A&H

How long before Coronavirus impact on Football is over?

The previous lockdown rules were nonsensical in places. What was the point of banning people from sitting in the middle of a park on their own at the same time as they could go and join huge queues at B&Q and be in much closer proximity to others.

They really need the antibody test quickly. I remain convinced that a significant percentage of the population will have already had it, especially in London. Right up until lock down people were crammed onto tubes and trains, in busy offices, in packed post-work pubs and bars, and all at a time that the R was incredibly high. I'm 95% sure that I had it in mid-March, but didn't think anything of it as the symptoms hadn't been mentioned at that time, and at least five of the people I sit close to in the office are convinced they have had it. We also had a team weekend away to Liverpool in mid-March, just after the Liverpool vs Atletico game that is thought to have contributed massively to the spread there.

Looking at photos of the tube in London today I do wonder if either the government have the same view as me, or they are going back to the herd immunity approach. Telling people to go back to work with just 12 hours notice, knowing that workplaces and transport providers wouldn't be able to react in that time, seems a bit fishy to me.

Politicians just simply reacting to media mood and covering their arses.

"People flapping? People think we've acted too late/not done enough? Let's lock it all down".

"People flapping? People flaunting lockdown already and complaining about the death of/damage to the economy already? Let's reduce lockdown and tell them all to get back to work".

Trouble is, when your country is largely controlled by the mainstream media with liberal socialist views and people are actually dying, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. Whatever happens from here on, it'll all be Boris's fault. :rolleyes:
 
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Politicians just simply reacting to media mood and covering their arses.

"People flapping? People think we've acted too late/not done enough? Let's lock it all down".

"People flapping? People flaunting lockdown already and complaining about the death of/damage to the economy already? Let's reduce lockdown and tell them all to get back to work".

Trouble is, when your country is largely controlled by the mainstream media with liberal socialist views and people are actually dying, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. Whatever happens from here on, it'll all be Boris's fault. :rolleyes:

Yep if I look at my social media feed, it's a mix of the "profit before people" side and "we need to unlock faster otherwise our jobs/industry won't exist" side.

On one hand people complain that there is no plan to come out of this, then when a framework gets published, there are too many inconsistencies.

If the government says they are guessing at the next steps, they are incompetent....

Looking at South Korea, they've now seen one "superspreader" potentially cause mayhem which could trigger a big jump in cases there.

Regardless of which way you lean politically and whether there is a left or right wing government in any country, there's going to be one hell of a long road before we get back to normality.
 
The South Korean 5-bars-in-a-night guy has just highlighted how fragile the exit is. And in South Korea they have one of the best trace and test set ups in the world, so they were able to actually catch it, flag it, trace it.

I have twin devils. On one hand the UK seems to be heading into random choppy water in then next 48 hours. We'll see in the next two weeks what kind of effect the vague transport and return to work instructions have on the infection rate.
On the other hand, in adopted country, we go back to school on Thursday, and IMHO the govt are cavalier, the govt are also acting powerless in the face of red tape (or at least that's their excuse for abdicating responsibility), there's a total leadership vacuum, the press are weak and test/trace resources do not seem remotely ready if there is a spike.

I also note that that it's quite possible that a lot more people in the UK have had it and have it now. Whereas up here in Santaland it seems that far fewer people might have had it than thought. Both ways, there are potential positives and negatives of course.
 
We should try to stick to football. Today's practice - no contact, no goals, kids each with a 2m2 box, waiting for their ball to be kicked back to them if it left the box...
 
The problem isn't with allowing one person to sit on their own in a park, it's that if you allow one person to do it, you can't then justify saying no to the next person, or the person after that and so on until the park is full. And we also don't know enough about the virus to know how dangerous it would then be if an hour later someone else came along and sat in the same spot - is the grass contaminated? Literally no one knows, so why not all do our park to minimise risks? Although as you say, that is almost immediately contradicted by allowing DIY shops to stay open!

I read about a study by an American university where they invited people who thought they'd had the virus to come along and be tested and found only 40% positive results. Some of that was down to concerns over the antibody test they were using maybe not being able to detect antibodies until an unknown amount of time after, or the antibodies not building up immediately, but they still concluded that a significant number of people who thought they'd already had it in fact hadn't. Don't forget, there will still the the usual selection of seasonal flu's and colds, some of which will be very similar to a mild coronovirus case but won't generate the correct antibodies.

A lot of the people who turned up to be tested had already assumed they were immune, even though the presence of antibodies doesn't necessarily imply that. As you say, that's why testing is so important. If you think you've had it and are immune, it's natural for your behavior to change, but people who think they're immune and aren't will end up putting themselves and others at risk.

Parks could get busy and yes that relies on people being sensible and going somewhere else if it is busy. The scientists seem to be gambling on it being much less likely to spread outdoors, guess only time will tell if they are right on that or not.

My symptoms were bizarre at the time. When drinking water it felt like I was swallowing glass, to the extent for two days I was checking my glass for chips or cracks, and I lost a crazy amount of weight that week without being on any kind of health kick and with next to no exercise. Didn't have a cough at all, no temperature, not even any throat pain except when swallowing liquid. Thought nothing of it at the time until I saw Matt Hancock's interview after recovering and he described almost like for like my symptoms. During that time I was still going to work on packed trains as I hadn't matched any of the Covid-19 at the time listed symptoms so I have no idea how many people I might have spread it to. With the pace that it spread through London and the close nature of contact on trains and tubes I find it hard to believe that a huge number of people haven't already been infected.
 
On one hand people complain that there is no plan to come out of this, then when a framework gets published, there are too many inconsistencies.
I don't think there's any reason to suggest those two things can't be true. Yes, a framework of some sort is probably better than nothing, but I don't see why that framework shouldn't be scrutinised and further adjustments made where needed.

Personally, I've run into issues due to the gap in the furlough scheme for new starters. The furlough scheme is clearly the right thing to do and has probably helped millions of people - that doesn't change the fact that it's failed me, the problem should have been fixed and them failing to do so means they should be criticised for leaving that gap in place. Simultaneously, the government has done a good thing but should still have done better - that's not a paradox or unfair abuse, that's just the truth.
 
Politicians just simply reacting to media mood and covering their arses.

"People flapping? People think we've acted too late/not done enough? Let's lock it all down".

"People flapping? People flaunting lockdown already and complaining about the death of/damage to the economy already? Let's reduce lockdown and tell them all to get back to work".

Trouble is, when your country is largely controlled by the mainstream media with liberal socialist views and people are actually dying, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. Whatever happens from here on, it'll all be Boris's fault. :rolleyes:
Brexit all over again minus the dying.
 
This has veered off well away from football and is now in political territory. It’s only a matter of time before this gets messy.

Seems like the EFL are struggling with the idea of a 2m price tag for testing. It wasn’t clear if this was the cost per weekend for thd Championship or what?
 
Celtic champions in Scotland. Season over.

Surely the UK is so far behind e.g. Germany (and I mean 3-8 weeks behind in a major indicator like schools reopening)... surely the chances of the prem managing to fulfill all the remaining fixtures are getting slimmer by the hour?

Or can they pull it off?

Surely only a reduced schedule is realistic?
 
Celtic champions in Scotland. Season over.

Surely the UK is so far behind e.g. Germany (and I mean 3-8 weeks behind in a major indicator like schools reopening)... surely the chances of the prem managing to fulfill all the remaining fixtures are getting slimmer by the hour?

Or can they pull it off?

Surely only a reduced schedule is realistic?
Anyone I’ve spoken to near me thinks the EPL is deluding itself by thinking this season can be completed
 
Watford captain reported as saying he wont be returning to his work today

thats fine, gross misconduct, or at best, off on the sick.

The world has changed and these guys have been knocked right off their podiums

next up, will be an elimination of contracts, you will simply be a footballer and if you leave for another club, its the same as us, the plebs, leaving for another job,

for every couple of million transfer fee you loose out on, you are gaining by not paying guys up a 3 year deal at £20k per week. Esp when it comes to managers.

not turning up for work? Not paid,
Claiming absence due to sickness? First three day unpaid , the rest needs the doctor certificate
 
Watford captain reported as saying he wont be returning to his work today

thats fine, gross misconduct, or at best, off on the sick.

The world has changed and these guys have been knocked right off their podiums

next up, will be an elimination of contracts, you will simply be a footballer and if you leave for another club, its the same as us, the plebs, leaving for another job,

for every couple of million transfer fee you loose out on, you are gaining by not paying guys up a 3 year deal at £20k per week. Esp when it comes to managers.

not turning up for work? Not paid,
Claiming absence due to sickness? First three day unpaid , the rest needs the doctor certificate
Troy is claiming to be concerned because he has an unwell 5 month old baby. Not sure if Danny Rose has anything to justify his Twitter rants
The fact is, we live in this Liberal society in which there's an arm round the shoulder for anyone who doesn't want to go back to work. The Govt. did a good job at worrying everyone to death (rightly or wrongly)... leaving some folk locked in that state
However, it's very very likely, that a trip to the supermarket will pose a much greater risk than any EPL game ever will. It's just that a lot of people are not a good judge of risk
 
...surely he will have his agent's and (private) doctor's advice and get a sick note based on being in an at risk group?

(I don't know exactly what the UK guidelines/legislation are at this point)
 
...surely he will have his agent's and (private) doctor's advice and get a sick note based on being in an at risk group?

(I don't know exactly what the UK guidelines/legislation are at this point)
I'm fairly sure that TD would be entitled to abstain from work. The Govt. has asked that Business' behave in 'the spirit' of what is trying to be achieved (gradual return to work) when taking into account personal circumstances
 
...surely he will have his agent's and (private) doctor's advice and get a sick note based on being in an at risk group?

(I don't know exactly what the UK guidelines/legislation are at this point)

Clearly none of us are privy to his contract but in our world, if your works open, and you dont go in, you loose pay, use holidays, lieu days,etc
Its not our business but I will take a guess this guy will still get his 20k per week

i also would refuse to go to my work for fear of my kids health on 20k per week.

i would also guess if Mr Troy was shelves at Asda, with the same 5yo kid, Troy would still be at work and would have been right through the pandemic...
 
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I don't think there's any reason to suggest those two things can't be true. Yes, a framework of some sort is probably better than nothing, but I don't see why that framework shouldn't be scrutinised and further adjustments made where needed.

Personally, I've run into issues due to the gap in the furlough scheme for new starters. The furlough scheme is clearly the right thing to do and has probably helped millions of people - that doesn't change the fact that it's failed me, the problem should have been fixed and them failing to do so means they should be criticised for leaving that gap in place. Simultaneously, the government has done a good thing but should still have done better - that's not a paradox or unfair abuse, that's just the truth.

This is a no-win for everyone. Sadly it has become massively political and a feeding frenzy for the media.

A pal of mine work on HMRC contact centre furlough scheme and was asked "How can I claim money for my staff - they're all paid cash-in-hand?"
I can think of a few referees who count their pennies and will be struggling with no match fees....
 
How did I mess that post up? Help

If tried to fix it but made it only slightly better, no idea what you've done there.

All employers have a duty of care to their employees. There are examples of key workers who have not been able to return to work as they live with someone in the most at risk category, attempting to force them back to work would be a serious breach of that duty of care and possibly even lead to legal cases if their action resulted in someone dying. I have a cousin who falls into that category, she has severe asthma that has seen her hospitalised numerous times since childhood and catching the virus would be life threatening. For that reason her husband cannot return to work and the children won't be able to go back to school, none of them have left the house since lock down as the risk would just be too great.

We don't know how bad Troy Deeney's son's condition is, if he has severe breathing difficulties and the family have been advised to self isolate then he is absolutely correct to not return to training. Even if it doesn't fall into that category I think he has the absolute right to protect his family.
 
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