Arsenal v Bayern

[Ori]

Can’t agree with you there. The more I watch it, the more deliberate it looks to me. He checks to see where the defender is and takes him out. He is clever in that he doesn’t swing, but he jolts his body to get a strong contact with his face.
Straight red for me.

 

[Wolf_Ref]

The only bit I really saw was the pen appeal at the end. Outstanding refereeing. If anything was a foul on the keeper.

CL refereeing is really quite impressive.

 

[RefereeX]

Fantastic call in real time for the non penalty for Saka.

With regards to the handball, unless we can absolutely prove that Raya was taking the goal kick as opposed to passing it to Gabriel to take then it's absolutely correct to use a bit of common sense for me.

 

[JamesL]

Fantastic call in real time for the non penalty for Saka.

With regards to the handball, unless we can absolutely prove that Raya was taking the goal kick as opposed to passing it to Gabriel to take then it's absolutely correct to use a bit of common sense for me.

Personally think it should be HB.

But if not then perhaps some action for DRP.

Also if you're not penalising it then what if they do it again immediately after citing changed mind on taker again.

The ball is in play when it is kicked and clearly moves, this happens moments after the signal is given to restart play. I cant see much more than a ball in play that shouldn't be handled by the defender.

 

[RefereeX]

Personally think it should be HB.

But if not then perhaps some action for DRP.

Also if you're not penalising it then what if they do it again immediately after citing changed mind on taker again.

The ball is in play when it is kicked and clearly moves, this happens moments after the signal is given to restart play. I cant see much more than a ball in play that shouldn't be handled by the defender.

I can't necessarily disagree with anyone who says it should be handball, but for me, I have to be sure that a restart is intended to be taken. It's the same as the old trick where someone discreetly takes the corner and another player collects it and runs with it. If they haven't told me or the AR that it's going to happen, I don't allow it, because if the other player wanders over and picks it up after I've seen the first player kick it and I give handball, they're going to be miffed.

 

[Wolf_Ref]

Personally think it should be HB.

But if not then perhaps some action for DRP.

Also if you're not penalising it then what if they do it again immediately after citing changed mind on taker again.

The ball is in play when it is kicked and clearly moves, this happens moments after the signal is given to restart play. I cant see much more than a ball in play that shouldn't be handled by the defender.

I think it was good refereeing but also could have been given as a HB. Think players were extremely lucky. Will probably be used as a clip for ref training in the future!

 

[Big Cat]

Fantastic call in real time for the non penalty for Saka.

With regards to the handball, unless we can absolutely prove that Raya was taking the goal kick as opposed to passing it to Gabriel to take then it's absolutely correct to use a bit of common sense for me.

The criteria for taking a Goal Kick had clearly been met. This is a binary consideration and not the Ref's problem. The appeal by the opposition players leaves the Referee with no choice.. We'll always be harangued by players when one Ref applies the Law one week, but another does not do the same thing the next week. I've just torn Law 16 out of the book. Only page 11 regarding some 'philosophy stuff' and a few other pages we arbitrarily and fastidiously adhere to are left in the pamphlet
Saka should be banned for the return fixture, but they'd never do that as his absence might detract from the spectacle of the circus

 

[RefereeX]

The criteria for taking a Goal Kick had clearly been met. This is a binary consideration and not the Ref's problem. The appeal by the opposition players leaves the Referee with no choice.. We'll always be harangued by players when one Ref applies the Law one week, but another does not do the same thing the next week. I've just torn Law 16 out of the book. Only page 11 regarding some 'philosophy stuff' and a few other pages we arbitrarily and fastidiously adhere to are left in the pamphlet
Saka should be banned for the return fixture, but they'd never do that as his absence might detract from the spectacle of the circus

You've become very angry in the last 2 days - I like it!

 

[RefereeX]

I'll just throw this in to the 'we need ex players involved in the VAR process' debate...

Edit: This is about the Saka incident

The decision not to award a penalty left TNT Sports pundits Rio Ferdinand and Martin Keown in disbelief.

"How has that not been given?" said ex-Manchester United defender Ferdinand. "I can't believe, with VAR and everything, that's not been given.

"He's running through and that's a penalty. I'm in the stadium and I can't believe it - I'm walking around in disbelief with my hands on top of my head."

Former Arsenal defender Keown added: "If you had 10 top European referees here tonight, nine of them would've given it. This referee is the only one who hasn't given it - I find it quite alarming he's not given that penalty.




Also, I've not actually seen the goal kick / handball incident yet, I'm basing my opinion on the way it's been described.

 

[Goldfish]

On the handling incident we have seen incidents like this punished. Double touch in Italy by a goalkeeper resulted in a DOGSO red card. Ball kicked put into play towards a team mate who ignored it and then the goalkeeper plays it again.
Anyway I get the spirit of the no call here yet if Tuchels comments are true the big mistake is that the referee should not be commenting on the call to anyone in the way alleged. Say nothing that can be used later. If he had said nothing just blanked it then there is no rod to beat with. I think UEFA will not be happy the way it allowed the post match interview to go.

 

[Big Cat]

You've become very angry in the last 2 days - I like it!

I turn it on and off like a tap

 

[Paul_10]

I'll just throw this in to the 'we need ex players involved in the VAR process' debate...

The decision not to award a penalty left TNT Sports pundits Rio Ferdinand and Martin Keown in disbelief.

"How has that not been given?" said ex-Manchester United defender Ferdinand. "I can't believe, with VAR and everything, that's not been given.

"He's running through and that's a penalty. I'm in the stadium and I can't believe it - I'm walking around in disbelief with my hands on top of my head."

Former Arsenal defender Keown added: "If you had 10 top European referees here tonight, nine of them would've given it. This referee is the only one who hasn't given it - I find it quite alarming he's not given that penalty.




Also, I've not actually seen the goal kick / handball incident yet, I'm basing my opinion on the way it's been described.

Keown's comments were probably based on emotion at the time but he's coming up with a figure(9 out of 10 referees would have given it) that he can't prove. In fairness I think some referees would have given it but I think the general reaction is it's not a penalty and the referee has made the right call.

If the referee did say those comments on the Gabriel handball then it's very nieve from him, I think the fact Gabriel have taken the goal kicks during the match has helped him here aswell and I think he made the right decision but whether it's the right decision basing on the laws I'm not sure because it's an unusual situation.

 

[Will_A]

Different viewpoint from a Senior colleague (also happens to officiate at an elite level):

"more a case of excellent tactical awareness / understanding.
In this game, Arsenal had taken every short goal kick with a defender passing the ball to the GK, after the GK had provided the ball to the defender to take the kick (sometimes by foot, sometimes by hand).
This is an increasing tactic of many teams and Arsenal for one do it every game.
The referee whistles to get the attention of Arsenal and tell them to get moving. Arsenal responded by carrying out their usual goal kick routine…"

 

[Big Cat]

Different viewpoint from a Senior colleague (also happens to officiate at an elite level):

"more a case of excellent tactical awareness / understanding.
In this game, Arsenal had taken every short goal kick with a defender passing the ball to the GK, after the GK had provided the ball to the defender to take the kick (sometimes by foot, sometimes by hand).
This is an increasing tactic of many teams and Arsenal for one do it every game.
The referee whistles to get the attention of Arsenal and tell them to get moving. Arsenal responded by carrying out their usual goal kick routine…"

Don't get me wrong.... despite my earlier comments, I'm not awarding a PK here either hahahaha. That said, depending on which way the wind is blowing, I might just think 'f*%^ it' and give the PK.... which is pretty much the inconsistency we've seen with this specific occurrence on TV.
I'm just highlighting the absurdity of the 'beautiful game'. I often put strong opinions out there to illustrate the madness of it all

 

[Quarryref]

I'll just throw this in to the 'we need ex players involved in the VAR process' debate...

Edit: This is about the Saka incident

The decision not to award a penalty left TNT Sports pundits Rio Ferdinand and Martin Keown in disbelief.

"How has that not been given?" said ex-Manchester United defender Ferdinand. "I can't believe, with VAR and everything, that's not been given.

"He's running through and that's a penalty. I'm in the stadium and I can't believe it - I'm walking around in disbelief with my hands on top of my head."

Former Arsenal defender Keown added: "If you had 10 top European referees here tonight, nine of them would've given it. This referee is the only one who hasn't given it - I find it quite alarming he's not given that penalty.




Also, I've not actually seen the goal kick / handball incident yet, I'm basing my opinion on the way it's been described.

Just for balance, a bit of spot on punditry from Steve Sidwell

Penalty controversy! | Steve Sidwell reacts to dramatic Arsenal vs Bayern ending!

Steve Sidwell reacts as Arsenal are denied a penalty late in their Champions League quarter-final against Bayern.

www.skysports.com

 

[RefereeX]

I have watched it now and the more I watch and think about it the more I think handball is perhaps the better option. Nobody can really complain if handball is given.

 

[JamesL]

I think it was good refereeing but also could have been given as a HB. Think players were extremely lucky. Will probably be used as a clip for ref training in the future!

I think it would be interesting to see what narrative comes out.
I always say it's easier to explain why you have something in law than it is to explain against law.

 

[DJIC]

I think referee was correct to wave away hand ball penalty award, given nobody wants this tie decided by a penalty call by the referee even if backed up by law.

I had the same situation in a game of mine two weeks ago, my thought was coach the players, if they want to switch the side of the goal area to take the GK, then use your foot to stop it not your hand, hopefully this clip will be used by the coaches, to avoid putting referees in the spotlight for no fault of their own.

 

[es1]

nobody wants this tie decided by a penalty call by the referee even if backed up by law.

i guarentee bayern would

 

[Mooseybaby]

Just seen this for the first time on TT, utterly ridiculous. Absolutely no reason why the Arsenal defender should be handling that ball. The law regarding the ball leaving the area was changed to supposedly speed the game up, not to allow teams to weaponise it, with players saying after you, no insist after you blah blah blah...

Did the referee blow the whistle for the goal kick? Yes. Was it deliberately handled and in an unnatural position by the defender? Yes. Unless it's u8s on Sunday morning, then there is no way a referee who turns round and says I am not having this nonsense, handball, penalty can justifiably be critised. "What the game expects BS" is used far too often as excuse for selectively ignoring the laws of the game and justifying poor decisions.