The Ref Stop

Minute of silence before a game

If a team requested a minute's silence for something like a player, chairman or whatnot passing away that's one thing.
Having a minute's silence for some kind of awareness week, okay bit OTT but no problem.

However, I remember a manager in Sheffield approaching me the weekend after Gary Speed killed himself.
"Are we having a minute's silence for Gary Speed ref?"
"Er, I wasn't planning on unless you particuarly wanted one"
"No that's fine, thanks ref"
:confused:
 
The Ref Stop
CapnBloodbeard said:
This is genuinely the only post that this thread needs.
As a referee, don't stand there and judge the reasoning on it. If it's important to one team, respect that.
You might think it's silly that a team in Colorado, USA wants to hold a minute silence for Manchester, but there may be a personal connection you don't know about.

Who cares if it's becoming more prolific? Don't even consider refusing it. And don't ask the other team - heck, if the other team had the 'right' to deny that minute silence than that could be a great way to get under that team's skin before the game!
Tell them it's happening and just do it.
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Sorry, totally disagree. The other team may (unlikely) have a total objection to doing it for a very valid reason and if you plough straight in with the "we're doing it" you do have potential to set yourself up for a fall.

Simply doing a quick "hi guys, team A wants to do a minutes silence for <insert reason here>, I've got no objection, so just checking you guys are fine too, we'll line up a minute earlier, ok?"

That way you are not judging the reason, more the mechanics of getting the game started on time.
 
This is a interesting thread but I Was wondering what to do if for some strange reason a Team refused to do a silence for a league sanctioned thing what would you do as a referee at the time. Obviously a report would be made due to it being league sanctioned but if one team was complying and the other wasn't things could get messy.
 
MKAhmad said:
This is a interesting thread but I Was wondering what to do if for some strange reason a Team refused to do a silence for a league sanctioned thing what would you do as a referee at the time. Obviously a report would be made due to it being league sanctioned but if one team was complying and the other wasn't things could get messy.
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For an officially sanctioned minute's silence such as for Remembrance Sunday, in the event of any team refusing to comply my presumption is that the match would have to be be abandoned pre-kick-off, since on that particular day the minute's silence is as much a part of the prerequisites as goal nets, equipment checks and so forth.
On the other hand, given an unofficial proposition of a period of silence (which I have never myself been solicited to oversee), the spirit of the game would dictate not only that such a silence should proceed if (in all probability) a consensus could be reached, but also that the match should start without the silence if one team or an official had a personal/political objection. Without a consensus, the burden lies upon the team/persons who propose the silence to have it sanctioned, and in the event of a refusal to play, a match would surely have to be abandoned (and reported) on those grounds.
 
SLI39 said:
For an officially sanctioned minute's silence such as for Remembrance Sunday, in the event of any team refusing to comply my presumption is that the match would have to be be abandoned pre-kick-off, since on that particular day the minute's silence is as much a part of the prerequisites as goal nets, equipment checks and so forth.
On the other hand, given an unofficial proposition of a period of silence (which I have never myself been solicited to oversee), the spirit of the game would dictate not only that such a silence should proceed if (in all probability) a consensus could be reached, but also that the match should start without the silence if one team or an official had a personal/political objection. Without a consensus, the burden lies upon the team/persons who propose the silence to have it sanctioned, and in the event of a refusal to play, a match would surely have to be abandoned (and reported) on those grounds.
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Not sure I would go as far as abandon (definitely not for no nets seeing as these arent required by law to start a game and the "spirit of the game" introduced this year would probably dictate you continue and play the game anyway like no corner flags which are required.)
Think I would I'd be inclined to tell the club that the league has asked for it. That you will be holding a moments silence along with the opposition and they can choose whether or not they are going to take part with failure to do so being reported to the league to deal with as they were the ones that asked for it to be completed.
 
James Long said:
Not sure I would go as far as abandon (definitely not for no nets seeing as these arent required by law to start a game and the "spirit of the game" introduced this year would probably dictate you continue and play the game anyway like no corner flags which are required.)
Think I would I'd be inclined to tell the club that the league has asked for it. That you will be holding a moments silence along with the opposition and they can choose whether or not they are going to take part with failure to do so being reported to the league to deal with as they were the ones that asked for it to be completed.
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Ok, the goal nets were a bad comparison, but I think for a match of any significant profile to start with such a lack of accord, not mentioning any spectators who might report you for failing to observe a sanctioned period of silence, would make life difficult for the referee. That's why I leant towards abandonment in the first example. Indeed, what aspects of law might such a team refuse to comply with later if you acquiesce to them rather than upholding an official directive?
 
SLI39 said:
Indeed, what aspects of law might such a team refuse to comply with later if you acquiesce to them rather than upholding an official directive?
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I would uphold the directive. The directive would be to hold a minutes silence. Not ensure that people take part. That is their perogative. But they would be left in no doubt that they will later be reported after which the league can sanction as they see fit.
You cant force a team to take part much in the way you cant stop a player committing a cautionable offence. Its all reported to the relevant authorities afterwards and they dish out the neccesary punishments.
 
I have enjoyed this debate, even if it is a fairly unlikely scenario all things considered.
A team of course has a prerogative to refuse an official directive, but that prerogative may not extend to starting the game without the period of silence. I understand your logc here, however, and you would need to know exactly how the league/FA had intended this directive be put in place. I suppose further points concern whether it is sensible to begin a match where one of the teams is so violently opposed to the directive, what is the fallout for a referee who proceeds against the directive, and whether the teams are prepared to play 90 minutes that might be rendered invalid anyway.
 
SLI39 said:
I have enjoyed this debate, even if it is a fairly unlikely scenario all things considered.
A team of course has a prerogative to refuse an official directive, but that prerogative may not extend to starting the game without the period of silence. I understand your logc here, however, and you would need to know exactly how the league/FA had intended this directive be put in place. I suppose further points concern whether it is sensible to begin a match where one of the teams is so violently opposed to the directive, what is the fallout for a referee who proceeds against the directive, and whether the teams are prepared to play 90 minutes that might be rendered invalid anyway.
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A sensible idea might be to put a call in to league sec and ask how they want you to proceed. I dont think there is a wrong and right answer to this unlikely scenario. So long as you justify your actions and dont do anything the compromises yourself.
 
SLI39 said:
For an officially sanctioned minute's silence such as for Remembrance Sunday, in the event of any team refusing to comply my presumption is that the match would have to be be abandoned pre-kick-off, since on that particular day the minute's silence is as much a part of the prerequisites as goal nets, equipment checks and so forth.
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No, not at all, and if the game was abandoned (it would actually be postponed as it never started) any CFA commission would have no option but to order the game to be replayed with no action taken against either team. As a referee you would also be compelled to attend that commission and would likely to get a hard time for taking an approach that has absolutely no grounds under either the laws of the game or the competition rules.

Don't make problems for yourselves. If a team refuses to take part in a minute's silence you cannot force them to, and if they won't you just have it without them and then report this to the league.
 
RustyRef said:
Don't make problems for yourselves. If a team refuses to take part in a minute's silence you cannot force them to, and if they won't you just have it without them and then report this to the league.
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I really can't imagine how others can believe such a situation would happen. If it does, however, just ask the team refusing to take part in the minute's silence to be quiet while the rest of you are observing it!!!
 
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I've never had a team or players refuse to take part in a minutes silence. However, I do speak to the coaches before hand and ask that if they have any players who do not wish to take part that they stand at the side of the pitch, quietly, and respect the fact that others wish to observe the silence.

Whether we like or not there are people who will refuse to observe silences, whether or political, or ideological grounds, and as we live in a free country I would never dream of enforcing my views on others.

An example would be someone who plays on my other halfs team, she doesn't do any silences, so waits at the side of the pitch until it's finished.

I've never had any problem with this approach, and the only time I would consider taking action against a player or team who didn't want to take part is if they were shouting abuse, making fun of the people observing it etc, but this has never happened in one of my games.
 
zarathustra said:
An example would be someone who plays on my other halfs team, she doesn't do any silences, so waits at the side of the pitch until it's finished.
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This gobsmacks me. OK, there may be the very rare occasion where you strongly disagree with someone's beliefs or what they represent, and so if a minutes silence is held in their honour you don't want to partake, but I've never known anyone who hasn't wanted to take part. You have "national" silences, e.g. Remembrance Sunday, and you have local silences, e.g. club chairman passed away or similar (and not taking part in those is, for me, an active sign of disrespect to the club asking for it). Wanting to sit out all silences would mark that player out to me, and I'd be prepared for them to be awkward and have an attitude of self-entitlement during the game.
 
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xPositor said:
This gobsmacks me. OK, there may be the very rare occasion where you strongly disagree with someone's beliefs or what they represent, and so if a minutes silence is held in their honour you don't want to partake, but I've never known anyone who hasn't wanted to take part. You have "national" silences, e.g. Remembrance Sunday, and you have local silences, e.g. club chairman passed away or similar (and not taking part in those is, for me, an active sign of disrespect to the club asking for it). Wanting to sit out all silences would mark that player out to me, and I'd be prepared for them to be awkward and have an attitude of self-entitlement during the game.
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Far from it, I can't remember the exact reason why she chooses not to observe them, but she isn't awkward to referee and isn't self entitled.

I don't see why someone choosing not to observe a minutes silence as a problem, as long as they respect that other people do want to observe them.
 
Its an interesting concept as who is she going to talk to whilst every1 is observing the silence, so i suppose she is indirectly observing it...

A player with tourettes may not want to take part due to being unable to prevent tics... plenty of reasons around why legitimately, but not disrespectfully, people may not want to take part.
 
I had one in an U14s game in 2015.

Manager for the home team called me on the Tuesday to confirm all the match details etc. He then mentioned that they wanted to do a minute's silence before the match as it was the 2 year anniversary of their goalkeepers early death after collapsing outside school aged around 12 due to an undiagnosed heart condition.

I agreed and on matchday we asked the away manager if he was ok with it. He was.

It was observed impeccably by the players, most of whom were likely 13 years old.
 
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