Penalty?
- Thread starter boulderdomb
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CapnBloodbeard
RefChat Addict
First one Penalty for me. If he's moved towards the ball, hand ample opportunity to react appropriately and he's simply misjudged it and missed it with his head and it's struck his hand instead, then for me that's still deliberate, and that seems to be in line with how FIFA have been going with it.
If, however, the handling occurred due to the contact from behind, then that's no foul.
The way I see it is that the player's have a responsibility to avoid handling where possible. I really think 'careless' needs to be the measure (and everything we've always been taught indicates that's more how it's applied than deliberate).
This one wasn't an accident - this was purely inattention. Careless, to put it another way.
If a player goes to kick the ball, completely misses for no real reason and gets an opponent instead, that's a foul.
If a player goes to head the ball, completely misses for no real reason and handles it instead, shouldn't that also be a foul?
I do think the DBH law is in desperate need of a drastic rewrite. There are too many scenarios which aren't really covered by it (like when a player tries to control it with a raised thigh and it deflects into an arm - I don't think the laws give any guidance at all there), and we also have the problem that FIFA seem to secretly be changing the law without changing the law, purely by providing instructions to top tier referees that seemingly directly contradict the law (such as the nonsense about accidental handling on a slide tackle/block always being a foul).
2nd one, he's moved his arm towards the ball for me. So foul.
It's a little difficult to tell from these angles. If he was trying to move away I'd let him have it, but I think that for whatever reason he's responded to the shot poorly and leaned towards it. Probably with the instinct to move across to block it.
I think the fact that he raised his foot supports the idea that his reaction was to try to block the ball - it's consistent with a blocking action. So he's done that with the unfortunate outcome that the only part of his body that is blocking the ball is the arm.
was as a defender
If, however, the handling occurred due to the contact from behind, then that's no foul.
The way I see it is that the player's have a responsibility to avoid handling where possible. I really think 'careless' needs to be the measure (and everything we've always been taught indicates that's more how it's applied than deliberate).
This one wasn't an accident - this was purely inattention. Careless, to put it another way.
If a player goes to kick the ball, completely misses for no real reason and gets an opponent instead, that's a foul.
If a player goes to head the ball, completely misses for no real reason and handles it instead, shouldn't that also be a foul?
I do think the DBH law is in desperate need of a drastic rewrite. There are too many scenarios which aren't really covered by it (like when a player tries to control it with a raised thigh and it deflects into an arm - I don't think the laws give any guidance at all there), and we also have the problem that FIFA seem to secretly be changing the law without changing the law, purely by providing instructions to top tier referees that seemingly directly contradict the law (such as the nonsense about accidental handling on a slide tackle/block always being a foul).
2nd one, he's moved his arm towards the ball for me. So foul.
It's a little difficult to tell from these angles. If he was trying to move away I'd let him have it, but I think that for whatever reason he's responded to the shot poorly and leaned towards it. Probably with the instinct to move across to block it.
I think the fact that he raised his foot supports the idea that his reaction was to try to block the ball - it's consistent with a blocking action. So he's done that with the unfortunate outcome that the only part of his body that is blocking the ball is the arm.
Most of my playing time
was as a defender
Why would he?
For handling the ball in the goal line? For DOGSO maybe?
CapnBloodbeard
RefChat Addict
Have you watched it? He most definitely wasn't on the goal line!!!
The handling is by the guy near the penalty mark. The player on the goal line never touches the ball, as the handling prior put it wide.
The guy who handles (#7) likely should've been cautioned for it though.
CapnBloodbeard
RefChat Addict
I'm honestly confused. How is 'near the penalty mark' 'on the goal line'?
There were 2 players behind the one who handled it. But I agree with @AlexF that he should have been cautioned
I thought the handling was called on that guy (32) on the goal line.
I was wondering that it was f*cking bad call, but that explains it, I was looking at the wrong guy
I was wondering that it was f*cking bad call, but that explains it, I was looking at the wrong guy
Say what you see @Robbe1
Ciley Myrus
RefChat Addict
First one no.
Second one yes. But coaching point, I detest that referee standing there pointing to the spot nodding his head. To me it comes across that he is trying to convince people. Staying static there encourages players to protest. You make yourself a shooting duck. For me fine pointing into the spot at start but then dont stand still and let players harass you, he should have headed to left and then anyone who comes to you can be met with yc if needed, instead of the ref here going into a crowd of players
Second one yes. But coaching point, I detest that referee standing there pointing to the spot nodding his head. To me it comes across that he is trying to convince people. Staying static there encourages players to protest. You make yourself a shooting duck. For me fine pointing into the spot at start but then dont stand still and let players harass you, he should have headed to left and then anyone who comes to you can be met with yc if needed, instead of the ref here going into a crowd of players
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Despite what i said earlier in the post, I may also have given the second penalty. I'm not sure about cognitive intent, but the defender does a very poor job at getting out the way. Proximity -> Penalty, Arm towards the ball -> Penalty
More interesting is the referee's sheepish behavior as you've pointed out. We've all been there when we're not 100%
It's not easy, when our instant gut feeling is doh! But once the whistle has found itself being blown, we have to have a practiced routine whereby the players don't sense any sign of the doh!
Ciley Myrus
RefChat Addict
Yes, leaving the decision aside, it came across like the notion of the more you convince yourself that something in everyday life happened, you eventually start to believe it did (even if it clearly did not)
You learn new words every week on here..... 'Cognitive Intent'.... A beautiful pair of words, used together they evince the malice aforethought-fullness of the perpetrator!!! 