the comms "I've got 3 minutes, are you OK with that" and the referee will confirm or suggest otherwise. Incidentally this is why TV commentators know how much is to be added well before the board goes up, as the floor manager will have overheard the 4th official, or if they don't hear it they will ask him what has been agreed. The second benefit is that if either team query the stoppage time the 4th official can tell them how it was made up.

I'm not at a higher level, but I can't remember the last time I stopped my watch. I might have pretended to on occasions to placate any moaning, but it doesn't get stopped.
 
markref said:
The manager of our top local team (who is a real a***hole) used the stop watch on his iphone to keep an eye on time. I had them a few years ago in a game they were expecting to win easily but struggled in. The other team scored the winner in added on time before I blew the final whistle a few seconds after the restart as my watch beeped. He came running over to complain "where did that time come from! I didn't have anything like that much added on!" while pointing to his phone. I reminded him about the substitutes, injuries and the fact his team were wasting time at every opportunity, and then told him "of course, as we all know the Referee is the sole judge of time!" His reply was "Huh, I might as well get rid of this then!" I told him "oh no, don't do that. You might be able to use it as a phone!" before walking away. Little things!
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i suppose a phone is an update it the ancient watch round the neck. oh boy you can buy wristwatches now guys
when you see a coach with the socks tucked into tracksuit trousers a stopwatch round the neck and a notebook or a clipboard you know you are in for earache
 
Relevant to a degree, but seeing on Twitter earlier, with Bet365 tagged, many betting fans complaining about them not honouring 9 corners being awarded (8 taken) in the Aston Villa game earlier.
With 93:53 on the tv clock, a corner is awarded. 4 minutes minimum added. I know that you stop the game at 90 minutes (on a watch that is stopped for reasons you need to stop), but again it looks like another match that is blown dead on the minimum added time. With Aston Villa attacking, they could have scored from it and helped with their goal difference, or maybe Newcastle could stay up by the saving of a goal, who knows, but I do wonder whether it was bang on 94 minutes he actually had to blow or whether he could have waited until the corner is played out. Even telling the teams this is literally last attack. The corner was won within time, and potentially could have been taken within time, but no one knows what's on the refs clock.

I would love to know why games always seem to end dead on the minute.
 
Don’t the 4,000 GBP smartwatches the PGMOL referees wear have an app to accurately track stoppage time? I have that on my Garmin that costs way less than that.
 
ladbroke8745 said:
Relevant to a degree, but seeing on Twitter earlier, with Bet365 tagged, many betting fans complaining about them not honouring 9 corners being awarded (8 taken) in the Aston Villa game earlier.
With 93:53 on the tv clock, a corner is awarded. 4 minutes minimum added. I know that you stop the game at 90 minutes (on a watch that is stopped for reasons you need to stop), but again it looks like another match that is blown dead on the minimum added time. With Aston Villa attacking, they could have scored from it and helped with their goal difference, or maybe Newcastle could stay up by the saving of a goal, who knows, but I do wonder whether it was bang on 94 minutes he actually had to blow or whether he could have waited until the corner is played out. Even telling the teams this is literally last attack. The corner was won within time, and potentially could have been taken within time, but no one knows what's on the refs clock.

I would love to know why games always seem to end dead on the minute.
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I know sky bet have it in their t&cs that only corners taken count towards their total, do bet365 have something similar I wonder?
 
ladbroke8745 said:
Relevant to a degree, but seeing on Twitter earlier, with Bet365 tagged, many betting fans complaining about them not honouring 9 corners being awarded (8 taken) in the Aston Villa game earlier.
With 93:53 on the tv clock, a corner is awarded. 4 minutes minimum added. I know that you stop the game at 90 minutes (on a watch that is stopped for reasons you need to stop), but again it looks like another match that is blown dead on the minimum added time. With Aston Villa attacking, they could have scored from it and helped with their goal difference, or maybe Newcastle could stay up by the saving of a goal, who knows, but I do wonder whether it was bang on 94 minutes he actually had to blow or whether he could have waited until the corner is played out. Even telling the teams this is literally last attack. The corner was won within time, and potentially could have been taken within time, but no one knows what's on the refs clock.

I would love to know why games always seem to end dead on the minute.
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Chelsea v Luton 1st half today didn't.

End of 1st half - foul committed 3 seconds before end of added time. Ref allowed Luton to take free kick, header, GK save then blew up about 40 seconds after end of minimum time.
 
Regarding the free-kick that won the game, not getting into a dispute as to whether it was a foul or not. There did appear to be a UTD defender, No5 I think in the wall, certainly not a metre away. Anyone else see this?
 
Gamespoiler said:
Regarding the free-kick that won the game, not getting into a dispute as to whether it was a foul or not. There did appear to be a UTD defender, No5 I think in the wall, certainly not a metre away. Anyone else see this?
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He was stood in front of the wall, a metre away. Nothing to see here.
 
PinnerPaul said:
Chelsea v Luton 1st half today didn't.

End of 1st half - foul committed 3 seconds before end of added time. Ref allowed Luton to take free kick, header, GK save then blew up about 40 seconds after end of minimum time.
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FKs are different from corners though, in that regard. A corner is a technical restart, but a FK is meant to 'make good' the opportunity that would have existed if a foul hadn't occurred. In my mind this is then a restart that must take place, otherwise it would make sense for any side trying to cling onto a scoreline to foul the opponent repeatedly until time runs out.

This came up in one of the FA Cup games last week too I think, where a goal was scored following a FK after the minimum added time had elapsed. I know the manager was furious about it. You can see why at first glance but I think this does make sense when you think about it.
 
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