Criticisms of Referees
- Thread starter Xman
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I replied fairly quickly last night and did not particularly want to get involved in anything, but on second thoughts I find it slightly strange that, due to being a level 8 referee, I am not allowed to comment on incidents I have seen. Does there become a point when I progress when I suddenly become more wise? Does having a lower number next to my name make me more qualified to discuss interpretations of the laws of the game? Maybe there should be a separate part of the forum where only people who have refereed 'a game of any significance' can discuss things together.
I agree that criticism should be constructive, such as helping fellow members who lost control of a game or whatever. However, with clear cut things like the penalty decisions that Lee had to make, there are only two possible replies - right or wrong. I personally believe that he made the wrong call(s) since I would argue that the magic booklet dictates that they should have been fouls. If he came on here and asked for help as to how he could have helped his game to identify infringements, then constructive criticism would be appropriate.
It cannot be ignored that Lee made some incorrect decisions on Saturday. But, at the end of the day, we all have the same copy of the LOTG and nobody on here is less qualified than others to form viewpoints based on them. It doesn't matter what level we are or what games we have to referee on the weekend because we all have to apply the same laws as the PGMOL officials and so we are all allowed to comment on how they are applied.
I think you both fail to grasp the point. Your level of course does not stop you from stop you from commenting or having an opinion on a decision (and I am a firm believer that you can learn something from everyone) what I am saying is it is a bit rich coming from someone that has barely, if at all had experience in amateur let alone the semi-professional or professional game! It is simply impossible to grasp completely the additional pressures and factors that Lee and the others face! Even as a level 4 where we are considered semi-professional officials I would not claim to be in a position where I can rant or rave about how s**t a referee was when refereeing a professional game let alone the FA Cup Final and that is why you will never see me do it!
I think those commenting forget that we are all referees and can therefore quite easily make judgements on decisions after seeing them numerous time for ourselves.We don't need to come plastering them all over the internet especially when they are fairly clear cut and require little debate. My main point is, is that we have an allegiance towards fellow colleagues and should respect that. If you haven't grasped my point already then I will illustrate with a hypothetical example:
'Manchester United are in the FA Cup final and Wayne Rooney has an absolute stinker. He misses a penalty, fires over from two yards out and in an attempted pass-back gives the ball to the opposition who score. Even those unfamiliar with football knew he was rubbish on the day.' Now, would it be fair for someone such as James Wilson (the Academy striker) to come out and post on the Manchester United fans forum that he thought Rooney was absolutely appalling? Of course it wouldn't. Not only does it show a lack of professionalism it shows a lack of respect to a colleague. Furthermore with Wilson not even good enough to make the team himself and having never played in such a final it would be rich of him to make such negative comments.
This is exactly the same scenario to that which we face here.
This forum is for learning and constructive debate not for expressing mindless negative comments.
Says who - perhaps if it was Ross who was saying this, I'd take more notice, as it is, i just think, feckin hell, i hope this guy isn't planning on becoming a g.p.
I would think anyone with half a brain would realise that there's not place for mindless negative comments anywhere. Especially not on the internet.
Xman
Member
Let me state that this thread was NOT motivated alone by the comments of @Owen Webster - but the cup final thread in question in only one example of a few threads which caught my eye over the course of the last few months.
I feel that the comments toward Owen have been slightly out of order, especially considering that he owned up to what he has said and looked to move on.
I feel that the comments toward Owen have been slightly out of order, especially considering that he owned up to what he has said and looked to move on.
micky2001
Well-Known Member
I think it is fair that we can look at referees decisions and criticise to an extent. As colleagues we should not publicly ridicule them but rather use their mistakes to aid us in our own game development. We shouldn't so much criticise the decision (since he is only giving it as he sees) but we should critique other factors such as the positioning of the referee and how he deals with the incident by way of man management etc.
At the end of the day, the referee is there to officiate honestly and I don't think for a minute that he would not have given a penalty or a foul for sinister reasons. He is refereeing the game as he sees it from his angle and if he is too far off play then that is unfortunate. Yes, he may not have been in the correct or best position, but we can all learn from this as it shows how poor fitness or poor anticipation of play can lead to problems. I'm sure we have all been in positions where we have made calls that were wrong or we weren't in the best position to give.
At the end of the day, the referee is there to officiate honestly and I don't think for a minute that he would not have given a penalty or a foul for sinister reasons. He is refereeing the game as he sees it from his angle and if he is too far off play then that is unfortunate. Yes, he may not have been in the correct or best position, but we can all learn from this as it shows how poor fitness or poor anticipation of play can lead to problems. I'm sure we have all been in positions where we have made calls that were wrong or we weren't in the best position to give.
Similarly my comments are by no means directed at @Owen Webster, it was similarly a response to a more long term problem triggered by the onslaught after the final.
@haywain do you not understand the simple concept of loyalty. If you were running the line to me and I didn't perform to my best I would like to assume that whilst not defending the indefensible you wouldn't go round to anyone who's anyone after the game proclaiming I had a 'sh*t game', or maybe you are one of the minority of colleagues that sometimes let the side down...
micky2001
Well-Known Member
Also, if just like to add that up here, our governing body creates a DVD that is sent to all associations on a monthly basis. At our own local association meetings we have coaches who go through each of the clips and we look at decisions made by referees or assistants, often the majority of the referees are in the same room at the time. We ask the referee his take on the incident and then have an open discussion about what was good/bad/could be improved. We criticise technical aspects but in no way set out to undermine the ability or capability of the referee. We are one big team and we should help each other through all our mistakes.
micky2001
Well-Known Member
@haywain @Pierluigi come on guys, play nice!
Unfortunately your post proves the exact kind of person you seem to be. You are doing yourself no favours.
@micky2001 I'm not one to make things personal. I was just saying that I would like to think assume he wouldnt do such a thing, not that he would.
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