The Ref Stop

What flag signal to make.

OldNavyRef

OldNavyRef

RefChat Addict
Level 5 Referee
So corner, ball crosses the line, but get scooped out the goal. (I raise my flag indicating a goal, same as an offside, but keeping the flag raised). Then the attackers slam the ball into the back of the net.

So I lower the flag, as I'm happy a goal has been scored and run to the halfway line.

A few people had noticed the flag so start saying a load of rubbish. Ref comes over, did you flag for the ball crossing the line "yes". Jobs a good one.

So question is, once flag goes up, keep it up?
 
The Ref Stop
As far as I know, there isn't an official signal or guidance for this. But happy to be proven wrong.

My pre-match for these situations was for the AR to hold flag straight up in their left hand, as this signal can't be confused with anything else. Hold your position for a few seconds on goal line to sell decision, then get up towards halfway
 
Raise the flag until you have the referees attention and then sprint up towards the half way line.
Can be confusing as, as you say, the initial flag raise is the same as offside, but the secondary movement completes the signal.
 
Runner Ref said:
As far as I know, there isn't an official signal or guidance for this. But happy to be proven wrong.
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Allow me to oblige 🙂

Screenshot_20240925-153101.png

@OldNavyRef This is a very rare situation... But it's all about time management in these situations. As it reads the ball ended up in the goal (again) very quickly afterwards. Don't be hasty with the signal and it could lead to not even having to raise the flag at all.
I find this easier with electronic flags because you can buzz, signal (think mirror, signal manoeuvre i.e. that is ball over line / buzz the referee, make eye contact, signal -with or without flag ) which gives you some extra time.
 
OldNavyRef said:
So corner, ball crosses the line, but get scooped out the goal. (I raise my flag indicating a goal, same as an offside, but keeping the flag raised). Then the attackers slam the ball into the back of the net.

So I lower the flag, as I'm happy a goal has been scored and run to the halfway line.

A few people had noticed the flag so start saying a load of rubbish. Ref comes over, did you flag for the ball crossing the line "yes". Jobs a good one.

So question is, once flag goes up, keep it up?
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Should have been included in the pre-match briefing, but very few referees do include it as it is a rare occurrence.
Flag in left hand is favoured, to avoid confusion with an offside signal.
Important to stay on the goal line long enough for players to be aware of your excellent position when judging.
 
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
Should have been included in the pre-match briefing, but very few referees do include it as it is a rare occurrence.
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I disagree. I don't think there is value in spending the pre match talking about flag signals that in reality the AR should know. There are far more important variable things that a referee should cover in their pre-match, not flag signals that will never change and are very unlikely to come up anyway. If you went to the nth degree covering all of that, not only would your pre-match be very long, it would also lose it's impact.
 
The process is mentioned above. Though not the case in OP, if ball is still seemingly in play, after raising flag keep it up until referee stops play just in case he may be thinking you are flagging for something he can play advantage on.

Also, flag signals are for communicating outcomes. There is nothing in law saying you or the referee can't use verbal communication as well as signals. If I as referee or AR ever feel that there is doubt or confusion, I yell out the intent of the signal (there are exceptions when AR). In OP perhaps saying "goal" loudly as soon as referee looks at you would have helped.
 
Which hand to use has generated much debate before, and not just in here. In England we were always told to use the left hand so as to avoid confusion with a possible offside signal, wait by the corner flag for everyone to see you then sidestep down the line agitating the flag. This now seems to have changed to just raise the flag in the right hand.

I prefer the old method personally. It is relatively rare for an AR to signal a defensive free kick from a set piece, whereas it is very common for them to signal an offside at a set piece. So to me it makes more sense to use the least used signal as that is least likely to cause any confusion.
 
I think left hand works better as that is consistent to the restart.
When there is a close goal/no goal the referee is going to look at the AR anyway so any flag raising here should be clear indicator and then nice little bomb it up the line to seal the deal
 
As I said earlier, left hand for me all day. If you’re in a pinball situation in the PA and your AR sticks flag up, you really need to know straightaway whether they’re saying goal or offside.

It’s strange that there has never been official guidance on this
 
If the ball crosses the goal line for a goal kick or corner kick the flag is in the right hand. Therefore, logically, if the ball crosses the goal line for a goal, then you would think same should apply. As also per the extract James has copied at thread 4, from the final sentence it appears clear to me that the initial signal would be to raise the flag vertically in right hand to indicate the ball has crossed the goal-line and to use left arm to point in the direction of the half way line to indicate a goal.
 
David G said:
If the ball crosses the goal line for a goal kick or corner kick the flag is in the right hand. Therefore, logically, if the ball crosses the goal line for a goal, then you would think same should apply. As also per the extract James has copied at thread 4, from the final sentence it appears clear to me that the initial signal would be to raise the flag vertically in right hand to indicate the ball has crossed the goal-line and to use left arm to point in the direction of the half way line to indicate a goal.
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Why is it clear to be in the right hand? Not that it matters too much which hand, but I don’t understand how you’ve deciphered it clearly is right.

If anything, left makes more logical sense since expectation is flag would already be in your left hand.
 
Really! It was an opinion and my wording was “appears clear”. Makes no logical sense to me for the flag to be in the left hand (for the reason mentioned), but you are entitled to your opinion and if that works for the AR and Referee and clear to all, then that seems fine without any clear guidance/diagram in the LotG. I have seen two right hand/left arm examples already this season. At the end of the day the left/right arm rationale can depend on the direction of play eg if the attack is towards the half of the FoP of the active Assistant and follows a shot on goal, then the flag would initially and presumably be in the left hand. However, if from a corner kick etc then perhaps could be in the right hand. Perhaps why there is no guidance/diagram in the LotG
 
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Right hand up here. Eye contact. Run.

But people use your voice. Nod.

There are no surprises if the AR is shouting “goal, goal, whole ball over the line” at grassroots, on comms, whatever!
 
What about an outstretched left hand towards the centre circle and a run up the line towards it?

Albeit this is not what the guidance says ..
 
Redref34 said:
What about an outstretched left hand towards the centre circle and a run up the line towards it?

Albeit this is not what the guidance says ..
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The issue with that is we have a flag for a reason - it is much easier for the ref to see it. So we should use it for any AR signal.
It would not be too difficult to come up with a better signal for this e.g. flag up in right hand + left hand point towards halfway line.
 
CaptainsPlease said:
The issue with that is we have a flag for a reason - it is much easier for the ref to see it. So we should use it for any AR signal.
It would not be too difficult to come up with a better signal for this e.g. flag up in right hand + left hand point towards halfway line.
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Problem is Comms. The head of the game don't really care too much about intricate flag signals as comm kits remove the ambiguity.

So us spuds in grassroots gotta make do.
 
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