Lemina Red Card

[santa sangria]

At least round my way we are taught to sanction a player - usually thd GK! - who runs 40-50 m to complain, join a melee or insight others.

For mass protests this “third player” approach is really good. It’s relatively straightforward, especially for an AR to spot at distance. Even without comms I can imagine putting this into practice with NARs down the pyramid. (TBH mass protests very rare here)

 

[bloovee]

Well I may have to change my mind, as Dias just got a caution for pretty much the same. He came a lot further and faster than Lemina, but as soon as he became the third Man City player on the scene Rob Jones pulled the yellow card out. Looks like they do have a new policy that three players constitutes mobbing and the third player cops the card.

So a new policy that no-one knows about?

You couldn't really call either incident "mobbing".

Caution the GK who runs to get involved in a mass confrontation is standard fare at amateur level, but compared to EPL referees reluctant to show an early yellow or a second yellow for an obvious YC offence this just seems desperately arbitrary.
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[RustyRef]

So a new policy that no-one knows about?

You couldn't really call either incident "mobbing".

Caution the GK who runs to get involved in a mass confrontation is standard fare at amateur level, but compared to EPL referees reluctant to show an early yellow or a second yellow for an obvious YC offence this just seems desperately arbitrary.
.

Dias ran quickly 40 metres to complain, and his complaint was demanding a caution for an opponent. I'd have had a yellow out for that at any level and I haven't been subject to any new PGMOL policy or directive, it wasn't a lot different to a keeper racing out to complain.

 

[JamesL]

Dias ran quickly 40 metres to complain, and his complaint was demanding a caution for an opponent. I'd have had a yellow out for that at any level and I haven't been subject to any new PGMOL policy or directive, it wasn't a lot different to a keeper racing out to complain.

Same.
Had both yesterday ,player running in asking for a yellow. I obliged, literally.
And oddly, I've been doing something similar on surrounding, but I normally hit the ring leader.
Imo you can't be surrounded by players without taking any action at all.

 

[Peter Grove]

Well I may have to change my mind, as Dias just got a caution for pretty much the same. He came a lot further and faster than Lemina, but as soon as he became the third Man City player on the scene Rob Jones pulled the yellow card out. Looks like they do have a new policy that three players constitutes mobbing and the third player cops the card.

If so, then I think it's a good move but I feel they should have clearly briefed all the EPL teams about it first so they knew what to expect.

Starting to do this all of a sudden with no prior notification (if that is indeed what's happened) seems to go against the "no surprises" principle. I'm not saying Dias & Lemina didn't deserve cautions but I think I'd rather see refereeing practices being used as a preventative than a punitive measure.

 

[Big Cat]

Although I'm all in favour of sorting out behaviour in football, I'm not keen on changing the rules of a competition half way through. Not drastically anyway. Especially when it probably won't last and will revert to type after a few weeks or so

 

[Ben448844]

Cautioning the third player to approach the referee is not a bad idea to clamp down on crowding the referee. Perhaps IFAB should write this into law? I would support such a law change; in fact, I would support making it a sending off offence - players will quickly learn.

Yes, learn to make sure only 2 players run at the ref.

 

[OnlyUseMeWhistle]

I believe he'd already had a word with Lemina but the main reason he goes for him and not the two closer players is that the two closer players were already quite close and didn't close up the distance. Lemina isn't even involved or close, he just runs over shouting and gesturing, the other two walk a few steps and are talking but not gesturing.

I can see why Lemina was singled out

 

[one]

We are looking at this in isolation and what can be seen on TV. I'm sure there is more context to it.
Had he not pulled the red out straight away we would have all thought he'd forgotten the first yellow. But he knew exactly what he was doing without loosing control of his emotions. Gillett is not a soft referee. If he pulls out a second yellow for dissent, it is deserved.

 

[zarathustra]

Although I'm all in favour of sorting out behaviour in football, I'm not keen on changing the rules of a competition half way through. Not drastically anyway. Especially when it probably won't last and will revert to type after a few weeks or so

But this isn’t a rule of the competition, it’s just a change of guidance for referees that has come from The FA/PGMOL.

I seriously doubt they did this without informing clubs, but I wonder whether clubs passed this onto their players, or if they did, whether the players were listening.

Only time will tell whether they keep it up, hopefully they will.

 

[bloovee]

I believe he'd already had a word with Lemina but the main reason he goes for him and not the two closer players is that the two closer players were already quite close and didn't close up the distance. Lemina isn't even involved or close, he just runs over shouting and gesturing, the other two walk a few steps and are talking but not gesturing.

I can see why Lemina was singled out

And I can see why Lemima acted as he did - he thought he'd been fouled earlier.

 

[bloovee]

But this isn’t a rule of the competition, it’s just a change of guidance for referees that has come from The FA/PGMOL.

I seriously doubt they did this without informing clubs, but I wonder whether clubs passed this onto their players, or if they did, whether the players were listening.

Only time will tell whether they keep it up, hopefully they will.

I'm not even convinced there's any such guidance.

I'll believe it when Bruno Fernandes gets booked.

 

[OnlyUseMeWhistle]

And I can see why Lemima acted as he did - he thought he'd been fouled earlier.

Okay and? If I think I’ve been hard done by it doesn’t entitle me to violate the laws of the game repeatedly

 

[RustyRef]

And I can see why Lemima acted as he did - he thought he'd been fouled earlier.

If you are on a yellow card already and show any kind of dissent someone must have replaced your brain with rocks. Doesn't matter how much you think you have been wronged, approaching the referee to complain when on a caution is crazy.

 

[CaptainsPlease]

There's no justification in law for treating a player differently just because they're the xth player on the scene showing dissent. Might be better than ignoring the issue but otherwise just seems like the latest way for PGMOL to avoid dealing with dissent properly.

 

[bloovee]

Okay and? If I think I’ve been hard done by it doesn’t entitle me to violate the laws of the game repeatedly

I'm not sure where repeatedly comes into it. And this is the EPL where all sorts of dissent gets ignored - repeatedly.

 

[Pmalinski83]

But does by making it the third player then not excuse player 1 and 2.
I'd say caution 1 and 2 and player 3 4 and 5 walk. That would be fun.

I would strongly disagree with cautioning the first. What that would achieve is banning any appeals against decisions.

 

[OnlyUseMeWhistle]

I'm not sure where repeatedly comes into it. And this is the EPL where all sorts of dissent gets ignored - repeatedly.

Stepped approach and two wrongs wouldn’t make a right. Him getting a card is right.

 

[Murri O]

Go the Aussie.

 

[PinnerPaul]

And I can see why Lemima acted as he did - he thought he'd been fouled earlier.

Oh so that's all right then?

Had one last night, player thought his teammate had been fouled a few seconds earlier, so decided to take out an oppo player - easy yellow - or not in your view as it was 'justified'?!