The Ref Stop

Red or Pen ?

Alex71

Alex71

RefChat Addict
Level 5 Referee
Hypothetical situation ...

Blue v Red
Blue CF through on goal - recklessly tripped by Red CB just outside Penalty Area - obvious DOGSO
Ball continues into Penalty Area but away from goal - other Red CB picks ball up (anticipating ref whistle)

What is the correct re-start in Law please ..?
  • DFK outside Penalty Area and red card
  • Penalty (and yellows for the initial trip and maybe hand-ball) but no red
  • Let the Blue team choose ?!?!
 
The Ref Stop
For me, I am guessing this has happened so quickly that you haven't signalled for advantage then the first offence you have seen is what you are penalising so DFK and dismiss the player for DOGSO.
 
... Is there not a greater advantage to penalise the 2nd offence and award the penalty (more likely to result in a goal ...)
 
If you think that the initial one is a foul then penalise that due to chronology. I think it would be very unlikely that a defender would do this, they'd probably just lump the ball up the field a protest their innocence!
 
Southend-ref said:
If you think that the initial one is a foul then penalise that due to chronology. I think it would be very unlikely that a defender would do this, they'd probably just lump the ball up the field a protest their innocence!
Click to expand...

Unless you've played advantage and are suitably content that they have had their advantage which I would be if I could give them a pen.
 
Ryan Owens said:
Advantage, penalty. Caution for reckless challenge.
Click to expand...

a sending off rather than a caution for the DOGSO, no?

only a caution if a goal is scored 'directly' after the offence is committed and advantage has been applied
 
Unless the striker has a tap in, don't play advantage - DOGSO, direct free kick. Ball rolling away from goal, blow the whistle.

If the defender managed to get to the ball before the attacker to pick it up, there is no advantage there.

If you did (hypothetically) play advantage, opps. ;)
 
The advantage is that now they get a Pen. And he gets a caution for the reckless challenge, not for DOGSO.
 
In theory you could play advantage and award the penalty but also red for DOGSO. The first foul is DOGSO because the player could get a shot on target. Then you play advantage and give a penalty for handball. This is a significant advantage because a penalty is almost certainly a goal. But because the first foul denied the attacker a clear goal scoring opportunity then you would be able to send him off as well. But it would take a very brave/stupid ref to do this :confused:
 
I don't know why you would bother doing that. I think Penalty and caution for reckless challenge is plenty.
 
It comes down to whether you would wait to see of there was an advantage after the reckless trip and impending DOGSO, with the ball rolling out wide or whether you blow. The one bit of information missing is if it is DOGSO, the attacker must have fallen to allow the other defender time to get back to the ball first? Otherwise was it DOGSO in the first place? :)

It's a you really need to see it scenario, because either works in theory.
 
This is the difficulty with hypothetical situations; you get such disparate (and largely correct views) but no few completely satisfactory answers.

Reading that sentence back, it's obvious I have been teaching for the last few days!

You can only punish one or the other. DOGSO for the foul and direct free kick, or award the penalty. Either is entirely correct, although in terms of game management the penalty is my preferred option:

- Direct shot at goal (Blue team happy)
- The defender has obviously handled the ball, few arguments.
- The fouling defender is going to protest he played the ball, so you avoid any comments and dissent coming from you being "harsh" or "unfair" if you red him.
- This second defender gives you a get-out if the attackers protest - "He still has to go, he's the last man." No, there is another defender there - he handled the ball, and nobody else is near him.

I probably wouldn't bother with the hassle of the caution in this case either.
 
i always thought you cant play advantage if you are going to send the offending player off? how can you play on and then once the ball is out of play go back and show a red? (unless its a 2nd yellow)

so, IMO and i i were in the game scenario, i would give a penalty, caution for the CHALLENGE but! not the DOGSO (as that is a red card offence) then id caution the player who has handballed (again, not a red as i presume the attacker was still gettign up from the challeneg, meaning the defender hasnt DOGSO)

this way, blue are happy with the penalty, red are happy (i hope) that they could be a player down but arent..
 
Where is the advantage that you are playing?

Unless there was another attacker about to smash the ball into the net, then the advantage didn't exist until the defender committed a further offence.

IMHO, that is not a correct application of the advantage clause.....

Penalise the DOGSO, Red and DFK.
 
Surely there should be an advantage to the attacker...the defender has deliberately picked the ball up before you have blown for the whistle, so even though no real advantage has occurred, an offence has still took place after the original DOGSO ... It's a tough one to call and is a situation where you have to use your common sense in order to preserve a good mood in the game which for me would be...as I say...penalty and double caution
 
I'm with Padfoot, there can be no advantage if there is no blue player to play it for, how stupid would you look if the ball goes wide and there is only the red defender left there and you shout advantage.

I would question why in the face of an obvious DOGSO you would not immediately whistle for that, the second defender can't be very near otherwise how can it be an obvious DOGSO, meaning there must be a delay before he reaches the ball.
 
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