I found him... LWR!!

[RustyRef]

Was just about to suggest the same thing. Just do an online, open book quiz which needs to be completed before registration is accepted. Target it at the changes and hey presto.

Yes, agree. Very straight forward to do and the FA already have the technology as they use it for online safeguarding children recertification.

All it needs is a 30 minute mandatory online course covering the law changes. Has to be annual though, or at least biannual, as the law changes are coming thick and fast these days.

 

[Sheffields Finest]

It could be like VAR, no screens and some random bloke on an industrial estate sealing your fate randomly!!

 

[deusex]

This race to the bottom attitude where all games must be covered by anyone who owns a black shirt is why we're generally perceived by players as a bunch of clueless wallies!
Would you all accept no minimum standard in your nurses and policemen just to get more out there?

 

[Ben448844]

This race to the bottom attitude where all games must be covered by anyone who owns a black shirt is why we're generally perceived by players as a bunch of clueless wallies!
Would you all accept no minimum standard in your nurses and policemen just to get more out their?

I disagree completely. Comparing it to actual important roles in society like nurses is ridiculous. Refereeing for most is a hobby, just as playing is a hobby. The lowest level of football does not need all referees to be completely up to date with all the law changes. Of course we would all like referees to be up to speed, but let's not forget the many referees, often pensioners at the lowest level of football, who are serving the game and are doing it for a hobby. They many be centre circle refs who aren't fully versed in all the law changes, but they're experienced referees who are needed to get games on and who do a good job. They're appreciated by park level teams I can assure you and are not considered clueless wallies!

The game is more important than the referee. We are here to facilitate football, even at the very lowest level.

Perhaps if IFAB didn't rewrite the LOTG every year, it would be easier for referees outside of promotion schemes, and who don't have access to SKY or BT Sports to view the new laws in action, to keep up.

 

[Viking]

This race to the bottom attitude where all games must be covered by anyone who owns a black shirt is why we're generally perceived by players as a bunch of clueless wallies!
Would you all accept no minimum standard in your nurses and policemen just to get more out their?

Absolutely. For me, a black shirt and badge means something, i.e. you have gone through a course and have knowledge of the LOTG. It's something to be proud of. A bit like a professional qualification - a standard has been met. The same can be said of a coaching badge, although some of these coaches missed the part of the course which says to not have a go at youth refs.

We should be elevating the status of referees, not letting anyone who took a test 10 years ago to run around under the guise of being a qualified referee. If a game doesn't have a ref, it's managed by a coach in a training top and the teams understand there may be wrong calls. Qualified refs with a badge should be a cut above the training top brigade and recognised as such.

 

[Kes]

If any of my peers were to find out I'd just been refereeing matches as per the LOTG from years gone by, I'd be embarrassed beyond words. (That's not a confession BTW ) Sooner or later, somebody is going to appeal a decision that you made which was wrong in law and you're going to look a complete chump.

What bothers me most is that a lot of these old farts who think "my way is best" must then go on to become Observers.

 

[Brian Hamilton]

I'd say just an exam every 10 years would suffice.
I honestly wouldn't miss the old school refs that would pack it in as a result.
If you have too few refs, you're not paying enough or you don't look after your refs. So rectify one of those!
I suspect the FA just want these refs to carry on doing the job, taking tha abuse, not cautioning for dissent, not sending in cautions as it easier than trying to keep good refs

How would you suggest you "look after your refs"? I am asking for a friend.

My friend gets phone calls on Saturday morning from referees crying off who are "a bit under the weather" but had hoped it would clear up on Tuesday but it didn't and has got worse. He also gets ranting emails from referees who won't go to a particular ground because they had a disagreement with a former player, whose report they sent in and he said a nasty thing in the pub to him the following week and this happened 5-10 YEARS AGO. He gets emails from referees giving backword on a Friday lunchtime to games they accepted on Wednesday lunchtime which was someone else's back word. He also gets threatening emails from referees who want him to pay mileage if they go to a particular ground despite the league introducing all inclusive fees because his friend was shouting his mouth off about the mileage claim he put in which meant he got paid more than the referee. My friend also offers a shoulder to cry on after a tough game, proof reads misconduct reports to make sure they stick, arranges appointments around referee social lives (going out in so and so that night, can I have a game in that town), argues their case with observers, finds referees when the local FA appointment officer can't persuade enough L4 referees to turn out to cover the local Supply League, sends their marks in every month so they get promoted, negotiates with observer coordinators so promotion candidates get a decent challenge when they are watched AND manages to send all his spare referees to support County competitions when they can't appoint referees themselves.

My friend awaits your help in looking after his referees, for whom he negotiated the first fee increase for 5 years last season and will be pushing for another this season...

 

[Kes]

How would you suggest you "look after your refs"? I am asking for a friend.

My friend gets phone calls on Saturday morning from referees crying off who are "a bit under the weather" but had hoped it would clear up on Tuesday but it didn't and has got worse. He also gets ranting emails from referees who won't go to a particular ground because they had a disagreement with a former player, whose report they sent in and he said a nasty thing in the pub to him the following week and this happened 5-10 YEARS AGO. He gets emails from referees giving backword on a Friday lunchtime to games they accepted on Wednesday lunchtime which was someone else's back word. He also gets threatening emails from referees who want him to pay mileage if they go to a particular ground despite the league introducing all inclusive fees because his friend was shouting his mouth off about the mileage claim he put in which meant he got paid more than the referee. My friend also offers a shoulder to cry on after a tough game, proof reads misconduct reports to make sure they stick, arranges appointments around referee social lives (going out in so and so that night, can I have a game in that town), argues their case with observers, finds referees when the local FA appointment officer can't persuade enough L4 referees to turn out to cover the local Supply League, sends their marks in every month so they get promoted, negotiates with observer coordinators so promotion candidates get a decent challenge when they are watched AND manages to send all his spare referees to support County competitions when they can't appoint referees themselves.

My friend awaits your help in looking after his referees, for whom he negotiated the first fee increase for 5 years last season and will be pushing for another this season...

Worst "I actually do look after my refs" post ever ....

 

[socal lurker]

There's a vicious circle problem to get there, but I wonder if the ref shortage would actually be helped by using three referees more. (I've always been surprised at how much is done solo across the pond.) Among the reasons that I enjoy reffing is the teamwork on the field, and the camaraderie that goes with that. And that team means when things go south, there is a group to deal with it (and commiserate afterwards). There's a lot else I like about reffing, but I don't know that I'd still be active with it if I was doing games solo.

(For context, I reffed and got paid as a kid. I now ref only in AYSO, the largest youth soccer organization in the US--and also the only organization under USSF auspices that is separately authorized to train and certify refs. All the refs in AYSO are volunteers. Teams have to convince a couple of people to volunteer. Starting at 10U, we use full referee teams of three. Absolutely overkill for a 10U game, but it eases newbies into the rolls. By 16U and 19U, we have a collection of volunteers, a lot of the refs who caught the bug and kept at it are those who were coerced into reffing in the first place, but keep doing it--again, as volunteers--because the got interested having been eased into it. And many have also gone on to referee in other structures where they get paid. (As a further aside, I have heard from many parents with kids playing both AYSO and club soccer (where referees are paid) that the referees are consistently better in AYSO--though I'm sure that varies with geography.))

 

[Ben448844]

As a player at the end of my time, I was playing with my mates in the dog and duck league's. Most of the refs were over 60 and I can't remember in my 2 years playing in that league ever seeing a ref under 30. I can't imagine how that league would survive without those referees who don't see refereeing as anything other than a hobby. I appreciated them and I still do.

I myself have had 0 closed dates this season and i often take on extra games on a Sunday afternoon because of the referee shortage, even though I'm really not bothered about doing a third game that weekend. I try to help out those who are struggling to cover their league's because they helped me when I was first passed out and looking for matches.

The great game of football needs referees of all calibre, and I find the attitude towards refs that aren't as keen as those on here a bit distasteful

 

[Brian Hamilton]

Worst "I actually do look after my refs" post ever ....

I'll let my friend know

 

[RobOda]

I spent 10 minutes watching a local game on Saturday as I walked to Sainburys. The referee was stopping play whenever a goal kick didn't leave the penalty area, the players were telling him he was wrong but he wasn't having it. This kind of thing will continue to happen until there is mandatory training for referees every season.

How does this even happen though? I mean, surely he must watch some football at some point? I think a law change as big as that one surely can't be missed at this stage of the season?

 

[deusex]

My friend awaits your help in looking after his referees

I don't mean Ref Secs, jesus that is a thankless task.
My comment was aimed more at the FA handing out tiny bans for ref abuse.

Maybe my experiences recently have warped my view.
I've seen some really weak refs this season that have lets teams kick **** out of the oppositon, threaten the oppositon with violence several times and use discrimatory language. Games where the ref has never had a second of control of the match and it has just escelated.
Reports into county. Investigation now into it's 3rd month. None of it would have happened with even a competent ref.

I think some underestimate just how much a bad ref ruins a game of football if one of the teams are a nasty bunch.
Refereeing standards in my local Sunday league have plummeted in 10 years. We used to have some cracking refs on a Sunday. No idea where they've gone! Wasn't the abuse, they didn't take any cr*p!!

 

[Martiju]

The great game of football needs referees of all calibre

This is true and both players and referees operate at different levels. Not officiating to the Laws of the Game goes beyond calibre though, it is the very essence of the role.

I don't officiate at high levels at all - nor do I go out enough, probably. I don't want to progress, because it's a hobby (that happens to pay a bit too, as a bonus). I wouldn't be able to referee at all if I didn't think I was even able to do the basics.

In fact, thinking about it, it's worse if you are a qualified referee who doesn't apply the Laws as the expectation is that you should. If you're getting some guy walking his dog to run around and blow a whistle there should be some tolerance, but otherwise a pretty low threshold of knowing the Laws shouldn't be too much to ask.

 

[Brian Hamilton]

I don't mean Ref Secs, jesus that is a thankless task.
My comment was aimed more at the FA handing out tiny bans for ref abuse.

Maybe my experiences recently have warped my view.
I've seen some really weak refs this season that have lets teams kick **** out of the oppositon, threaten the oppositon with violence several times and use discrimatory language. Games where the ref has never had a second of control of the match and it has just escelated.
Reports into county. Investigation now into it's 3rd month. None of it would have happened with even a competent ref.

I think some underestimate just how much a bad ref ruins a game of football if one of the teams are a nasty bunch.
Refereeing standards in my local Sunday league have plummeted in 10 years. We used to have some cracking refs on a Sunday. No idea where they've gone! Wasn't the abuse, they didn't take any cr*p!!

They got old

 

[zarathustra]

I disagree completely. Comparing it to actual important roles in society like nurses is ridiculous. Refereeing for most is a hobby, just as playing is a hobby. The lowest level of football does not need all referees to be completely up to date with all the law changes. Of course we would all like referees to be up to speed, but let's not forget the many referees, often pensioners at the lowest level of football, who are serving the game and are doing it for a hobby. They many be centre circle refs who aren't fully versed in all the law changes, but they're experienced referees who are needed to get games on and who do a good job. They're appreciated by park level teams I can assure you and are not considered clueless wallies!

The game is more important than the referee. We are here to facilitate football, even at the very lowest level.

Perhaps if IFAB didn't rewrite the LOTG every year, it would be easier for referees outside of promotion schemes, and who don't have access to SKY or BT Sports to view the new laws in action, to keep up.

If referees can't be bothered to brush up on the laws before the start of the new season, even if it is just a glance at any changes and official guidance, then they shouldn't be refereeing.

I think there should be a test on the laws of the games as part of the registration process, nothing taxing, just a quick 15-20 questions going over the basics and any recent changes.

If you think that it is more important to simply have a warm body in a black shirt than a referee who knows the laws of the game, then why bother having referees in grass roots football.

Any idiot can run around with a whistle.

 

[JamesL]

How does this even happen though? I mean, surely he must watch some football at some point? I think a law change as big as that one surely can't be missed at this stage of the season?

He just sits screaming at his tele that the ball has to leave the box and how his he meant to do things properly when they don't at the top levels of the game?

 

[Ben448844]

If referees can't be bothered to brush up on the laws before the start of the new season, even if it is just a glance at any changes and official guidance, then they shouldn't be refereeing.

I think there should be a test on the laws of the games as part of the registration process, nothing taxing, just a quick 15-20 questions going over the basics and any recent changes.

If you think that it is more important to simply have a warm body in a black shirt than a referee who knows the laws of the game, then why bother having referees in grass roots football.

Any idiot can run around with a whistle.

We'd all like this. But I'm a realist and I've also played alot of football from contrib (and academy until I was 16), to Sunday morning dog and duck. I'm absolutely Sure that we'd lose referees at that level and the biggest losers would be the footballers at that level, who'd have no ref at all. The game of football is the most important thing

 

[zarathustra]

We'd all like this. But I'm a realist and I've also played alot of football from contrib (and academy until I was 16), to Sunday morning dog and duck. I'm absolutely Sure that we'd lose referees at that level and the biggest losers would be the footballers at that level, who'd have no ref at all. The game of football is the most important thing

If the referee doesn't know the laws, or hasn't kept up with changes they might as well just pick someone at random.

Why bother with qualified referees if you don't care about whether they can do the job?

 

[Grayson]

CFA’s still circulate changes to LOTG each summer don’t they? Could be an easy “read this pdf and answer these X questions (or something)” when taking annual registration fees.