Question

[spuddy1878]

Newbie here.

I know the laws have changed regarding last man, professorial foul, denying obvious goal scoring opportunity but just wondered at what age do you implement the rule ?

For example if an U10s game player in on goal and is fouled outside the box by the keeper, the laws would say red card, would you always give a red and would that change depending on the scoreline.

If you let it go at 10s do you implement it at 13s/14s or older ?

 

[Tealeaf]

Conventional wisdom says it's poor form to answer a question with a question, but broadly that is what I am going to do!

The wording is crucial in the scenario you describe. We're looking at "obvious", and that's a judgement call rather than anything else, irrespective of age group.

Will that under 10 player actually get to a ball that you'd expect an older player to? If not, does that then become 'possible' rather than obvious?

How likely is it that the player will score?

Don't get hung up on ages and think he's too young, I can't do it. Look at the individual scenario as it happens; the reality of the event may give you other options besides red.

 

[spuddy1878]

It’s an obvious red card all day every day and twice on a Sunday BUT do you send a 9 year old kid off the pitch after 5 minutes of a game ?

 

[Ciley Myrus]

It’s an obvious red card all day every day and twice on a Sunday BUT do you send a 9 year old kid off the pitch after 5 minutes of a game ?

Yes, you do.

The lotg tell you what can be modified, Duration of game, size of ball etc

Dogso is not one of the variables

 

[Ciley Myrus]

My bad, I see its u10 so 7 a side on half pitch? That indeed changes things for me slightly

Full size game on full park tho, for me, red card

 

[one]

I remember I did a U9 low division years ago. It was full field 11 a side at the time. I don't remember how long into the game or the score. As the ball was rolling into the goal a defender (not keeper) ran twards it and picked it up about a meter short of goal and then realized what he did, dropped it and kicked it away. I blew the whistle and do remember thinking I have to do something fair but senseble here as everyone was waiting for me to decide. I jogged to the sideline and told the manager it's a pen, he is being sent off but I don't want to show him the red card. He thanked me and said he will get him off the pitch and explain it to him. As I was jogging back he called the kid to the bench.

I had seen very young kids bursting to tears when shown red cards for doing similar things.

 

[Big Cat]

Refereeing Youth Football is more of an art than a science. It's a sliding window of tolerance and common sense based on age group, the competence of the players and whether there's anything at stake

 

[OIREF!]

I sent off a keeper in an U13 cup final for DOGSO. It was a text book example and the assistants and myself were fully satisfied it was correct. We were still slaughtered for it but I'd have found it more difficult to justify letting the keeper stay on and having his team win.

In my area U13 is the first year organised, competitive football with league appointed referees. At younger age groups like U9/10 I would tend to show a bit more tolerance - I'd only go for a red if it was particularly blatant or cynical.

 

[Ciley Myrus]

Refereeing Youth Football is more of an art than a science. It's a sliding window of tolerance and common sense based on age group, the competence of the players and whether there's anything at stake

Agreed, i would also though throw in its about self preservation, as, as an appointed match official you do still have a duty to the association and so on. Let it go at one end and you are obliged to let it go at the other, and before you know it, what you had as a football match is now a lottery. Also, for some reason you turn up in x weeks time and decide on this occasion to dismiss a player from the other team from few weeks ago, and questions are asked as to why you never sent off the other guy x weeks ago.

 

[Big Cat]

Agreed, i would also though throw in its about self preservation, as, as an appointed match official you do still have a duty to the association and so on. Let it go at one end and you are obliged to let it go at the other, and before you know it, what you had as a football match is now a lottery. Also, for some reason you turn up in x weeks time and decide on this occasion to dismiss a player from the other team from few weeks ago, and questions are asked as to why you never sent off the other guy x weeks ago.

Indeed; avoiding the pitfalls of common sense is also an art, rather than a science!

 

[Deleted member 3014]

It’s very tricky as another aspect you have to look at is does a 10yr old understand the consequences of certain Actions on the pitch?

It’s hard to find eleven adults on one team that know the lotg let alone a 10yr old child, in reality you could be sending a kid off for something they don’t understand.

So many pro’s & cons regarding cards & kids, for me I’d avoid refereeing anything under the age of 16, @ 16 they should have a degree of understanding & can’t complain which doesn’t really answer your question.

In all honesty & I have done this is I’d have a quick word with both managers as to what I expect & how I’ll ref it Atleast that way if anything does occur & there is backlash from parents you can politely point them towards the manager who you briefed before the game.

For me kids of that age you can’t win either way, you send them off your a jobsworth with no heart, you let them off they’ll never learn & you’ve done them & opposition a disservice.

 

[Ciley Myrus]

Am always content to be called a jobsworth, if that by definition means I have carried out my duties in accordance with the LOTG correctly. Which is afterall why am wearing the badge in the first place

 

[Deleted member 3014]

Am always content to be called a jobsworth, if that by definition means I have carried out my duties in accordance with the LOTG correctly. Which is afterall why am wearing the badge in the first place

Indeed I agree but we’re talking about u10’s & unreasonable parents.

It’s not an easy environment far any young ref who themselves could be a child.

 

[Ciley Myrus]

As I said before, the LOTG make clear what modifications to make. Its our bible. It tells us what we can and cant change

outwith that, if the teams want an official, erm, match official, then, they have to expect the official to do whats needed.

 

[Deleted member 3014]

As I said before, the LOTG make clear what modifications to make. Its our bible. It tells us what we can and cant change

outwith that, if the teams want an official, erm, match official, then, they have to expect the official to do whats needed.

I agree still doesn’t make it an easy or enjoyable situation for a young ref 14-18yrs old that often ref kids games.

Personally I think below a certain age there should be guidelines of how you can deal with red card situations but hey there isn’t and that’s why I try to avoid refereeing anything under the age of 16.

 

[Ciley Myrus]

May not be enjoyable but then again, thems the instructions and if you are not capable or unwilling to follow them, then, should you be wearing the badge and taking a match fee and at risk of chewing an old hat, making it hard for say, me, when i turn up next week and do it properly

for the record, I would at all costs do what I could to avoid showing technical reds at u10 but, if i had to, then I would without any sleepless nights at all

 

[Deleted member 3014]

Would u Adam and Eve it just as I say I woudnt ref kids I’ve been forwarded an email from the FA to see if I’m interested in refereeing Barnet v Qpr u11’s - u14’s this Saturday.

As much as I’m against kids footy, I’d usually go for that being my team (Qpr), but have family commitments & Barnet is a fair drive.

Funny how things go I’m literally discussing kids footy & that happens.

 

[RustyRef]

Under 10s shouldn't be playing 11-a-side is my view and rather should be playing smaller sided games with different laws. Once they get to an age where 11-a-side laws apply they have to realise that they abide by the normal laws. I didn't think that 11-a-side was encouraged or even allowed at such a young age group under the relatively new FA youth development guidelines.

 

[PinnerPaul]

Would u Adam and Eve it just as I say I woudnt ref kids I’ve been forwarded an email from the FA to see if I’m interested in refereeing Barnet v Qpr u11’s - u14’s this Saturday.

As much as I’m against kids footy, I’d usually go for that being my team (Qpr), but have family commitments & Barnet is a fair drive.

Funny how things go I’m literally discussing kids footy & that happens.

You'll get loads of these email now MIB. I've been down there quite a lot last season. The guy who looks after these appointments knows I'm a QPR man, so actually offered me these ahead of the general email, which was good of him. I too have a slightly important family commitment - my son's wedding! - so couldn't take up the offer.

Good facilities there, including astros, but local traffic can be a bit slow - but hey ho - as you know, that's the same for all London!

 

[Deleted member 3014]

You'll get loads of these email now MIB. I've been down there quite a lot last season. The guy who looks after these appointments knows I'm a QPR man, so actually offered me these ahead of the general email, which was good of him. I too have a slightly important family commitment - my son's wedding! - so couldn't take up the offer.

Good facilities there, including astros, but local traffic can be a bit slow - but hey ho - as you know, that's the same for all London!

I would defo of taken the gig just to say I’ve refereed Qpr, I wouldn’t have been biast guv honest

I’ve had a few offers to do development games league 1 & 2 but when they find out I’m level 7 it’s ok well good of you to reply how about running the line instead

To be honest i ref’d six aside last nite & my legs are gone, think I’m gonna need a pre season before long, I write this as I sit in Greggs

Good luck with the wedding give me a bel if any Chelsea turn up