The Ref Stop

Offside - deliberately playing the ball

The Ref Stop
I guess it would be different if he tried to kick the ball as opposed to the above block.
 
RobOda said:
I guess it would be different if he tried to kick the ball as opposed to the above block.
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No, I don't think so. A block is not a deflection. A block however can be a save but the ball needs to be heading towards goal or close to the goal.

I can't see the video in this case... But all the descriptions make it sound like a deliberate block of a pass... What is going on here?
 
I’m old school, if your off you’re off, these Law bits throw mass confusion into football. No need really!
For me, on this, he’s off, it’s a deflection...
 
santa sangria said:
But all the descriptions make it sound like a deliberate block of a pass... What is going on here?
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He sort of lunges, plants his foot into the ground and blocks the ball, yeah. No where near the goal though, it's in the 'D', and he ends up turning the ball into the box for the offside striker to score from.

I think the wording needs clarification though, I think it would be odd to have say, a cross coming in from out wide, with a player miles offside, only to be considered onside because a defender attempted to block the cross, which would be a 'deliberate play' by the IFAB glossary definitions. That can't be the intention of the Law surely?
 
Just a thought ...

Had the forward not been in that position should the goalkeeper have been allowed to pick up the ball following the defender's intervention?
 
Our last Deliberate play Vs deflection thread went well over four pages. I wonder how long this one would go for.

Oh and the OP is a deflection. For me it was more of a reaction rather than an action.

OIREF! said:
Had the forward not been in that position should the goalkeeper have been allowed to pick up the ball following the defender's intervention?
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Yes. Even if it was a deliberate kick, it wouldn't have been a deliberate kick to the goalkeeper.
 
Going to stick my neck out a bit here, but I have trouble classifying this as a deflection. There's a good second or so and the defender consciously sticks his leg out to try and prevent the ball going to the attacker. Surely the deliberate act of sticking your leg out, as well as the distance and time between the ball is enough that it is a deliberate play? Would appreciate some clarification as this is one area that admittedly gets me every time.
 
The ‘clarifications’ were brought in partly to stop defenders getting away with poor plays. In this instance could he have been reasonably expected to do much better?
 
Since when have expectations of doing better being a factor? How can the general laws reflect ability or inability? That’s a minefield of refereeing uncertainty!

A manager expects a player to score from 12 yards. The reality and the expectation are usually different!
 
Sorry but this is the same as the Lovren incident. This is not a deflection or a save. He deliberately stretches to play/block/intercept the ball. Doesn't matter how instinctive this was. He reacted to the pass and deliberately played the ball. It's not offside. IMHO of course.
 
Sheffields Finest said:
Since when have expectations of doing better being a factor? How can the general laws reflect ability or inability? That’s a minefield of refereeing uncertainty!

A manager expects a player to score from 12 yards. The reality and the expectation are usually different!
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He’s clearly attempted to deliberately play the ball, but has ended up misplaying it.
Whether he had the oppurtunity to make a better play on the ball or just simply messed up surely helps you decide whether it was a deliberate play that resets offside.
 
God the offside law has gotten stupid these days. Law 11 more than anything else makes me glad I don't have to referee and try to apply ludicrous notions of whether the defence has reset offside based on some very vague guidelines from an out of touch organisation.

He's made a deliberate motion towards the ball, I always took that to be a play. So if this isn't a play then I have nfi what is anymore. Attempted kick or attempted block, I don't see the difference to be relevant.
 
On the one hand, reading Law 11 smoothly liquidizes the brain into blancmange. However, if one can live with the absence of properly defined terms and meandering drivel, the content somewhat agrees with common sense. Replace the word play with pass and the first offside is an offence because the only pass was from a teammate and the offender gained a ridiculous advantage from being in an offside position despite the opponent's block. The second incident is less clear because it's hard to see who plays/passes the ball, but on the assumption that the defender plays the ball backwards and it deflects off the attacker, the receiving player is not penalized because the ball was not passed to him by a teammate
 
Big Cat said:
On the one hand, reading Law 11 smoothly liquidizes the brain into blancmange. However, if one can live with the absence of properly defined terms and meandering drivel, the content somewhat agrees with common sense. Replace the word play with pass and the first offside is an offence because the only pass was from a teammate and the offender gained a ridiculous advantage from being in an offside position despite the opponent's block. The second incident is less clear because it's hard to see who plays/passes the ball, but on the assumption that the defender plays the ball backwards and it deflects off the attacker, the receiving player is not penalized because the ball was not passed to him by a teammate
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If it touches the attacking player in any way its offside providing an offence has been committed as per law 11.
"A player in an offside position at the moment the ball is played or touched by
a team-mate"
Doesnt matter if it was passed from a team mate. The deliberate play only applies to a defender.

Fwiw I think it should be offside here. Its an instinctive movement as opposed to a deliberately thought out play of the ball.. he has just reacted.it would help if the law were simplified to ensure the only interpretation was offside. Currently I feel it can be interpreted either way.
 
JamesL said:
Fwiw I think it should be offside here. Its an instinctive movement as opposed to a deliberately thought out play of the ball.. he has just reacted.it would help if the law were simplified to ensure the only interpretation was offside. Currently I feel it can be interpreted either way.
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Where does it say "instinctive" in the laws? Where does it say "thought out"? Do footballers think? You have some research on this?

He stuck his leg out to kick a football!!! It doesn't get more deliberate than that!!!
 
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