The Ref Stop

Drop ball?

The Ref Stop
One of the downsides of the throw in restart is that most in the game expect a dropped ball for it hitting the referee. 99.9% of the time the ball will stay on the field of play and perhaps meet one of the three conditions so its a DB. Personally I think it somewhat "unfair" that if it hits the referee and stays on the field of play and changes possession it is a DB whereas in the exact same situation if it is kept in play on the touchline by an opponent it is a DB. If he let it go out he gets a TI and possession. This once happened to me and I went with the DB with zero complaint from opponents. Everyone fully expected the DB so rather than getting caught up in a LotG debate it was the easier call in the game. Try explaining to a team where a pass has been deflected out of play off the referee for a TI and the opponents take it quickly, mounting a quick attack.
Yet trying to explain the finer points of law in a game does not work too easily. IFAB needs to tidy that one up to allow the referee to make a decision within the ‘spirit’ of the game and the Laws. To use that phrase, “what would football want/expect?”
 
Goldfish said:
One of the downsides of the throw in restart is that most in the game expect a dropped ball for it hitting the referee. 99.9% of the time the ball will stay on the field of play and perhaps meet one of the three conditions so its a DB. Personally I think it somewhat "unfair" that if it hits the referee and stays on the field of play and changes possession it is a DB whereas in the exact same situation if it is kept in play on the touchline by an opponent it is a DB. If he let it go out he gets a TI and possession. This once happened to me and I went with the DB with zero complaint from opponents. Everyone fully expected the DB so rather than getting caught up in a LotG debate it was the easier call in the game. Try explaining to a team where a pass has been deflected out of play off the referee for a TI and the opponents take it quickly, mounting a quick attack.
Yet trying to explain the finer points of law in a game does not work too easily. IFAB needs to tidy that one up to allow the referee to make a decision within the ‘spirit’ of the game and the Laws. To use that phrase, “what would football want/expect?”
Click to expand...

I alluded to that. it happened to me, i went ( correctly) throw.
I maybe got a bit lucky in that, I knew both teams well, and, nothing came from the throw, but even a civilised chat post match, the coach was not buying it.

everyone expected drop ball. Next time, am blowing before the ball goes out if play!
 
Goldfish said:
.
Yet trying to explain the finer points of law in a game does not work too easily. IFAB needs to tidy that one up to allow the referee to make a decision within the ‘spirit’ of the game and the Laws. To use that phrase, “what would football want/expect?”
Click to expand...
On one hand I agree, but on the other that can be quite a can of worms as in many cases there can be clear differences of opinion, and it puts the referee on the spot. And it is contrary to the direction IFAB has been going in recent years with more and more specificity in the name of consistency. It seems that every change IFAB makes is to reduce referee discretion and judgment. While I’d like to go back to when ITOOTR was a stronger concept, that isn’t the way the tide is going.
 
Goldfish said:
Yet trying to explain the finer points of law in a game does not work too easily. IFAB needs to tidy that one up to allow the referee to make a decision within the ‘spirit’ of the game and the Laws. To use that phrase, “what would football want/expect?”
Click to expand...
Outcome of ball hiring the referee can get a little complex with many edge case scenarios. The problem with going with what does football expect is that when something new comes about, there is no expectation set. Then football expects what they see or hear as they watch games. So if enough of us referees get a law wrong, then that wrong outcome would becomes what football expects. And if we all get it consistently right (according to law) then that is what they would expect.

To give you an example, keeper encroachment was not expected to be given for minor ones for many years (well because referees didn't give it). Then with VAR there was a lot of issues when small encroachment were given. After consistently applying it, now keepers have learnt to stay on the line and giving minor encroachment is not against expectation, even if in practice it has not helped the keeper make a save.
 
I would say that if a straw poll was taken of referees on this part of the ball out of play law that it would not be consistent. The reason the question was posed was that cdsman went with a dropped ball rather than a throw in which I suspect was not challenged. Anubis wished he had went with a DB I suspect because the fuss it caused. Plus if play is stopped before the ball goes out of play it has to be a DB. I probably get the shot on goal situation that is deflected wide by a referee and was IFAB mindful of a second shot on goal from the DB as perhaps being unfair? Discretion and judgement is an important part of refereeing and I always liked to make the *best* decision for the game rather than being a slave to rote when the game expects a certain decision particularly when it is not uniformly enforced. Case in point is the offside IDFK. I see countless IDFK taken from the old wrong location yet it is accepted.. I watch a lot of games and I have seen one situation of play on for the ball hitting the referee and the ball went back to the same player.
 
Anubis said:
I alluded to that. it happened to me, i went ( correctly) throw.
I maybe got a bit lucky in that, I knew both teams well, and, nothing came from the throw, but even a civilised chat post match, the coach was not buying it.

everyone expected drop ball. Next time, am blowing before the ball goes out if play!
Click to expand...
Agreed, I'm giving a DB if it's in my interests to do so. Like giving offside in against a team in their defensive half
Both not worth the hassle, loss of respect and loss of MC. (Unless being observed, in which case the marks offset the mayhem... which ironically opens the door to more assessment marks via Sin Bins and such like. Harder to score highly in assessments in games without mayhem)
 
one said:
Outcome of ball hiring the referee can get a little complex with many edge case scenarios. The problem with going with what does football expect is that when something new comes about, there is no expectation set. Then football expects what they see or hear as they watch games. So if enough of us referees get a law wrong, then that wrong outcome would becomes what football expects. And if we all get it consistently right (according to law) then that is what they would expect.

To give you an example, keeper encroachment was not expected to be given for minor ones for many years (well because referees didn't give it). Then with VAR there was a lot of issues when small encroachment were given. After consistently applying it, now keepers have learnt to stay on the line and giving minor encroachment is not against expectation, even if in practice it has not helped the keeper make a save.
Click to expand...
Although they have changed to law to meet the custom and practice of NEVER giving encroachment by the GK if the kick is missed (ie not saved)

I know there is some 'get out' clause in the 'new' wording but as we all know, ball sails over the bar and no one on earth is giving/expecting a retake!
 
Big Cat said:
Agreed, I'm giving a DB if it's in my interests to do so. Like giving offside in against a team in their defensive half
Both not worth the hassle, loss of respect and loss of MC. (Unless being observed, in which case the marks offset the mayhem... which ironically opens the door to more assessment marks via Sin Bins and such like. Harder to score highly in assessments in games without mayhem)
Click to expand...
Note to self... Ball struck me the other night and went out for a Goal Kick. I gave the Goal Kick :eek:
So despite the game not being observed and despite my marginal preference towards MC instead of AOL, I unexpectedly applied the LOTG

Edit... I was in a good position initially, adjacent to a Goal Area scramble & was somewhat unfortunate to be struck by the ball so close to the goal line
 
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