A&H

Two footed tackle

refdave83

refdave83

RefChat Addict
Level 7 Referee
Are all 2 footed tackles a RC.


I had one in today's game. An U14 game. The reds were dirty at times and at least one player was close to a YC for PI. Then from a few yards away a red goes in with two feet. All the greens go made. Player is not injured.

I call him over. In my mind yes it was a YC all day long. I could easily sell a RC. I told him that it was a 2 footed challenge. He didn't argue and I used a YC. I am just not sure if it should have been a RC or not
 
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2-footed > Red card all day long, regardless of whether the player is injured cause once you let one off with just a YC they're all YCs so could cause a few problems if players pick up on whats happening
 
Agree, It doesnt matter on how the player fouled ended up. As soon as a two footed tackle goes in like that. The red card comes straight out !
 
Careless, reckless or excessive force?
Silly, stupid/cynical or safety (endangering an opponent's)

Was he in FULL control of his body?
If not, it's a RC.

Just to add more on my second line - C/R/EF is very general. I use the second line more. If you were describing the challenge to a 13/14 year old (this is at all levels), which word would you use to simplify to them? Silly, stupid/cynical or safety. Silly = foul. Stupid/cynical = YC. Safety = RC.
 
Looking back I think I should have sent him. It would have been an easy sell. No one complained about the YC but its all a learning curve.

Last Monday I was fortunate enough to meet EPL referee Kevin Friend. One of the many points I took away was to keep your eye on the player that has just kicked the ball for a late challenge. I took this on board but STUPIDLY failed to apply it in yesterday's game. If I had done I would have had to send a player of for VC. For kicking a player. Annoying but I def learnt that bit.
 
it does sound like a red dave and I think Dan has put it so much better than i could. I think the fact that you are thinking that YC isn't enough is probably a good clue that you feel you should have acted more firmly.

the reason im commenting, I gave my first red in a game the other day, and it didnt seem as clear cut as it probably was. in the match officials course I remember vividly one of the tutors saying that if you find yourself saying "oof" or cringing after a challenge has gone in, thats a good guideline for excessive force. iv watched many a game of football, and this seemed logical... in my game this wasnt really the case. it was the 86th minute, a lad who thought he had been fouled a few moments before- lunges in with both feet, around knee high, from behind. Right under my nose.

writing this now, it sounds the clearest red you've ever heard of. but in the game I didn't cringe, it wasnt really using EF and the opponent was fine (understandably annoyed!). as I called him over my first reaction was yellow card but i took a few moments to calm everyone down, send the small "card him ref" committee away and replayed it in my head=> Not using excessive force, but high, from behind and he had INTENDED to hurt his opponent in my opinion. I took the decision and showed him the red. no complaints.

the thing that shocked me was when i was writing the misconduct report and describing the incident- it was such a clear cut red on paper, and i had so nearly cautioned him. I think what helped me at the time was taking a moment, replaying the challenge in my head, and trying to look past my gut reaction of what I saw to the intentions behind it. maybe I got it wrong and in the 86th minute a YC would have been enough, but I felt on reflection that I had just about got it right.
 
and sorry to double post, but I just saw the kicking thing. i think again youve got to put it in context.

In the same game as above, I gave a YC to a player for kicking an opponent after he had been fouled. it was earlier in the game, around 30th minute. Probably a red by law, but it was petulant rather than aggressive, and it was a frustration thing. Blew my whistle like I was coming down on him like a ton of bricks, put on my firm voice and told him to come over. spent a good few minutes giving him a verbal mauling, and told him he was fortunate to walk away with a YC. didnt hear a peep from him the rest of the game, and nobody from either side complained. no reaction tackles, and rest of game was played in good feeling (up to the last five minutes anyway!)

I know technically it is VC, and many refs will be thinking 'you fool' but i thought it was job well done in my book. sometimes we are too eager to go to cards i think when a stern telling off can do the trick. having said that, if someone kicks someone to hurt them, off they go.
 
Thanks Gaz. What I should have done I should have took my time in carding the player and played the incident over in my head. Like you did.

Like I said I could have sold a RC easily as it was a two footed tackle. I think that was my 1st two footed challenge. So was shocked to see it really.

I was thinking it over all last night and I keep thinking to myself why oh why did I only issue a YC. If an assessor was there I would have been screwed.

Thanks guys
 
i reckon its how you take on board your crap games (many in my case!) and turn them into good games that makes you a decent ref :) I had a shocker two weeks ago, then had the best game Ive had (in my opinion) the week after.
the best tip Iv picked up from a ref- i lined for my mate a little while ago (pre-qualifying) and he would always not say a word other than "go away" when cautioning/dismissing until the players surrounding him had left. i think a great way to buy yourself some time to think about challenges, something I try to do (not always easy when the player himself is mouthing off!)
 
As Gaz says, it's extremely important to take your time. Obviously, if you see a punch or an extremely obvious RC, do it straight away. But for anything else, buy yourself time. Is there an injured player? Easy time-buying by going to him, calling trainer on etc.

Just an added tip that I got told this season. If heart and head both say red, it's red. If both say yellow, it's yellow. The 'grey' area is when one says one, and the other says different!
 
Are all 2-footed challenges red card offences? No.

In addition to what was posted above the following was issued as guidance a few seasons back and makes a good rule of thumb:

Contact with player: Red - Serious Foul Play
Contact with ball AND player: Red - Serious Foul Play
Contact with ball only, if an opponent is in possession or playing distance: Free kick. Sanction applied at your discretion. Consider speed, force, was he looking at the ball or the player?.
No contact with ball or opponent: Free kick. Sanction applied at your discretion. Consider speed, force, was he looking at the ball or the player?
 
Once again the "violent" tackle rears it ugly head! You'll know in your stomach if it's a red or only a yellow, and whether your match control and credibility will disappear if you get the colour wrong! GO WITH YOUR GUT, mine's usually right. Player reaction, as long as it's not OTT, is also a good guide; use it to your advantage, but don't rely on it. RELY ON YOUR GUT!
 
I think I could have sold a RC but it was right in front of the "victims" bench and none of them complained about a YC
 
I had a 2 footed tackle in my game last Saturday, knew straight away that it was excessive force and there were no complaints from either set of players. As it's been said, you know which tackles are the RC tackles when you say the imaginary 'ouch' as the tackle goes in. Luckily not much contact was made, but on another day it could have been a lot worse.
 
Gaz said:
and sorry to double post, but I just saw the kicking thing. i think again youve got to put it in context.

In the same game as above, I gave a YC to a player for kicking an opponent after he had been fouled. it was earlier in the game, around 30th minute. Probably a red by law, but it was petulant rather than aggressive, and it was a frustration thing. Blew my whistle like I was coming down on him like a ton of bricks, put on my firm voice and told him to come over. spent a good few minutes giving him a verbal mauling, and told him he was fortunate to walk away with a YC. didnt hear a peep from him the rest of the game, and nobody from either side complained. no reaction tackles, and rest of game was played in good feeling (up to the last five minutes anyway!)

I know technically it is VC, and many refs will be thinking 'you fool' but i thought it was job well done in my book. sometimes we are too eager to go to cards i think when a stern telling off can do the trick. having said that, if someone kicks someone to hurt them, off they go.
Click to expand...

I had something similar in a game I refereed. After a player was tackled I looked back to see him kick the player who fouled him. This being my second ever league game as referee I wanted to stick to the laws so I sent him off. It was a reasonably nice game until that moment and annoyingly players from both teams claimed that I had ruined the game. Looking back at it, even though he did kick the player and it was VC it was hardly a forceful kick and I feel a quiet word would have done as with the red card I seemed to lose some respect from the players.

Also I'll ask this while I'm here. When I blew up to send the player off I restarted with a free-kick at where the foul had taken place though play had moved on for about five seconds since the original tackle and the ball was at least 20 yards away. Was this the right decision??
 
When I did my course a while ago, they really drilled it into you that the free kick is from where the offence occurred, so if you blew up for one player hurling abuse at another player 30 yards away, the free kick would be taken from where the player was stood that was hurling the abuse. On my course, they really made sure we knew that, they didn't stop speaking about it - but it has worked! Hope that helps
 
I'd take it back to where the infringement was. Imagine if the ball had rolled into the penalty area, would you then make it a penalty or would you take it back to where it happened. That's the way that I looked at it.

At least it worked then Jojo.
 
I agree with what you say Charlie, and I would do the same, but I was just letting him know what I was taught.
 
I wasn't undermining you, just saying that at least them hammering it into you made you remember it :3
 
It did work - they hammered a lot into me in the 2 days! But it has worked!
 
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