The Ref Stop

One extra player

Mugsey said:
The FA have introduced something they call Power Play for mini soccer. If a team becomes four goals behind they can add another player to their team. If they go a further two goals behind they can add another player.
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I think that is only for mini soccer (U7s - U10s).
 
The Ref Stop
Mugsey said:
All affiliated clubs will have public liability insurance as a condition of their affiliation. If you are officiating games between unaffiliated clubs and you are an affiliated referee you could get you affiliation withdrawn if anyone finds out.
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Affiliated clubs with an affiliated referee playing an unaffiated game....perfectly legal here. Of course regional varuations apply.
 
RefJef said:
Me, I’m allowing this (both the U11 & U13 girls scenario)

At this age and level, its all about participation. Do this, and the youngsters will enjoy themselves more, and learn more. Don’t do this, and someone from the losing side may well not bother next week as they’ve had a miserable experience and could be lost to the game forever.

As a bit of an Aside, when I first started, I was predominantly doing youth (U15 & U16) games. I remember having a number of conversations with managers, club secretaries and the league, suggesting that goal diffference not be used to decide league position. One club, very well run (and I am pleased to say, went on to win the league) would always rotate their better players off once the scoreline was running away in their favour. Some of their rivals would try and rack up a cricket score when playing the weaker teams in the league as they wanted to improve their goal difference, leading to some worthless encounters that benefited no-one.
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I am also a league secretary. GD (or anything else related to goals) cannot be used to separate teams on the same points in any youth football leagues. You can use GD in cup qualifying groups if it says you can in the league rules. This has been the case for the last 5 years off the top of my head.
 
James P said:
No league tables at this age group, it isn’t competitive. Subbing off a player means one less kid is playing rather than one more kid playing when allowing an extra person on the pitch
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U11s are allowed to play three 'trophy events' per season. These can be in Champions League style format with qualifying groups etc, so effectively there are league tables.
 
Anubis said:
Affiliated clubs with an affiliated referee playing an unaffiated game....perfectly legal here. Of course regional varuations apply.
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Anubis said:
Affiliated clubs with an affiliated referee playing an unaffiated game....perfectly legal here. Of course regional varuations apply.
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I said Unaffiliated teams playing a game. There is no problem if the teams are both affiliated even if the game hasn't been organised by a competition. The issue is that unaffiliated teams haven't signed up to the FA's rules so the FA have no authority over them. As you say, if both teams are affiliated then affiliated referees can take the match even if it is a friendly.
 
Mugsey said:
I said Unaffiliated teams playing a game. There is no problem if the teams are both affiliated even if the game hasn't been organised by a competition. The issue is that unaffiliated teams haven't signed up to the FA's rules so the FA have no authority over them. As you say, if both teams are affiliated then affiliated referees can take the match even if it is a friendly.
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correct. Hopefully I made no prior reference to unaffliated teams.
 
I am involved in a league where in the mini soccer games(no league tables) if a team goes a certain number of goals behind,2 or 4 as I cant remember clearly,then the losing team can add a player until they get back to one behind or similar.
 
RefJef said:
Me, I’m allowing this (both the U11 & U13 girls scenario)

At this age and level, its all about participation. Do this, and the youngsters will enjoy themselves more, and learn more. Don’t do this, and someone from the losing side may well not bother next week as they’ve had a miserable experience and could be lost to the game forever.

As a bit of an Aside, when I first started, I was predominantly doing youth (U15 & U16) games. I remember having a number of conversations with managers, club secretaries and the league, suggesting that goal diffference not be used to decide league position. One club, very well run (and I am pleased to say, went on to win the league) would always rotate their better players off once the scoreline was running away in their favour. Some of their rivals would try and rack up a cricket score when playing the weaker teams in the league as they wanted to improve their goal difference, leading to some worthless encounters that benefited no-one.
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I thought part of refereeing was applying the competition rules fairly. Surely you can't make it up as you go along can you?
 
SpecsSaver66 said:
I am involved in a league where in the mini soccer games(no league tables) if a team goes a certain number of goals behind,2 or 4 as I cant remember clearly,then the losing team can add a player until they get back to one behind or similar.
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Yes,its Power Play as mentioned above. I did not know about adding a second player if a team goes 6 goals behind though,thanks to the OP for that info. I personally think that 4 goals behind is too many and feel that the ship has already sailed regarding a competitive game and while it is a good idea I believe reducing it to two would be better. These age groups have no league tables so it shouldnt matter too much,imo.
 
SpecsSaver66 said:
Yes,its Power Play as mentioned above. I did not know about adding a second player if a team goes 6 goals behind though,thanks to the OP for that info. I personally think that 4 goals behind is too many and feel that the ship has already sailed regarding a competitive game and while it is a good idea I believe reducing it to two would be better. These age groups have no league tables so it shouldnt matter too much,imo.
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They can have league tables if it is part of a cup competition. GD can also be used if the league rules include a provision for that.
 
Mugsey said:
They can have league tables if it is part of a cup competition. GD can also be used if the league rules include a provision for that.
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Yeah,I am aware of the 'tournament' or 'festival' tables aspect too. I actually think there should be plenty of those types of games rather than these constant 'friendlies' but many areas,my own particularly,just dont have the facilities to do them. Mind you,there are still plenty of 'coaches' who think their lives depend on the outcome of an Under 8's game!
 
SpecsSaver66 said:
Yeah,I am aware of the 'tournament' or 'festival' tables aspect too. I actually think there should be plenty of those types of games rather than these constant 'friendlies' but many areas,my own particularly,just dont have the facilities to do them. Mind you,there are still plenty of 'coaches' who think their lives depend on the outcome of an Under 8's game!
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True about some overly competitive adults, but I think the FA have overdone it with the Youth Development Review. Ill thought through.
 
Mugsey said:
True about some overly competitive adults, but I think the FA have overdone it with the Youth Development Review. Ill thought through.
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I havent read that review but I've never had much faith in the English FA,from a coaching or refereeing standpoint.
 
Here in mini footy youth tournaments, at e.g. 5-0 the winning team removes a player.

Makes more sense to me. Easier for a less skilled team to play with more space.
 
santa sangria said:
Here in mini footy youth tournaments, at e.g. 5-0 the winning team removes a player.

Makes more sense to me. Easier for a less skilled team to play with more space.
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In my opinion 5-0 is too far gone to make much difference. As a referee as well as a watcher I'd want it to be more competitive so 2 or 3 goals maximum. I really enjoy reffing competitive games as its much more fun for all concerned.
 
SpecsSaver66 said:
In my opinion 5-0 is too far gone to make much difference. As a referee as well as a watcher I'd want it to be more competitive so 2 or 3 goals maximum. I really enjoy reffing competitive games as its much more fun for all concerned.
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For 8 year olds it can breathe some life into the next 20 minutes and prevent ”tools down” or tears. It’s the problem at that age where they don’t really want to stream the teams by ability so it’s a fudge.
 
SpecsSaver66 said:
Thanks. I will take a look and roll my eyes while shaking my head,no doubt.
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Some of it is excellent, to be fair, but the excellent bits are mixed in with the well intentioned rubbish. The powerplay isn't mentioned in the YDR, that came later: https://www.teamgrassroots.co.uk/fa...o-add-an-extra-player-when-losing-by-4-goals/

No one is sure whether it can only be applied to mini soccer (5v5, 6v6 and 7v7) or all youth football. More importantly, whether it can be applied to competitive football or whether it is just to be used for what the FA calls development games (friendlies).

Personally, as a league secretary as well as a referee, I think they should just have banned competitive football altogether until players were secondary school age (u12s+). Would ahve been a lot easier to organise.
 
Mugsey said:
Some of it is excellent, to be fair, but the excellent bits are mixed in with the well intentioned rubbish. The powerplay isn't mentioned in the YDR, that came later: https://www.teamgrassroots.co.uk/fa...o-add-an-extra-player-when-losing-by-4-goals/

No one is sure whether it can only be applied to mini soccer (5v5, 6v6 and 7v7) or all youth football. More importantly, whether it can be applied to competitive football or whether it is just to be used for what the FA calls development games (friendlies).

Personally, as a league secretary as well as a referee, I think they should just have banned competitive football altogether until players were secondary school age (u12s+). Would ahve been a lot easier to organise.
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Its not supposed to be 'competitive' anyway. But you put two teams together and get some sort of referee of facilitator and competition is natural. Kids need to play and they deserve to,and they especially want a referee as it gives the impression legitimacy to them.
 
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