The Ref Stop

What Constitutes A "Foul Throw?"

Kes

Kes

I'll Decide ...
We hear it at least once, every match - "Foul throw ref!". It's one of my pet hates. :mad:

Law 15 is one of the least complicated ones in the book yet everybody I speak to seems to have their own idea of what a "foul throw" is.
Leaving aside the obvious ones like position of feet and from where the throw is actually taken, most player appeals for it I'm sure, stem from a commonly held belief that the ball/hands has to be behind the head at the point of release but this simply isn't true.
Law 15 talks about the ball being delivered from behind and over the head - it says nothing about at what point during it's travel path it has to be released. I've asked several assessors, tutors and fellow referees what they think and each gives a slightly different interpretation it seems.
How the hell are the players supposed to ever know if referees still can't nail down this simple Law?
So come on please chaps, what do you all think constitutes a "foul throw?" I thought I knew, but now I'm not 100% sure..... :(
 
The Ref Stop
I used to penalise a throw if it looked ugly as they are the ones that generally get the opposition wound up especially if it results in an attack on their goal - I am sure you know what I mean.
Lately I have adopted the approach that a throw in is purely a means of getting the game going again so unless their is a blatant infringement I simply ignore the calls and let the game go. If I see a foot just up and absolutely no one else does (no surprises) I usually let it go (cue replies from other ref's at this point lambasting me for flagrant disregard for the LOTG);)
If I have the energy I say as long as it is one motion then it is OK but as with all explanations it can lead to arguments or distractions.
 
Anthony said:
I used to penalise a throw if it looked ugly as they are the ones that generally get the opposition wound up especially if it results in an attack on their goal - I am sure you know what I mean.
Lately I have adopted the approach that a throw in is purely a means of getting the game going again so unless their is a blatant infringement I simply ignore the calls and let the game go. If I see a foot just up and absolutely no one else does (no surprises) I usually let it go (cue replies from other ref's at this point lambasting me for flagrant disregard for the LOTG);)
If I have the energy I say as long as it is one motion then it is OK but as with all explanations it can lead to arguments or distractions.
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So...... basically, (like me and others) you're not 100% sure either then?
 
Kes said:
So...... basically, (like me and others) you're not 100% sure either then?
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As you pointed out the Law is straight forward BUT players have their own interpretations hence why I ignore appeals but I sometimes feel the need to keep the peace by awarding the odd one if is is very ugly. Blatant has to be like a Netball throw or a foot way off the ground.
 
One of my favourite phrases is "It may be ugly but it's legal". I find it does genrally keep the mob at bay and satisfies them that you have seen it assessed it and concluded it's fine. A pet hate is foot off the floor when taken as I know from my own experience it's a great way of throwing it further and gaining an advantage.

If the first one however and its a minor foot up. .. (In junior football) I give them a chance and mention to them to be careful. Next one I blow.

As for the release... as long as it is released over the head/just in front it's fine... again I rarely find I blow for foul throws for the reseale of the ball.. again unless it is so obvious it is in front down etc.. that doesn't explain a lot I know bit hopefully you get my gist.
 
The couple of answers given so far seem to back up my exact point. There is way too much ambiguity when it comes to this (albeit fairly minor) issue. If in your opinion, the ball is released too far in front of the head and you blow for a foul throw - what are you going to (lawfully) tell the player when he asks you "why/how is that a foul throw ref?". Like I said, Law 15 doesn't mention how or at what point the ball has to be released. ?
I've looked at this many times over the past couple of years and I think I know the answer now but still want some more opinions from you guys. It may well be that I've always overlooked something or that I'm just completely wrong!! :oops: :D
 
so long as:

feet are on the ground, they are behind (or front of feet are not crossing the white line)
the ball comes from behind the head and is released just over head/just in front then it is getting a pass from me.

again, ugly is not illegal (if it was my ex would be in side now! lol)

players will shout for everything remember!
 
far as I thought, they cannot encroach ontop the FOP, so can be on but not cross the white line
 
Ranks alongside 'in the back' in the most boring repetitive phrases that players shout out...nearly always designed to chip away at your confidence rather than any genuine offence occurring.

If I see something obviously wrong with the throw e.g. incorrect foot position....then I'll turn it over, don't care who else sees it or not...last time I looked it wasn't a requirement under the LOTG for anyone other than the referee (or NAR) to spot offences.....
But it has to be obvious.....hands well in front of the head before releasing the ball, foot obviously off the ground, etc etc.....
 
Padfoot said:
But it has to be obvious.....hands well in front of the head before releasing the ball, etc.....
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But that's my question - why? Law 15 doesn't cover that. The word "release" isn't mentioned in that context at all. So what right have we or anybody else got to be making it up as we see fit? For what it's worth, on my basic course 3 years ago, one of my tutors explicitly mentioned the fact that the ball can be released anywhere so long as it's delivered from behind and over the head. :confused:
 
which is correct Kes ...

but if it released to far forward doesn't that then constitute a 'bounce' rather than a throw?
 
Gary Milton said:
One of my favourite phrases is "It may be ugly but it's legal".
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I've often used "just because it was a rubbish throw, doesn't make it a foul throw". Gets the odd laugh. Feet have to be clearly off the ground, otherwise you'd be penalising every "step through" throw (if you get what I mean), and as long feet are on or behind the line (so yes, the barest of both heels being on the line, with the rest of the feet on the FOP is fine).
 
Charlie Jones said:
yes, the ground outside the touchline - which would be the ground NOT on the FOP side
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I think you have misinterpreted what the law says. PART of both feet need to be on the touchline OR off the field of play. If a player takes a throw with both feet on the field of play but their heels on the touchline then this is a legal throw in as part of both feet are on the touchline
 
Kes said:
But that's my question - why? Law 15 doesn't cover that. The word "release" isn't mentioned in that context at all. So what right have we or anybody else got to be making it up as we see fit? For what it's worth, on my basic course 3 years ago, one of my tutors explicitly mentioned the fact that the ball can be released anywhere so long as it's delivered from behind and over the head. :confused:
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So you allow a throw where the hands and arms came from behind and over the head but the ball was released at about waist height?
 
I genuinely can't remember the last time I penalised a foul throw. You get the calls every single game, I usually just use the first throw as the standard and every appeal is met with "they are all as bad as each other, just get on with it".

I agree that there is a misconception that you have to throw the ball on an upwards trajectory. As far as I am concerned, a player can loop the ball to a teammate who is one yard away if he wants to, as long as he follows the basics it is a legal throw. It might look very ugly, but I can't see how I can penalise it.

I think the spirit of the law is to have the player actually throw the ball, I.e. have some momentum and therefore they should be releasing above or just in front of the head, but I agree it is not clear. I think the important thing is to be consistent in your application throughout the match.
 
A foul through ......is ........ ?

9/10 throws you see in the Premier League every week to add to the lack of 6 secs for keepers ! And the lack of second yellows for blatant offences ?

Think they make it up as they go :rolleyes:
 
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