A&H

Match fees - again

Most people seem to look at it as either doing it for the love of the game or for money. To look at things in such black and white terms is false for most people imo.

I love the game and its a hobby of mine, but I don't love it enough to do it for a nominal fee that's for sure. Far too many aspects of reffing are not enjoyable. The fee and the enjoyment are a formula, they are not separate entities.

I have a company vehicle so I'm fortunate to not have to pay for fuel. If I left my role and lost my vehicle/fuel card then there's no way I'm travelling any real distance at all on a Sunday morning for a £30 flat fee. I just don't enjoy it that much. I enjoy it to an extent, but I want the money to put towards something else I enjoy too. Otherwise I'll play Vets footy or golf etc.

As a 38 year old level 4, I've no great desire or ability to get to the standard where the money becomes decent, so I will do the leagues which I can make enough money on to have a week in the sun in the winter and one in the summer. That's the winning equation for me. To summarise, I have to enjoy it most of the time and I have to earn enough from it to pay for other things I enjoy. I also want the challenge of step 5/6 football so that's in the equation too. No black and white here and everyone's equation changes as their life changes
 
The Referee Store
Birmingham FA have decided that assistants only get 50% of the refs fee and that travel expenses are no longer allowed.

Net result Midland Football League has set the fees at Referee £70, Assistant £35
 
RustyRef said:
Be careful what you wish for, as if you talk about minimum wage HMRC could easily say that any referee fee is subject to your prevailing rate of income tax. That would turn your £25 into £18.75 or £15 depending on your tax rate.
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y’all don’t have to pay inc9me tax on referee fees?! In the US it is clearly income that has to be reported to the US and is subje t to ordinary income tax.
 
socal lurker said:
y’all don’t have to pay inc9me tax on referee fees?! In the US it is clearly income that has to be reported to the US and is subje t to ordinary income tax.
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Everyone has a different opinion but the tax law here allows you to earn up £1000 before expenses without declaring it.
Lots and lots of referees don't declare the income when legally they should but it's long been assumed that HMRC (UK version of IRS) won't go after referee fees due to the small amounts involved.
 
Quarryref said:
My view is the same as the one I had when I was playing (admittedly mainly in the lower echelons of) semi-pro football.

If I'm not enjoying it, I'm never going to earn enough to be worth the amount of my non-work time spent on it & I should do something else.

If I am enjoying it, I'm getting paid to do something I love, so what's not to like ?

My only caveat is I'm not having people taking the p***. The only time I really feel that now I am refereeing is with the occasional (not most) club who turn their nose up at an extra £10 for travel expenses because the FA have sent me miles, but will happily pay some 3rd rate Billy Big-B****cks striker £250 a game - and then still expect they are getting a Premier League referee.
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Yes that's a fair point about some just taking the michael.

Best illustrated by the many varied fees attached to the requests that come via county.

I know its best dealt with my not volunteering for the lower paid ones, but a bit like changing channels on your TV, just because you're not doing the game/watching the TV show doesn't mean they don't exist!

Would it be THAT controversial to set a minimum fee for middles/ARs - even if you need 2 or 3 to allow for age groups/gender?
 
JamesL said:
Everyone has a different opinion but the tax law here allows you to earn up £1000 before expenses without declaring it.
Lots and lots of referees don't declare the income when legally they should but it's long been assumed that HMRC (UK version of IRS) won't go after referee fees due to the small amounts involved.
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Two words - Derby County - you're right, they have bigger fish to worry about! :p
 
bester said:
Birmingham FA have decided that assistants only get 50% of the refs fee and that travel expenses are no longer allowed.

Net result Midland Football League has set the fees at Referee £70, Assistant £35
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They must be confident that they can fill their AR quota. I'm not sure I am!
 
Ben448844 said:
They must be confident that they can fill their AR quota. I'm not sure I am!
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The intent is to get rid of assistants below supply league they assume, wrongly in my view, that these assistants will go and ref in other grassroots leagues which have dismal coverage largely due to county FA ineptitude
The midland league has assistants on Step 5 to "9"
 
bester said:
The intent is to get rid of assistants below supply league they assume, wrongly in my view, that these assistants will go and ref in other grassroots leagues which have dismal coverage largely due to county FA ineptitude
The midland league has assistants on Step 5 to "9"
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I'd be tempted to agree. I am meeting sn increasing number who are happy to line every week and I dont think would drop into adult grass roots middles
 
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I think being a grass roots football referee requires a degree of altruism. Just as observing, mentoring and coaching at that level does. On some days, certainly in my County, the fee paid is purely compensatory.
 
Kes said:
I think being a grass roots football referee requires a degree of altruism. Just as observing, mentoring and coaching at that level does. On some days, certainly in my County, the fee paid is purely compensatory.
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Massively on board with renaming our fee 'compensation'. If Refsupport got hold of that one you'd have created a monster :)
 
A few years ago I had an FA Vase line - referee drove us, it was a fair distance away and he was cautious with leaving time for traffic pre-game and insisted on socialising post-game. 7 1/2 hours from leaving until getting home for a £20 fee, not sure I'd be thrilled to repeat that experience!

In general however, £30-£40 for 3-4 hours out of the house is usually where it lands, that feels fair to me. OP is being slightly underpaid either way IMO, but also I prefer Middles, so that would definitely influence the decision.
 
I had a line as a L7 a few years ago that was a Sunday League cup semi. The match fee was £9, the referee drove me up so no mileage to bulk it up and he didn’t even buy me a pint afterwards!
I went home with £4.50 😂
 
Will_A said:
I had a line as a L7 a few years ago that was a Sunday League cup semi. The match fee was £9, the referee drove me up so no mileage to bulk it up and he didn’t even buy me a pint afterwards!
I went home with £4.50 😂
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A 'few' years ago? - is there something you're not telling us age wise? :p ;)

I started 20 years ago and even I've never seen a single figure fee!:)
 
PinnerPaul said:
A 'few' years ago? - is there something you're not telling us age wise? :p ;)

I started 20 years ago and even I've never seen a single figure fee!:)
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I’m 33! This was maybe 3 years ago. The ref got £18 + 32ppm!
 
Will_A said:
I had a line as a L7 a few years ago that was a Sunday League cup semi. The match fee was £9, the referee drove me up so no mileage to bulk it up and he didn’t even buy me a pint afterwards!
I went home with £4.50 😂
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Mileage at 32p per mile is only beneficial if you have a company vehicle, otherwise you lose money on every mile🤔
 
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