As red as red can be.
Man Utd v Everton
- Thread starter NoFoulsAllowed
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As red as red can be.
I would add, that it’s stupid either way. Raise your hands onto another players face and you are asking for the ref to make a decision.
It's 'soft', but the force was not 'negligible' IMO.
In addition, a player who, when not challenging for the ball, deliberately strikes
an opponent or any other person on the head or face with the hand or arm, is
guilty of violent conduct unless the force used was negligible.
I do wonder if the VAR would have recommended a review had the referee not issued a red card. My initial impression is that if the referee saw it but didn't issue a red card (i.e. cautioned for it) then VAR wouldn't have got involved but if the ref had his back to it, VAR probably would have got involved. Fortunately I'm in a position to be able to get the answer to that question.
negligible - key term here.
We've seen much worse with greater force get away with intentional kicks/stamps/punches and nothing given at all.
Negligible is subjective. This was hardly a slap imo. Team mates showing passion. However, the ref decided in his view it's enough force. So I don't have any problems with that.
Now we'll most likely see a flurry of red cards for violent conduct over the next few march weeks.
We've seen much worse with greater force get away with intentional kicks/stamps/punches and nothing given at all.
Negligible is subjective. This was hardly a slap imo. Team mates showing passion. However, the ref decided in his view it's enough force. So I don't have any problems with that.
Now we'll most likely see a flurry of red cards for violent conduct over the next few march weeks.
It looked negligible too me but the referee was right there and had the best view of it so can judge it better than on TV pictures.
I do feel for a red card it needs to be something more obvious like Kudos at West Ham last year where he slapped/pushed the Spurs player in the head with some force and the VAR did get involved then.
I did thought it was interesting Keane did not complain to the ref and nor did any Everton players so at pitch level it probably did look more forceful.
I do feel for a red card it needs to be something more obvious like Kudos at West Ham last year where he slapped/pushed the Spurs player in the head with some force and the VAR did get involved then.
I did thought it was interesting Keane did not complain to the ref and nor did any Everton players so at pitch level it probably did look more forceful.
Obviously I can't speak for whoever the VAR was last night, but if it were me then I would have recommended a review had the referee not given a red on-field. The angle from behind the goal shows that the head/face contact is with sufficient force to jolt Keane's head sideways - IMO it's clear and obvious that it's more than negligible.
I haven't seen any decent angle of this to be honest, I gathered it was a relatively light push/gentle slap to the face (which I still agree if a red card as it's more than neglgible.
I am now of the knowledge that despite there being 40 cameras in operation for VAR, none of them were focussed on Keane and Gueye meaning an intervention would have been difficult had Harrington not gone red on field.
I am now of the knowledge that despite there being 40 cameras in operation for VAR, none of them were focussed on Keane and Gueye meaning an intervention would have been difficult had Harrington not gone red on field.
Go to 20 seconds for the angle behind the goal.
To be fair, I do get why people might be (consciously or subconsciously) looking for reasons not to give a red due to the circumstances. Totally on your side that it has to be a red though.
Quite a lot of people don't think it's a red and no doubt some of that is because it's teammates instead of the opposition but I guess it's also depends on someone's interpretation of what "negilable contact" is.
I have no issues with the ref going with a red card, he's got the best view and your own eyes is a better judge than TV pictures especially when they are slowed down. I think for some people, it has to be a bit more forceful to reach that threshold of violent conduct.
Agree with that, I can see why non-referees might think it shouldn't be VC, but I'm a bit surprised that some referees think that way. I'd also add two things here ...
If he'd slapped an opponent like that there would be no debate as the opponent would have thrown himself to the floor, effectively making the referee's decision for him. If this had been a slap on an opponent I doubt anyone would be questioning the red card, but I can't see the difference personally.
Also, look at the reaction of the Everton players, there wasn't a single Everton player who complained about the red card. That to me says that football expects a red card in this situation.
Yep, people was probably too broad I admit.
bester
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Extended bans for frivilous appeals no longer a thing?
www.bbc.co.uk
Idrissa Gueye: Everton red card appeal rejected by FA, says David Moyes
The Football Association rejected Everton's appeal against Idrissa Gueye's red card without providing an explanation, David Moyes says.
www.bbc.co.uk
I'm amazed they appealed, doubt it took too long to refuse it.Extended bans for frivilous appeals no longer a thing?
Idrissa Gueye: Everton red card appeal rejected by FA, says David Moyes
The Football Association rejected Everton's appeal against Idrissa Gueye's red card without providing an explanation, David Moyes says.
Not since 2018.