A&H

Red Card in U13

L

Lillias

New Member
Level 7 Referee
Hi I had to give my first card in a game on Saturday.
The player got tackled by the opposition, I played advantage. The player wasn’t happy kicked the ball out of play and the started pushing the opposition player in the chest knocking him down on his knees.
Both coaches agreed it was the correct decision but the gathering of parents didn’t. I am confident that sending him off was the right thing to do but I just seem to have a little voice doubting myself.
 
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Hard to give advice on specific situations without being present.

Below is the criteria for issuing a red card for violent conduct from IFAB - if you felt the push that you saw met excessive force, then you were correct in law.

“Violent conduct is when a player uses or attempts to use excessive force or brutality against an opponent when not challenging for the ball, or against a team-mate, team official, match official, spectator or any other person, regardless of whether contact is made.
In addition, a player who, when not challenging for the ball, deliberately strikes an opponent or any other person on the head or face with the hand or arm, is guilty of violent conduct unless the force used was negligible.”

Only advice I would give - is there something that you could have done to avoid the situation happening in the first place? How was the temperature of the game? Where on the pitch was the initial foul? How promising was the advantage? The player mustn’t have felt he was better off by carrying on - so if you had given a free kick, could the whole thing have been avoided?

But sometimes there’s nothing you can do, especially at that age. I wouldn’t worry too much about the parents, they’re never satisfied, the fact both coaches thought the correct decision was made should provide you with some comfort.
 
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Usually if it's a push at the body, I tend to go caution, 'handbags' as they call it.

But it's what you see on the day, if you thought it was excessive or violent conduct, then you're within your rights. Whilst I don't put much stock in the opinions of coaches/manager, both coaches agreeing is probably a sign that you got it right on the day IMO.
 
RobOda said:
Usually if it's a push at the body, I tend to go caution, 'handbags' as they call it.

But it's what you see on the day, if you thought it was excessive or violent conduct, then you're within your rights. Whilst I don't put much stock in the opinions of coaches/manager, both coaches agreeing is probably a sign that you got it right on the day IMO.
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Agreed. As a player I’ve been sent off for a shove in the chest but I’ve seen yellows given for the same. It’s very contextual.
 
Certainly sounds like giving the initial fk would have been more beneficial, and, sensible, than the advantage. Remember advantage means its more beneficial to the team to play on, than it would be to award the foul. And as correctly noted above, we consider the tempo of the game, the player fouled, and dare i say it, its u13, so its already sounding like awarding the foul is better for the team
The fouled player of course is in control, or not, of his own actions, and,of course we dont have a crystal ball. Ww do however need to be proactive and think ahead, ( what if.?), and, gauge reaction quickly ( right he still has the ball but he getting bit irate),
Does the player even know you are playing advantage, does he hear your shout and/or recognise your arm signal.
the fact the player was not happy is leaning us alrready to think in his mind, the freekick was preferable.
Violent conduct needs excessive force and or brutality. If you felt the push had that, then its vc. Pushing into the chest, even if the other player gets grounded, is aggression over violence for me, however fully understand it could be an act of violence in someone elses eyes.

we never pay attention to coaches, just lip service, take the gd with the bad but personal boost i guess if the coaches say you got it right

yc for me
 
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Ben448844 said:
There's no brutality with a push to the chest. It's not a "strike". I think its a pretty standard yellow these days.
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It's a hard one, because pushing someone hard enough so that they fall to the floor can definitely meet the criteria of 'excessive force' however lots of variables, could have been a minor shove with the opponent off balance as an example.

My advice, give what you see and don't over think it. 99/100 your gut feel will be right as to whether it's a yellow or a red and part of refereeing is to learn to trust your instincts.

As you go up through the age groups, players and coaches will try to influence you more, the offending team will want to downplay incidents trying to get you go yellow, when you are thinking red. Likewise the offended against team will be wanting to put doubt in your mind that it's 'only a yellow' and try to get you to think it's a red.

Give yourself a bit of thinking time and make your decision based on what you've seen and your feel for the offence.

Once done, try not to dwell on it and second guess yourself, you could think about whether it was preventable as others have said, but don't beat yourself up on whether it's a red or a yellow.
 
Justylove said:
As you go up through the age groups, players and coaches will try to influence you more, the offending team will want to downplay incidents trying to get you go yellow, when you are thinking red.
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This is the biggest red flag for me that I have seen a red card offence.
 
Technically hes committed 2 bookable offences Hes kicked the ball away then pushed the player in the chest. If a player commits a bookable offence then before you get chance to book him (Advantage etc) he commits another bookable offence he commits another 1 then you can send him off for 2 bookable offences. Only ever seen it happen once and that was a mansfield player think it was Aidy Boothroyd away at Scarborough in the mid 90s. He fouled somebody and before the ref could book him he kicked the ball away so the ref booked him for the foul then shoes a yellow then a red for kicking fhe ball away. We covered that scenario in my refs course in 97 and was told it was perfectly legal its a way round it in future.
 
Justylove said:
It's a hard one, because pushing someone hard enough so that they fall to the floor can definitely meet the criteria of 'excessive force' however lots of variables, could have been a minor shove with the opponent off balance as an example.

My advice, give what you see and don't over think it. 99/100 your gut feel will be right as to whether it's a yellow or a red and part of refereeing is to learn to trust your instincts.

As you go up through the age groups, players and coaches will try to influence you more, the offending team will want to downplay incidents trying to get you go yellow, when you are thinking red. Likewise the offended against team will be wanting to put doubt in your mind that it's 'only a yellow' and try to get you to think it's a red.

Give yourself a bit of thinking time and make your decision based on what you've seen and your feel for the offence.

Once done, try not to dwell on it and second guess yourself, you could think about whether it was preventable as others have said, but don't beat yourself up on whether it's a red or a yellow.
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I reffed an under 14s match when i was around 15 and i sent a player off for denial of a goal scoring opportunity in the 1st 10 minutes and i had both coaches on trying to get me to change my mind and i refused they appealed with both coaches as witnesses and lost instead of costing the player 16 quid and a 7 day ban. He had to pay 25 quid hearing costs and lost his 25 quid deposit plus had to pay the inital 16 quid fine and serve the ban aswell. I was being assesed that day and the assesor told me afterwards he would of kicked my backside if i hadnt sent him off.
 
mattmtfc said:
I reffed an under 14s match when i was around 15 and i sent a player off for denial of a goal scoring opportunity in the 1st 10 minutes and i had both coaches on trying to get me to change my mind and i refused they appealed with both coaches as witnesses and lost instead of costing the player 16 quid and a 7 day ban. He had to pay 25 quid hearing costs and lost his 25 quid deposit plus had to pay the inital 16 quid fine and serve the ban aswell. I was being assesed that day and the assesor told me afterwards he would of kicked my backside if i hadnt sent him off.
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costs, fines, length of ban etc, nothing to do with refereeing, purely league/fa admin
 
mattmtfc said:
Technically hes committed 2 bookable offences Hes kicked the ball away then pushed the player in the chest. If a player commits a bookable offence then before you get chance to book him (Advantage etc) he commits another bookable offence he commits another 1 then you can send him off for 2 bookable offences. Only ever seen it happen once and that was a mansfield player think it was Aidy Boothroyd away at Scarborough in the mid 90s. He fouled somebody and before the ref could book him he kicked the ball away so the ref booked him for the foul then shoes a yellow then a red for kicking fhe ball away. We covered that scenario in my refs course in 97 and was told it was perfectly legal its a way round it in future.
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In the post that started this, the player did not "kick the ball away" after a free kick award, as advantage was played.
 
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