A&H

Der Klassiker

T

TheRefereeFrom2003

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"You give a referee that has match fixed before, the biggest game in Germany, what do you expect?"

Incredible words from Jude Bellingham after the Der Klassiker. Did anyone watch the game? What’s the incident that caused this?
 
The Referee Store
Pen going one way, no pen going the other way.

Embarrassing thing to say. Hopefully keen on a holiday
 
Just reading the story now.

Its dfficult not to understand the players concerns. The referee has factually taken a bribe for games before and has been punished for it.
There is only one reason there would be any cause for suspicion...

the referees previous conviction!

of course there is going to be doubt, unfounded or not.

if a defender ( if they return to playing) previously found guilty of match fixing rolls home a suspect og, its hunan nature for us to instantly question its plight.

perfectly natural a player, esp one still dripping in sweat from the battlefield, emotional under the mic, will retort in kind.
 
I mean, should this referee expect to be insulted every controversial match for the remainder of his career? It happened 17 years ago when, I expect, he was young, dumb, and pressured by colleagues.

It's an incredibly low blow to pull out for a fairly arguable set of decisions. The handball was an obvious decision. The no-penalty against Dortmund was a little more ambiguous, but still defensible.

The sending off of the manager was a fait accompli once he continued being a woodduck.

To impute match fixing is just stupid.
 
Redster said:
I mean, should this referee expect to be insulted every controversial match for the remainder of his career? It happened 17 years ago when, I expect, he was young, dumb, and pressured by colleagues.

It's an incredibly low blow to pull out for a fairly arguable set of decisions. The handball was an obvious decision. The no-penalty against Dortmund was a little more ambiguous, but still defensible.

The sending off of the manager was a fait accompli once he continued being a woodduck.

To impute match fixing is just stupid.
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Depends if you class being insulted, as, being factually reminded of your past actions I guess.

of course only those involved know the facts but at face value, this reinforces the case for sine die when it comes to bribery,
a- it reduces repeat
b- it removes future allegation, keeping the association clear, and allowing the referee to continue a life without fear of suspicion,
 
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Redster said:
I mean, should this referee expect to be insulted every controversial match for the remainder of his career? It happened 17 years ago when, I expect, he was young, dumb, and pressured by colleagues.

It's an incredibly low blow to pull out for a fairly arguable set of decisions. The handball was an obvious decision. The no-penalty against Dortmund was a little more ambiguous, but still defensible.

The sending off of the manager was a fait accompli once he continued being a woodduck.

To impute match fixing is just stupid.
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I think Bellingham sort of as a point in his angry words. Should an official previously convicted of match fixing be given such big games? For me, it’s a no. As Big Cat said, I’m surprised it hasn’t ended up in a lifetime ban. He got a ban of 6 months, and the whole thing was kept secret until a newspaper uncovered it.

Not saying whether his decisions were wrong, I feel they’re all arguable decisions.
 
Anubis said:
Depends if you class being insulted, as, being factually reminded of your past actions I guess.

of course only those involved know the facts but at face value, this reinforces the case for sine die when it comes to bribery,
a- it reduces repeat
b- it removes future allegation, keeping the association clear, and allowing the referee to continue a life without fear of suspicion,
Click to expand...
300 euros when running a line as I understand it, in circumstances where the CR was enormously corrupted over a long period. I would expect there was significant pressure. It was in 2005, so I gather he was a fairly young chap.
 
Anubis said:
Depends if you class being insulted, as, being factually reminded of your past actions I guess.

of course only those involved know the facts but at face value, this reinforces the case for sine die when it comes to bribery,
a- it reduces repeat
b- it removes future allegation, keeping the association clear, and allowing the referee to continue a life without fear of suspicion,
Click to expand...

Felix Zwyer was one of four referees who went to the DFB with their suspicions about Robert Hoyzer, who was subsequently convicted of manipulating the results of at least six games, banned for life from all football and jailed for 2.5 years. Zwyer was only banned for 6 months, and we of course don't know the full circumstances behind what he did. It was run by a Croatian gambling syndicate linked to an OCG, so perhaps there were theats against him or his family. The fact he wasn't prosecuted unlike Hoyzer, and was given such a short ban, would suggest both football and legal authorities were satisfied he was just caught up in it.

In any case, he went onto get promoted to referee in the top division and then FIFA, and is one of the top referees in world football. I rate Bellingham, but he has made a massive mistake here and is going to be in real trouble. Not just from the football authorities, he could potentially face legal action should Zwayer choose to take things further.
 
Related to the game, do you think Lewandowski’s penalty should have been ruled out. Seems to me that he “feinting to kick the ball once the kicker has completed the run-up (feinting in the run-up is permitted); the referee cautions the kicker”

What do people think, any examples of refs actually enforcing this?
 
RustyRef said:
Felix Zwyer was one of four referees who went to the DFB with their suspicions about Robert Hoyzer, who was subsequently convicted of manipulating the results of at least six games, banned for life from all football and jailed for 2.5 years. Zwyer was only banned for 6 months, and we of course don't know the full circumstances behind what he did. It was run by a Croatian gambling syndicate linked to an OCG, so perhaps there were theats against him or his family. The fact he wasn't prosecuted unlike Hoyzer, and was given such a short ban, would suggest both football and legal authorities were satisfied he was just caught up in it.

In any case, he went onto get promoted to referee in the top division and then FIFA, and is one of the top referees in world football. I rate Bellingham, but he has made a massive mistake here and is going to be in real trouble. Not just from the football authorities, he could potentially face legal action should Zwayer choose to take things further.
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Whilst I agree that he wasn't guilty of an offence as serious as the other referee, he is still guilty of a match fixing offence. It is incredible that he has risen to a position of refereeing a huge game like this.

Referees are there to uphold the laws of the game and following a ban for match fixing activities, I'm amazed this hasn't happened before.
 
one said:
He was banned for 6 months, end of. It was not a 6 months ban and top flight ban. Or you can referee but no critical games.
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I dont disagree. But this is real world stuff. Having had a 6 month ban for Involvement in match fixing, his integrity is in the gutter. The focus is now on the authorities and this whole incident will be dragged up and talked about in the most public place possible. Those that hid the suspension will be questioned by the media. The whole ****show is in the public eye. Those that have appointed him to this game will certainly be regretting that today. It was always going to happen. It will never go away.
 
Muchomacho said:
What do people think, any examples of refs actually enforcing this?
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I can't find a clip of the PK you're referring to, but it's very rare to see it called. The rule was adopted do the "Paradinha" that involved a full stop after the leg swing and the kicker tapping the ball past the GK who already dove.
 
Muchomacho said:
Related to the game, do you think Lewandowski’s penalty should have been ruled out. Seems to me that he “feinting to kick the ball once the kicker has completed the run-up (feinting in the run-up is permitted); the referee cautions the kicker”

What do people think, any examples of refs actually enforcing this?
Click to expand...
Literally thinking the same thing here. Not quite the same as Jorginhos hop style. As Lewandoski almost has two hops
 
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