A&H

CAR dropped me right in it

deusex

deusex

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85th minute, dangerous attack, ball looks like it goes out of play I look across to CAR who is looking right at me but flag is not up.
10 secs later ball is back of net, the bench are going mental at their own CAR. CLub manager said to him "why dind't you put the f***ing flag up", he replies "I did" (he was bloody brief if he did).
I go to him and say did the ball go out of play and he said "yes".
I honestly think this moron has just forgotten he is a CAR for that moment and has a brain fart.
I would have blown if he had flagged, so my reasoning was I have to take him at his word.
I disallowed the goal, after letting play continue for that 10 secs, it looked ugly as hell to any neutral! My credibility was out the window.
(You can imagine imagine my popularity. 10/100 from the club marks!)
Should I have allowed the goal and let it be a lesson to that team not to employ a vegetable as their AR?
Or was I correct going with the decison I felt in my gut was correct in law (though ugly ugly ugly to anyone watching).
ANYTHING I could have done or was I buggered either way?
First time in 8 years a CAR has lost me my match control.
 
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I always tell my CAR's that if they flag for something, keep the flag up until I acknowledge it.....and to raise it properly rather than just flick it in a direction!
 
See... even doing ins and outs CARs can be a problem.

I would have made sure everyone and I mean EVERYONE knew he told you it had gone out of play so you were going back for the throw-in. I'd have made a point of getting the captains in and standing close to the TAs I'd have said it in a stage whisper that he said the ball had gone out so it was a throw-in. If you got any backchat I'd have been doing lots of shoulder shrugging, muttering about one job and got to go with him and pointed at the CAR...
 
That's a tuff one mate , I would be inclined to have given the goal , especially if his own bench were asking where the flag was ?

How had done for you up till then ? fair ? rubbish ?

Yea give the goal !!! and let the lino take the Bollocking :):)
 
Beezer said:
That's a tuff one mate , I would be inclined to have given the goal , especially if his own bench were asking where the flag was ?

How had done for you up till then ? fair ? rubbish ?

Yea give the goal !!! and let the lino take the Bollocking :):)
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It didn't help that I'd given a very hotly debated penalty 10 mins earlier against the aggreaved team.
(One of those which is a FK anywhere else on the park but I'm not supposed to give as it's in the area!)
I wasn't having a particularly great game before this (as we all know when we're not!)
 
deusex said:
85th minute, dangerous attack, ball looks like it goes out of play I look across to CAR who is looking right at me but flag is not up.
10 secs later ball is back of net, the bench are going mental at their own CAR. CLub manager said to him "why dind't you put the f***ing flag up", he replies "I did" (he was bloody brief if he did).
I go to him and say did the ball go out of play and he said "yes".
I honestly think this moron has just forgotten he is a CAR for that moment and has a brain fart.
I would have blown if he had flagged, so my reasoning was I have to take him at his word.
I disallowed the goal, after letting play continue for that 10 secs, it looked ugly as hell to any neutral! My credibility was out the window.
(You can imagine imagine my popularity. 10/100 from the club marks!)
Should I have allowed the goal and let it be a lesson to that team not to employ a vegetable as their AR?
Or was I correct going with the decison I felt in my gut was correct in law (though ugly ugly ugly to anyone watching).
ANYTHING I could have done or was I buggered either way?
First time in 8 years a CAR has lost me my match control.
Click to expand...

I had a remarkably similar experience last season mate.

Ball down one side close to the edge, too difficult to tell if it was out. Looked at the CAR who was paying attention to the game but noticed flag was on the ground behind him.

Play goes on, ball is crossed, blue score. White defenders protest that ball was out, I jog over to the CAR and assembled manager etc, asked if it was out (made sure I was about 15 yards away so we both had to shout), he said it was.

Blew, disallowed goal and awarded throw in. The only difference was the CAR and manager etc at fault were for the team that scored rather than the one that conceded, so I made a big point of saying to the players how they had been so honest and sporting etc etc which deflected all the flack from me :D

Bollocked CAR and told them to use the bloody flag at all times....
 
Assistants assist, you make the call.

You give what you see and are sure of. if you do not see it, or are not sure of it, you can not give it.

Are you sure the ball crossed the line into the goal (from above - yes).
Are you sure the ball went out ocer the line (from the above - no)

You made the call.
 
This makes me glad I don't have to contend with CARs anymore! You can't win here, but I'd be inclined to give the goal and let it be a lesson to the CAR to flag properly! I think you might have retained more credibility, and thus match control, if you'd given the goal and laid the blame firmly at the door of the defending side's CAR.

Having said that, it's a judgement call and it sounds like you came to the right decision in law to award a throw-in , the ball probably had gone out going on how you've described the incident.

Doesn't matter how good your instructions are, if you've got a dozy bugger on the line, you're on a hiding to nothing!
 
It's a lose-lose situation. I wouldn't be opposed to you ignoring the AR's claim the ball went out. The time isn't so much the issue - it's that if he's advised you as such when it seems like an afterthought from his team scoring.....well, his credibility is seriously brought into question on that one.

Credit to you for making the tough decision though.
 
all that trouble over ball in.out of play, and you guys allow club managers,subs or supporters to give offside because you give them a flag, ooooh
 
I generally tend to go with whatever the CAR flags. If he didn't flag originally in your opinion then I'd have stuck with that and let the goal stand. In this particular instance, the CAR is seen to be responding to his own coach's/team's prompt after the fact. I'd be reluctant to allow that sort of collusion to make a decision that could affect the outcome of the match.
 
On Sunday I went with the CAR after the potential equalizer at 4 goals all. Made me very unpopular and the CAR, who I protected. It was tight and he absolutely convinced me he knew what the offside law was and he described precisely what he has seen. Up until that point all his decisions had been very good so I was comfortable going with him.
One swallow does not make a Summer but this CAR was credible.

As I have said before damned if you do, damned if you don't. Ignore them and you get told what is the point in having them and go with them and you are told you can make your own decisions.
 
Kes said:
I generally tend to go with whatever the CAR flags. If he didn't flag originally in your opinion then I'd have stuck with that and let the goal stand. In this particular instance, the CAR is seen to be responding to his own coach's/team's prompt after the fact. I'd be reluctant to allow that sort of collusion to make a decision that could affect the outcome of the match.
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Kes - I agree with you on this, you have to go with the original "decision" of the CAR and not let collusion from the sidelines take over.
 
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Anthony said:
On Sunday I went with the CAR after the potential equalizer at 4 goals all. Made me very unpopular and the CAR, who I protected. It was tight and he absolutely convinced me he knew what the offside law was and he described precisely what he has seen. Up until that point all his decisions had been very good so I was comfortable going with him.
One swallow does not make a Summer but this CAR was credible.

As I have said before damned if you do, damned if you don't. Ignore them and you get told what is the point in having them and go with them and you are told you can make your own decisions.
Click to expand...
Partly this is why I brief my CARs that should they flag for an offside with the ball going in to or very close to the penalty area, I will let play complete (ie attack loses ball or a goal is scored), and then come over to discuss. Only contentious decision as an outcome of this is when I consequently disallowed a goal because the flag went up on the edge of the area, and the attacking player takes it forward and scores. Why was it contentious? Because it was one of the few times I was refereeing my son's team, and it was my son that "scored". I did have a suspicion that he was off, and the CAR was nicely in line. That was a painful drive home after the game :)
 
xPositor said:
Partly this is why I brief my CARs that should they flag for an offside with the ball going in to or very close to the penalty area, I will let play complete (ie attack loses ball or a goal is scored), and then come over to discuss.
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Ditto - CAR flag keep it up and if they score I will come over and discuss after because I can disallow a goal but I can't magically give one.

This incident was virtually on the goal line with the ball pulled back to an oncoming attacker who knocked it home from 1 yard out so the CAR did well to take it all in and understand what he was seeing.
 
Anthony said:
Ditto - CAR flag keep it up and if they score I will come over and discuss after because I can disallow a goal but I can't magically give one.

This incident was virtually on the goal line with the ball pulled back to an oncoming attacker who knocked it home from 1 yard out so the CAR did well to take it all in and understand what he was seeing.
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If the ball was 'pulled back'.......what did he signal?
 
Padfoot said:
If the ball was 'pulled back'.......what did he signal?
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Sorry I was in a rush and that was very poorly explained. He was offside then pulled it back so I thought he was going to tell me the scorer was offside but the CAR explained that other attacker who crossed the ball was.
 
Reminds me of when I was a player....

Last minute of cup game, we're losing by one (can't remember score). Ball played to other CF who knocks it past keeper (slowly) at edge of box (keeper had gone walkies).

I ran on to it. Tapped it in.

Referee gives me offside. All hell kicks off! I wasn't anywhere near. CAR is opposition manager. He IS doing offsides.

He tells referee I wasn't.

Referee refuses to allow goal. They won.

Anyone that stubborn?!
 
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