Runner Ref
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This will be because you have been proven wrong in law. And rather than admit to it, you become defensive. Same for your brown nosers.
If only you showed as much empathy as Sam Barrott
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Birmingham vs Newcastle
- Thread starter Runner Ref
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If only you showed as much empathy as Sam Barrott
socal lurker
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Please follow James’ advice. Your repetitive assertions are quite tedious. Your “debate” is a sophisticated ad 5 year olds on the playground. (“Is not..”is too” …”is not”)
And your tiresome assertion that daylight has no use at all because you can’t find the word in the Laws is either hopeless naive or deliberately obtuse. Had you half the experience of those you love to criticize you might add value to the site. But so far, just ain’t happening.
And I am going to take the advice to use the ignore feature, and I would encourage you to do the same with respect to me.
He absolutely has to make a decision. There isn't a neutral option here - it is his decision, so he either flags to signal a goal or doesn't flag to signal no goal. He might not be in the perfect position, but he's still better placed than any other official.
I'm not having the official guessed, he saw in his view the whole of the ball was over the line, I don't think it was but it was very tight and all happens so quickly so very little time to make the decision.
Whilst it's potentially a game changing moment, I don't think it's a huge error either, it just shows you the importance of GLT is and it seems quite mad apparently Birmingham had GLT last season but not this season because they are in league 1.
Whilst it's potentially a game changing moment, I don't think it's a huge error either, it just shows you the importance of GLT is and it seems quite mad apparently Birmingham had GLT last season but not this season because they are in league 1.
one
RefChat Addict
Missed this thread. Posted this in a new thread.
Newcastle equaliser.
- It looks not to have wholly crossed the line. There is no conculsive evidence either way but if I had to take a guess from the replays, I'd say it remained an inch or two in. I don't see how the AR can call the goal with that much doubt. The position of the keeper could have mislead him.
- AR signal was confusing. It looked like a defensive free kick signal. Not the standard signal for a close goal.
Newcastle equaliser.
- It looks not to have wholly crossed the line. There is no conculsive evidence either way but if I had to take a guess from the replays, I'd say it remained an inch or two in. I don't see how the AR can call the goal with that much doubt. The position of the keeper could have mislead him.
- AR signal was confusing. It looked like a defensive free kick signal. Not the standard signal for a close goal.
one
RefChat Addict
Two pages of reading that could have been summarises to two small posts 
Maybe a learing opportunity for us mere mortals in terms of AR positioning.
It is impossible to be in an absolute correct position for every situation as football is such a dynamic sport. However, if we did have the opportunity in this case, where would that perfect position be?
For me, what is generally taught, being exactly in line (on top of) goal line is not perfect. It means if the ball is slightly over the goal line, the gap would be blocked by the goal post. Being (line of sight) very slightly outside the goal line removes that issue. Being slightly inside the gloaline also remove the issue but increases the margin of error due to the angle of view.
Maybe a learing opportunity for us mere mortals in terms of AR positioning.
It is impossible to be in an absolute correct position for every situation as football is such a dynamic sport. However, if we did have the opportunity in this case, where would that perfect position be?
For me, what is generally taught, being exactly in line (on top of) goal line is not perfect. It means if the ball is slightly over the goal line, the gap would be blocked by the goal post. Being (line of sight) very slightly outside the goal line removes that issue. Being slightly inside the gloaline also remove the issue but increases the margin of error due to the angle of view.
Runner Ref
RefChat Addict
I can guarantee you I reached higher levels than the majority of the site. That isn’t a dig at people, but if you want to go down that route, we can.
I simply don’t agree with people having the idea that referees are never wrong. That is never going develop officials or make the relationship between officials in and the wider football audience better. And right now, we sure as hell need that.
And no, daylight isn’t a thing. If pundits on MoTD used it to describe a scenario of how an official was wrong, there would be uproar on here.
Law tells us that all of the ball must be over all of the line for it to be a goal. It is a matter of fact that for that to be the case, if you're looking from the perfect angle, there would be daylight between the goalposts and the ball. It doesn't require the word 'daylight' to be written in law, because it is a factual deduction from the words that are in law.
To compare that to offside is ludicrous, because a player can have one particular body part closer to the goal line than the last defender and that be offside but clearly that will never equate to daylight between them, although if Wenger got his way the law would change and then we would be looking for daylight.
To compare that to offside is ludicrous, because a player can have one particular body part closer to the goal line than the last defender and that be offside but clearly that will never equate to daylight between them, although if Wenger got his way the law would change and then we would be looking for daylight.
Let's face it, we all guess at decisions on occasion.... based on the balance of probabilities.
No Human Being has the ability to say whether this ball crossed the line at the speed it rebounded. The AR judged that it did but unfortunately replays show he was fractionally wrong. I would not support his decision.
I'm surprised this discussion has caused such a stir. In the absence of GLT, these very difficult judgements will sometimes go for and against you.
The ethos of sport and the rub of the green. No need for folk to get riled. Leave upsetting people to me!
No Human Being has the ability to say whether this ball crossed the line at the speed it rebounded. The AR judged that it did but unfortunately replays show he was fractionally wrong. I would not support his decision.
I'm surprised this discussion has caused such a stir. In the absence of GLT, these very difficult judgements will sometimes go for and against you.
The ethos of sport and the rub of the green. No need for folk to get riled. Leave upsetting people to me!
I don't think anyone has said that referees are never wrong, rather, and understandably as this is a refereeing forum, people look towards what the reasons might be that referees got things wrong. Although caveat that with we have absolutely no idea whether the AR got this wrong or not, no one has managed to find an angle that proves it one way or another.
Regardless of what level you reached, alarm bells should surely be ringing for you that you are annoying people to the extent that multiple of them are talking about adding you to their blocked lists. A little pointless you posting if no one actually sees what you write, so perhaps a little more respect to fellow members would see that blocked list threat used less often?
Runner Ref
RefChat Addict
You’re joking, right? The main chap in question has admitted he will never criticise or say referees have made an error. As I’ve said multiple times, that is of no use to anyone.
I’m not that bothered if people want to add me to the block list. If anything, it may save me from them responding with crackers such as Michael Oliver is a strong character.
soybrummie
New Member
Anyone else think the 4th official might have convinced the ref to award the goal? Linesman is clearly signally for a foul to Birmingham, and if you watch it back a defender does get his foot stepped on just before the flag goes up. I'm wondering if the lino is taking the flack for the 4th official.
Not a chance. 0%
one
RefChat Addict
No no no. A 'linesman' at that level does not flag for a foul from the position he is at especially where there is such a close call goal in play and the referee has a more credible position for a foul.
If you have a look, after the signal he runs tward the half way, that is a sign he thinks its a goal. Also these guys have comms. You won't have a case of the the AR signalling defensive foul but referee signalling goal.
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Runner Ref
RefChat Addict
On the plus side, you’ve probably just raised a point all of us will agree on. Naff all chance this is what happened
Additionally to all of the above reasons why that didn't happen, and having worked with comms this season as a 4th official and AR, I believe that every single referee I've worked with would tell every single 4th official I've worked with to go forth and multiply rather rapidly, if a 4th official tried to advise a referee to award a goal in a tight goal line scenario. And I think there would be words exchanged in the changing room after too.
He isn't signalling a foul, rather I'm pretty sure he was using the old style signal for indicating a goal.
Plus, as others have said, no 4th official at that level would ever dream of telling an AR who is a metre or two from the corner flag that the ball had crossed the line. They would be laughed out of town.
soybrummie
New Member
Only the 4th official saw the Zidane headbutt in 2006 WC final 