A&H

Rice red card

O

Ori

Well-Known Member
So let’s get this one over with.

Just watched the clip and 2 things. I watch premier league football all the time and they never book for that, but if they are clamping down then they need to be consistent as Brighton belted the ball away after a whistle earlier in match and no booking.

Regardless, how can a player not even get a yellow card for violent conduct? Surely that’s a straight red right there?

Let’s get the thoughts.
 
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Got a link to the clip? I'd like to have another look.

I was watching the game and it seemed very harsh, although probably technically correct. Delaying the restart is a mandatory yellow but we've all seen plenty of examples of them not given, including earlier in the same match. So it's effectively a judgement call.

Putting a team down to 10 men has a very profound affect on the match. I'm not sure that was really in the spirit of the game.

(Full disclosure: I'm an Arsenal fan.)
 
Kavanagh's mistake was not booking Pedro earlier in the game.

However, in isolation, the incident with Rice is a clear booking for delaying the restart. Arsenal fans and pundits might argue that it's harsh or not in the spirit of the game, but the responsibility lies solely with Declan Rice. He deliberately kicked the ball away just as the Brighton player was about to take it and should’ve known the risk when on a booking.

The real question is whether the Brighton player was guilty of violent conduct or simply trying to play the ball. Since referees can't judge intent, it would have been reasonable to expect a booking for both players and this a dismissal for Rice.
 
The Ginger Ref said:
Kavanagh's mistake was not booking Pedro earlier in the game.

However, in isolation, the incident with Rice is a clear booking for delaying the restart. Arsenal fans and pundits might argue that it's harsh or not in the spirit of the game, but the responsibility lies solely with Declan Rice. He deliberately kicked the ball away just as the Brighton player was about to take it and should’ve known the risk when on a booking.

The real question is whether the Brighton player was guilty of violent conduct or simply trying to play the ball. Since referees can't judge intent, it would have been reasonable to expect a booking for both players and this a dismissal for Rice.
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I don’t disagree that in isolation rice could have been booked for delaying the start of play.
However, if you look, Brighton player actually places the ball by throwing at rice.

Regardless, as in the clip I posted, Brighton player in first half wallops the ball away and didn’t get booked. So consistency is important.

Oh and I do think that’s violent conduct by kicking a player. The ball was nowhere near. Straight red if we are sticking the law, but if you want to be lenient then yellow card for being petulant. Red for me though.
 
It looks to me as though he's had shocker, he might be technically correct but inconsistent to say the least. I think the kick looked too bad to go unpunished but I think VC may be a stretch as he was about to kick the ball that Rice just kicked away, so it wasn't a violent action, merely a reckless one.
Also is it just me or are the officials wearing the same colour as the Brighton keeper?
 
JoetheRef said:
It looks to me as though he's had shocker, he might be technically correct but inconsistent to say the least. I think the kick looked too bad to go unpunished but I think VC may be a stretch as he was about to kick the ball that Rice just kicked away, so it wasn't a violent action, merely a reckless one.
Also is it just me or are the officials wearing the same colour as the Brighton keeper?
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I already know where this one is headed!

It's a clear delay the restart. I just hope they there aren't other examples more egregious not dealt with as that is what can cause frustrations.

The kick should be seeing a yellow card for me. Its not brutal/excessive, but he hasn't acted with regard for his opponent there.
 
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Hilly1618 said:
As the ball was still moving could the referee have managed differently?
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I think the referee could have any number or reasons to avoid giving the card - the ball was moving so he couldn't take the kick, the defender has rolled the ball so it's right in front of Rice, Rice was actually moving away - and I think that would have been a much less controversial decision. That doesn't mean he got it wrong.

The really difficult question for the referee is why he didn't issue a card for the (much more obvious) delay of restart in the same game.
 
Ori said:
I don’t disagree that in isolation rice could have been booked for delaying the start of play.
However, if you look, Brighton player actually places the ball by throwing at rice.

Regardless, as in the clip I posted, Brighton player in first half wallops the ball away and didn’t get booked. So consistency is important.

Oh and I do think that’s violent conduct by kicking a player. The ball was nowhere near. Straight red if we are sticking the law, but if you want to be lenient then yellow card for being petulant. Red for me though.
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Rice had no reason to touch the ball in that situation—and he shouldn’t have. The Brighton player set a perfect trap, and Rice fell for it, hook, line, and sinker.

By getting involved, Rice forced Kavanagh to make a decision. Once Rice delayed the restart by kicking the ball away, Kavanagh had little choice.

Had Rice simply left the ball alone, Kavanagh could have dismissed the incident as nothing more than handbags.
 
The Ginger Ref said:
Rice had no reason to touch the ball in that situation—and he shouldn’t have. The Brighton player set a perfect trap, and Rice fell for it, hook, line, and sinker.

By getting involved, Rice forced Kavanagh to make a decision. Once Rice delayed the restart by kicking the ball away, Kavanagh had little choice.

Had Rice simply left the ball alone, Kavanagh could have dismissed the incident as nothing more than handbags.
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All true.

Still not addressed the inconsistency of not booking pedro for kicking the ball away and for the kicking at rice.

Btw. Pedro got booked for a foul later in match and he score the equaliser so fans and pundits are right to question the refs decisions. It’s the inconsistency that drives everyone nuts. Bad enough there are inconsistency between refs and matches, but the same ref at the same match should be consistent.
 
Did Pedro score the equaliser after his yellow?

Edit: no, he didn't, the caution was at 90 + 6
 
The Ginger Ref said:
Surely it can’t be both

A shocker would imply that he made a mistake
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The mistake was failing to caution Pedro for the same thing earlier in the game, in my opinion.

I don't think he had a shocker, but I do think he was inconsistent.
 
Ori said:
All true.

Still not addressed the inconsistency of not booking pedro for kicking the ball away and for the kicking at rice.

Btw. Pedro got booked for a foul later in match and he score the equaliser so fans and pundits are right to question the refs decisions. It’s the inconsistency that drives everyone nuts. Bad enough there are inconsistency between refs and matches, but the same ref at the same match should be consistent.
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Addressed it in the first line of my original post

I agree it’s a booking.

Playing devils advocate Kavanagh may have deemed Pedro as not delaying the restart, especially considering the amount of balls that are now placed around the pitch these days.

For what it’s worth, Raya should’ve been booked 10 minutes earlier for persistent time wasting.
 
The Ginger Ref said:
Surely it can’t be both

A shocker would imply that he made a mistake
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I think he's had a shocker in not booking for the kick, it's a blatant yellow card that he's missed and then he's found a technical offence in the same incident which we all agree was inconsistent. The booking for Rice is not the issue, it's missing the other two that's allowed himself to get the criticism, hence the shocker.
 
Having watched the full 90 plus minutes, I think he made a lot of errors.
However the shocking part was book pedro and book rice. Not just one of them.
 
The Ginger Ref said:
Addressed it in the first line of my original post

I agree it’s a booking.

Playing devils advocate Kavanagh may have deemed Pedro as not delaying the restart, especially considering the amount of balls that are now placed around the pitch these days.

For what it’s worth, Raya should’ve been booked 10 minutes earlier for persistent time wasting.
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Playing devils advocate again then technically rice didn’t delay the play as the Brighton player was trying to play a moving ball. ;) we can all play that game.

book both or book none.
Also the kick in rice is an obvious card offence. We can debate yellow or red, but it’s a card.
 
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