RefSix

Double jump

es1

RefChat Addict
Level 4 Referee
I've seen lots of L7s who have never gone for promotion who are better referees than some L5s, so if I have a big game that needs well handling I'll look at who is the best performing rather than necessarily just who is the highest level.

This is absolutely true as well.

This may sound a bit snobbish but I don't think it's hard to get to L5 and is something any semi competent ref should sleepwalk (If they want it). That leaves plenty who make it there and are considered 'good' for being L5 when in reality they're far from it.

Perhaps a touch harsh...
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
Yep, same here. I've been a RefsSec on multiple occasions, appointments at grass roots are usually done based on club marks rather than level. That's the same as the leagues that I've refereed on, I've never really seen any differentiation between L6 and L5 officials, that has only come in at step 7 and above which is no longer grass roots.

I've seen lots of L7s who have never gone for promotion who are better referees than some L5s, so if I have a big game that needs well handling I'll look at who is the best performing rather than necessarily just who is the highest level.
HSCL virtually all 5's on Prem (Step 7). This season, only one 6 has had a couple of Prem games
This trend may not be the case elsewhere... granted... but my experience is that there is a clear difference 7 to 6 to 5 in terms of appointments
That said, my RefSec on Sunday's goes by reputation (club marks), favouring promotion candidates. So you're entirely right for the BSL
 
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RustyRef

Administrator
Staff member
This is absolutely true as well.

This may sound a bit snobbish but I don't think it's hard to get to L5 and is something any semi competent ref should sleepwalk (If they want it). That leaves plenty who make it there and are considered 'good' for being L5 when in reality they're far from it.

Perhaps a touch harsh...

There's other factors as well. Some L5s transferred from overseas and were placed at that level, I've seen one such official regularly completely destroy games as he really doesn't even know the basics. Some L5s have been at that level for 30, 40, even 50 years, many having made no attempts whatsoever to modernise with the times, or in some cases even keep up with law changes.

There's a lot more training for observers now than there was in the past, and the competencies are more clearly defined, so it is probably harder to get to L5 now than it was back in the day. I came through back when it was the old paper forms, and I still have a copy of one assessment that had at most three words per competency. And one of the competencies was "Appearance", meaning that whether you got promoted or not depended as much on how clean your boots were or how white your sock tops were as your actual refereeing ability.
 

RustyRef

Administrator
Staff member
HSCL virtually all 5's on Prem (Step 7). This season, only one 6 has had a couple of Prem games
This trend may not be the case elsewhere... granted... but my experience is that there is a clear difference 7 to 6 to 5 in terms of appointments

I did say that step 7 and above is the only real area where a differentiation comes in between L6 and L5. That said, the HSCL feeds into the SSMFL, and I'm pretty sure they use L6s in the middle on their step 7 division.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
I did say that step 7 and above is the only real area where a differentiation comes in between L6 and L5. That said, the HSCL feeds into the SSMFL, and I'm pretty sure they use L6s in the middle on their step 7 division.
Yes, L6's get middles in the SSMFL. I have one on the 24th if I'm fit
Don't get me wrong, reputation (club marks, word of mouth etc.) is more important than Level when we're talking 5/6/7
So I'm agreeing with you (I think; I can't remember :confused:)!
5 is a place for;
a) Those wanting the pick of local games
b) Those preparing for big lad's football (L4)
c) Those demoted (for which I think there should be a sub-code like 5b, but that's another story)
6 is a stepping stone and a chance to take in the scenery. I think it serves a good purpose
7-to-6 was box ticking. 6-to-5, my two observers have looked more at what happens on the FOP, rather than off it
I know I don't need to tell you any of this! Just my perspective
 

Ben448844

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
Yes, L6's get middles in the SSMFL. I have one on the 24th if I'm fit
Don't get me wrong, reputation (club marks, word of mouth etc.) is more important than Level when we're talking 5/6/7
So I'm agreeing with you (I think; I can't remember :confused:)!
5 is a place for;
a) Those wanting the pick of local games
b) Those preparing for big lad's football (L4)
c) Those demoted (for which I think there should be a sub-code like 5b, but that's another story)
6 is a stepping stone and a chance to take in the scenery. I think it serves a good purpose
7-to-6 was box ticking. 6-to-5, my two observers have looked more at what happens on the FOP, rather than off it
I know I don't need to tell you any of this! Just my perspective

I did 2 full season before applying for promotion. 7-6 was a doddle as no observations, just the games + exams but I was 35 with 2 seasons in men's football (+ a lifetime of being involved in football) behind me. 6-5 I've had 3 observations and the observers were clearly well coached and had high expectations. I got 2 standards and 1 above standard but their feedback was detailed and concentrated on what I consider to be detailed elements of the law/game. I'm considering going for 4 this coming season should I achieve promotion to 5 this year.
 

bester

RefChat Addict
Level 7 Referee
Midland Football League Step 7-"9" all have three officials. You won't get a middle unless you're a level 5 or you're a 7 or 6 going for promotion.
 

Russell Jones

RefChat Addict
Level 3 Referee
Yes, L6's get middles in the SSMFL. I have one on the 24th if I'm fit
Don't get me wrong, reputation (club marks, word of mouth etc.) is more important than Level when we're talking 5/6/7
So I'm agreeing with you (I think; I can't remember :confused:)!
5 is a place for;
a) Those wanting the pick of local games
b) Those preparing for big lad's football (L4)
c) Those demoted (for which I think there should be a sub-code like 5b, but that's another story)
6 is a stepping stone and a chance to take in the scenery. I think it serves a good purpose
7-to-6 was box ticking. 6-to-5, my two observers have looked more at what happens on the FOP, rather than off it
I know I don't need to tell you any of this! Just my perspective
You missed out:

d) those L4++ choosing to step back to L5, either because of external commitments or because they feel the time is right to 'give something back'. There's a handful of those folk regularly stepping out in both the County League and the Spartan League
 
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