A&H

Unintentional violent conduct...

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one said:
They are both challenging for space though aren't they? And that is a common and accepted part of football. As I said before, I don't disagree it is his responsibility to ensure this sort of contact doesn't happen when challenging for space (or for the ball) but to say that he did it deliberately is stretching it.
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Nah. To say he didn't is stretching it.

We have it on camera. I'm unsure where this "deliberate" or "intentional" stuff comes from to be honest. :confused: We had it last week with the Luiz incident. None of us are telepathic. You look at what occurred and sanction accordingly.

I've watched it several times now and it's clear. The only thing Dean did wrong (IMO) was having to be told to look at the screen.
He's seen it, clear as day. Sure, Soucek was able to make it look fairly innocuous and Dean probably looked at Mitrovic's histrionics and thought "Oh perrlease!" but it's VC all day long. Soucek reacts/retaliates to Mitrovic's hands on him by petulantly swinging his arm/elbow upwards towards his face. End of. "Oh he didn't really mean it" has no relevance.

As with the David Luiz thing last week - correct decision. Luiz's actions made it happen. Soucek - the same.

In one of my grass roots matches, I already said that I'd likely downgrade the Luiz thing to a yellow, because that would be easy to sell to the players and the penalty is nailed on. If I saw something like the Soucek incident happen in one of my games, I'd either be cautioning Mitrovic for USB or red carding Soucek for VC.
 
Kes said:
We have it on camera. I'm unsure where this "deliberate" or "intentional" stuff comes from to be honest. :confused:
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It started from here:
Kes said:
If he hadn't meant it then it wouldn't have happened.
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Kes said:
None of us are telepathic. You look at what occurred and sanction accordingly.
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Except that there is a clause for VC in law that required you to judge if contact to head was "deliberate". Telepathic or not, as a referee you have to judge that.

As with the rest, most of what i say or you say is opinion. I have already said i am happy with an initial red or yellow but VAR should not have got involved.
 
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Degnann said:
Unfortunately it has come to this

https://twitter.com/x/status/1358750630307856385
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Came here to post this.

I don't care how bad a decision is, nobody deserves this kind of treatment. It's made even worse by the fact that the majority of replies to the news on social media justify him and his family being abused and sent death threats. I really hate football sometimes.

He's also asked not to referee this coming weekend - https://www.skysports.com/football/...league-fixtures-after-receiving-death-threats
 
Sadly, it means they win!
I'm not suggesting Mike should put up with it and totally stand by his decision but it isn't going to go away when the end result is no chance of a certain ref reffing your game next week.
 
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I’ve also just read part of an article that states Keith Halkett belives Dean and Mason should step down as referees. I am speechless
 
Kes said:
Me too. Have you ever stood on the edge of a penalty area waiting for a free kick to happen and "accidentally" jabbed your elbow into somebody's face?

Me neither...
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I have done something similar as a referee.

I blew my whistle and gave a free kick.
I called player over and as he reached me, I started pointing to other infractions of his when I actually "slapped" a player who was walking behind me. I knew he was there or thereabouts as I walked past him to meet the offender half way, but didn't realise he came closer to listen in. So I hit him, obviously not on purpose.

Accidents can happen.

I genuinely think he is standing his ground whilst Mitrovic is trying to hustle for the position. The defender has, in my opinion, tried to lift his arm above Mitrovic to "hustle" back but doing so caught him. There was no force in it, it was not sudden, or quick. There was a bit of a gap between the two players where the player thought he could get his arm between, hence it wasn't fully outstretched, it was bent to try and get in the gap. Just the elbow caught him.
As said, for me, I think it is purely accidental.
 
Degnann said:
But its not objectively correct by the laws either
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I'll rephrase - IF the contact was deemed deliberate and with more than negligible force, than by Law the red card for VC was mandatory. I personally don't think it was deliberate, but I can see why the negligible force standard was met (not really saying I agree with it).

So if the final decision was that the contact was deliberate and more than negligible, the Laws mandate the send-off whether we agree with it or not. I personally don't think this fit the criteria for a send-off, and I also don't think it was a clear and obvious error to not rule this as a send-off on the field. Therefore, I personally think this was not a good usage of VAR.
 
RefIADad said:
I'll rephrase - IF the contact was deemed deliberate and with more than negligible force, than by Law the red card for VC was mandatory. I personally don't think it was deliberate, but I can see why the negligible force standard was met (not really saying I agree with it).

So if the final decision was that the contact was deliberate and more than negligible, the Laws mandate the send-off whether we agree with it or not. I personally don't think this fit the criteria for a send-off, and I also don't think it was a clear and obvious error to not rule this as a send-off on the field. Therefore, I personally think this was not a good usage of VAR.
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agree with all of that
 
Matthew said:
Came here to post this.

I don't care how bad a decision is, nobody deserves this kind of treatment. It's made even worse by the fact that the majority of replies to the news on social media justify him and his family being abused and sent death threats. I really hate football sometimes.

He's also asked not to referee this coming weekend - https://www.skysports.com/football/...league-fixtures-after-receiving-death-threats
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People are just so terrible sometimes. I wonder how they would feel if they got a death threat for making a mistake at their workplace. It would be wonderful if a few of these people were arrested and punished for their actions to send an example.
 
So, MD twice gets told to go to the monitor by VAR. To give reds he doesn’t want to give. Both are overturned on appeal. Now death threats.

VAR just has to go.
 
santa sangria said:
So, MD twice gets told to go to the monitor by VAR. To give reds he doesn’t want to give. Both are overturned on appeal. Now death threats.

VAR just has to go.
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Nope. You can have whatever opinion you want on VAR/MD etc - you cannot put death threats down to VAR.
 
santa sangria said:
So, MD twice gets told to go to the monitor by VAR. To give reds he doesn’t want to give. Both are overturned on appeal. Now death threats.

VAR just has to go.
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VAR didnt get the decisions wrong, the process did

so what do we really want?

No VAR at all? not a likely outcome

keep VAR as it is now - hardly preferable given fans growing displeasure

something else? possibly but what?

possibly for a separate discussion / another time
 
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