The Ref Stop

OFFINABUS

JBeil said:
Just to clarify, does the use of offensive, insulting or abusing language towards anyone on the pitch count? If a player calls someone in the crowd a lady's part, or calls someone from the opposing team an effing so-and-so, do I still have to show a red card? Does it have to be an instant red, or can we use our judgement?
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It applies to everyone, yes....but that doesn't mean you apply the same standard as you would to a player speaking to yourself.

Mouthing off at an opponent - well, bear in mind that you have players who are kicking each other, grabbing, shoving each other off the ball (and I'm talking about what's tolerable within the laws - let alone fouls!)....it's going to raise a response. Something happens, somebody says something, usually that's it. I've never even considered carding for a playing calling another a 'f*****g d***head' or anything like that (now bear in mind we all need to look at what level of comment is generally accepted where we are - in Aus we my have a different tolerance level) and nobody has ever asked for the card - I might have a comment of 'that's enough, play the game' or pull them aside to clam them down.

But even then there's a line. I once sent off a youth player for telling an opponent "I'll f*** you up you f****t" (now, this was some 15 years ago when the pushback on homophobic slurs hadn't really started yet). I sent him off. He responded with "I was talking to one of my defenders!" I responded with "so?" - combination of the threat and insult crossed the line.

As for abusing a spectator.....I'd probably implement a somewhat tougher line, but you can try to have sympathy - especially if the spectator has started it (which is usually the case here). Usually I've had a quiet word with a player along the lines of "Hey mate, if I have to ignore the idiots on the sideline, you need to as well". I really hate publicly pulling up a player for making a comment to a spectator over something the spectator started - if I do that, then the entire crowd on that side is likely to spend the rest of the game trying to make that player get himself sent off, so I figure it's just going to make it worse. Having said that, I've never had something that's completely crossed the line either. And if I felt the outburst was well over the top I would card if required.
 
The Ref Stop
I agree with the above that tolerance for player-to-player language is very different for player-to-ref.

Context is everything.

Last week I gave a YC who was annoyed at a foul and called the offending player a "monkey". Sounds harmless and not worth a second thought, let alone a YC. But, here, monkey is used a racial slur, everyone knows this. But in this case, there was no racial question... so what to do? I have previously sent someone off for using monkey as a racial slur (in my opinion, obviously). Last week I felt I had to act. What if the player had addressed a different player or says the same next week... I felt YC was the best compromise. I almost apologised to the player, gave the YC, made the chirping hand signal for anyone who couldn't hear (normally used to highlight dissent, I know), no fuss, move on.
 
Given the responses, majority of which seem perfectly valid, it really does read like YHTBT and use your common sense, experience, feeling for the game, read the tempo of the game, all that, at the time.
Probably wise to go into games not looking (or listening) for any problems, but, if they are presented to you on a plate, deal with them in the way you best see fit at the time.
 
I don't think I ever had any games in without Industrial language, just turn snowflakes mode off on your hearing aids and only really respond to the most serious ones, especially, but not explicitly the ones aimed at you!!! Most of the rest are either banter, mild dissing and instant rage, or just disappointment....Its life.....
 
It does vary from situation to situation. I remember semi pro game I had where game was fiery, and, combative midfielder was getting run around from, lets say, a kid, struggling to get near him etc...about 30 mins i, he has had enough, stops him mid flight, split between yellow and warning, he stands over him and points menacingly at him "I will snap your f-ing legs you wee pxxxx"
Am sorry but am not taking risks with that, the threat was clear, what kind of person, far less ref would I be if 10 mins later the same kid is taken to hospital with 2 broken legs?
Some would say, give the yellow for the foul and leave him in no uncertain terms that you are aware of his intentions and will be watching closely.
Me on that day, I was like, off, see ya.
The player has given me a decision to make, and, I have made it. Up for debate? yes. My call at the time? yes

Perversely, the same kind of act, at a top flight game, I be more inclined to yellow for the foul and warn that am watching.

Same situation, different environment.

You can only deal with what's in front of you at the time



few weeks back I posted on here, 2-1 down, 5 to go, striker breaks into the box, tackled fairly, corner, he appeals for pen (understandable), but. I had got myself into a great position, made my call, and was ready for some kind of appeal. What he did next after his, pen appeal, was shout "f off you f ing joke" as he throw ball into air then punched it out towards the corner flag. I would have accepted the "f-off" but, not the combination of it all, along with the actions. so, red card.

Its hard to write a self guide on this subject.
 
Used to love an 80 yard trot to shove one up a gobby keepers nose, they thought they were immune so far away!!
 
spuddy1878 said:
Was the player he called a monkey black or white ?
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In this case both players were caucasian - sorry for my poor phrasing - so I was sure it was not used as a racial slur - hence no RC. But I felt I had to act as it is such an incendiary word. YC for USB was an easy sell.
 
Whenever I hear the word Monkey, £500 comes into my head first, a lot of players use rhyming slang...
One clever player once said 'He's a Weigh Anchor', it obviously hid the real diss but I ain't sending him off for something he hasn't said!!! I just laughed!!!
 
Sheffields Finest said:
Whenever I hear the word Monkey, £500 comes into my head first, a lot of players use rhyming slang...
One clever player once said 'He's a Weigh Anchor', it obviously hid the real diss but I ain't sending him off for something he hasn't said!!! I just laughed!!!
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Yes and no. I grew up on rhyming slang, ancient, modern, established and invented (contrary to that I am way out of touch with Newcy slang etc.)...

I don’t buy the “hasn’t said it” logic. “You’re a right James Blunt”... you can let that go if you want but then you’ve just let someone off for calling you a c-bomb. ”You take it up the Gary Glitter”... the phrase makes no sense literally but the intended meaning obviously must lead to OFFINABUS RC.

Again, context. And I have a very high threshold for disgusting language in everyday life... but you shouldn’t let OFFINABUS go just because someone amuses you.
 
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There is an easy reply to, you take it up the gary glitter.....
You hit back with "yes, I guess your wife/mum told you"...


And then run away
 
How would people deal with a player who said 'you're a bloody joke ref' and when you explained why you were cautioning him (25 years ago) for saying you're a bloody joke ref, he replied, 'well you are'. Would you give a second yellow?
 
I cautioned a player who repeated and agreed with what a player was getting cautioned for!!!

Player One should something like 'thats a f'kin joke decision, you've given us fuc all today'..... As I called him over to caution him his nosey mate asks him what he'd said, to which he repeats it all verbatim and then says, 'well, he's right and you have given us fuc all'....... Cue double yellow!!!
 
Viking said:
How would people deal with a player who said 'you're a bloody joke ref' and when you explained why you were cautioning him (25 years ago) for saying you're a bloody joke ref, he replied, 'well you are'. Would you give a second yellow?
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More no than yes....like most of the offensive things you have to be there at that moment....
A caution is a control tool, a management instrument, and, if you have respectfully called the player in, and dealt with it calmly, not rushed, and you are communicating with him at the time, then, if you handle it properly, you should negate the chances of this happening
Number 6, come here please.....meet half way point....slowly, calmly, "please settle down, I understand why you are frustrated but it stop and it has to stop now, you cant talk to me like that so its a yellow card, your team need you on the pitch so please be careful"

You would not say you are cautioning for what they said, the caution is for, dissent. If you deliver your message effectively then there should be no comeback from the player.
 
When I think back, I've said things as innocent as "never ref" and got booked and on very rare occasions during my much younger days I've told refs that their decision was "a f****** joke" and not even got a talking to.

What I have taken into my reffing is that when people give you stick, it's highly likely that once they get home they probably feel rather guilty and slightly pathetic about giving the ref so much stick. I certainly did and I know alot of my team mates felt the same when you spoke to them once the ref had left the bar after the game. When you get home and think about the game, you always knew that you deserved a yellow for dissent, even though you argued the case at the time.

This has lead to me always being strong on dissent because I know I'll get more respect from players and less dissent in the long run. Very few people actually believe that giving the ref abuse is ok (even if during the game they don't show it!), and afterwards they'll always be accepting and respectful of the decision you made. Let dissent go constantly and you're seen as a soft touch I can assure you.
 
Having just retaken the course after 22 years of non reffing, I do remember being taught to explain what the caution was for, hence the comment ' well you are'. He got a second yellow from me on the day anyway and everyone was nice after that. Nowadays I'd just state dissent and we probably wouldn't have the second yellow.
 
I remember one game where I knew the home CH away from football and I’d reffed him and cautioned him a few times too. He knew what I was like and warned his team mates and even the opposition.

His LB was quite chirpy and quickly fell into the saying too much at volume routine which he was notorious for. I gave him a few chats before finally carding him and eventually dismissing him in the second half.

No qualms after but talking to my friend later he was banging on at him to shut it all game as he knew the consequences. Silly LB just didn’t listen, complete serial offender, cards didn’t change him!
 
Sheffields Finest said:
I remember one game where I knew the home CH away from football and I’d reffed him and cautioned him a few times too. He knew what I was like and warned his team mates and even the opposition.

His LB was quite chirpy and quickly fell into the saying too much at volume routine which he was notorious for. I gave him a few chats before finally carding him and eventually dismissing him in the second half.

No qualms after but talking to my friend later he was banging on at him to shut it all game as he knew the consequences. Silly LB just didn’t listen, complete serial offender, cards didn’t change him!
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There are some players who just can't control themselves on a pitch and they'll always be that way. The majority are just desperate to win and go too far sometimes. They'll not admit this during the game and sometimes even afterwards of course whilst emotions are high but as soon as you get a bit of time to yourself you're often a bit embarrassed. Most people are like that imo. No intention of being an arse, things just happen in the game which trigger some poor behaviour and your embarrassed later on.

Like the player that is always abusing the ref. Verubfew will say anything to him at the time but rest assured, After the game in private everyone, including his own team mates think it's embarrassing
 
I had one player manager on my FB for quite a few years, he'd put lovely pictures of his new child growing up and his wedding, all fantastic family stuff and I reffed his retirement game as a player. It was a complete ****womble, 2 questionable tackles, verbals towards other players and even me. I carded him, should have sent him off in hindsight, (that would have been one for his kids to learn about)... After the game he was lovely but I got home and binned him on FB, two faced ****. Saw him a year later as he stopped being the manager and I totally blanked him... this elephant doesn't forget!!! I'm not false!! You get what you see!!!
 
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