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RefJef

RefJef

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Just seen this. Took me a while to work out what has happened- it seems the ball has hit the wheel at the base of the goal and spun back onto. 5he pitch. Defender has then caught the ball and thrown it back to the keeper. Nearly everyone (including ref) thinks it’s a goal kick, but there is the odd shout for a penalty. Ref consults with assistant and gives penalty.

I must admit, if this were me, I’d be looking to not give a penalty her. Thoughts?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1515758528346169353
 
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No chance. If the ball hit the wheel either the goal isn't placed correctly or the ball went out of play for a goal kick, the wheels have to be more than a ball's diameter from the goal line for obvious reasons.

I suspect the assistant has thought the ball hit the post rather than the wheel. There's an argument to say that the referee should have seen it didn't hit the post, but the AR has really chucked him under the bus there in signalling for a penalty. Look at the reaction of the players, no one is shouting for a penalty when the defender catches it.
 
Certain it hits the wheel. Can't be certain of it goes out or not.
Spirit of the game here is a GK. Not strictly correct in law (if the ball doesn't go out) but I would argue this is similar to those ropes across 4/3g pitches.
As Rusty says if the wheel is so close then it shouldn't be there, simples! and if it shouldn't be there it's an outside influence.

I had a really wierd one, which Thankfully didn't impact the game. At a step 4 ground I frequent as an assistant referee they have a horizontal bar that connects the post and the base of the mobile goals. For what reason it is there I can't tell. But the keeper r pushed the ball, it hit this part of the frame, bobble along the line and there was a ayer for a tap in. The club claimed from their camera that the original shot had gone in but I don't think there was conclusive evidence to say it was. I might be able to find the clip.

Finally, no referee wants this AR getting involved here. It's this precise getting involved when not required that could be the determining factor in this referee not being promoted. And that could happen whatever the decision, as at least one team is now going to be irked by the refereeing TEAM. As soon as the AR gets involved, game over.
 
JamesL said:
Certain it hits the wheel. Can't be certain of it goes out or not.
Spirit of the game here is a GK. Not strictly correct in law (if the ball doesn't go out) but I would argue this is similar to those ropes across 4/3g pitches.
As Rusty says if the wheel is so close then it shouldn't be there, simples! and if it shouldn't be there it's an outside influence.

I had a really wierd one, which Thankfully didn't impact the game. At a step 4 ground I frequent as an assistant referee they have a horizontal bar that connects the post and the base of the mobile goals. For what reason it is there I can't tell. But the keeper r pushed the ball, it hit this part of the frame, bobble along the line and there was a ayer for a tap in. The club claimed from their camera that the original shot had gone in but I don't think there was conclusive evidence to say it was. I might be able to find the clip.

Finally, no referee wants this AR getting involved here. It's this precise getting involved when not required that could be the determining factor in this referee not being promoted. And that could happen whatever the decision, as at least one team is now going to be irked by the refereeing TEAM. As soon as the AR gets involved, game over.
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It has happened before at Canvey Island, not because of the goal frame but rather there is a brick wall right behind the goal. You can't walk behind the goal there to check the nets as they are fastened to the wall (or at least used to be, haven't been there for years). There was one game where a thunderous shot went in, hit the wall and bounced back out, and the officials missed it due to the speed it bounced back off of the wall.
 
a frame that has something that prevents the ball from the field really isn’t proper. IMO, if that wheel isn’t a full ball outside the field, it is still over the goal line if the ball hits the wheel. Just the same as if you have a goal with odd ball posts that stick up for it—the ball hitting the odd ball posts should be deemed out of play. i know that isn’t in the !aws, but neither do the laws permit the wheel or the pointy ball posts.
 
Sad to see this.
Ref needs to take control here and use common sense.
Whatever the assistant is saying, the ref should own this. Annoying. Feel for the teams.
 
This is not safe refereeing!

If there is VAR, that is different, but nobody is ever going to argue the goal kick.

Although probably correct in law, AR didn’t help the ref here, at all,
 
Excellent clip.

its easy for us to sit on our couch with a cuppa and go, goal kick , real time, things might appear different. I feel ref should have taken control, thanked AR for his input and went goal kick, if it turns out it was a pk, ref can then take that responsibility too.

what had it been a club assistant?

supppse what you are praying for is the attacking team to knock the pk wide
 
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The ref needs to have a conversation with the AR here as he clearly doesn’t initially understand what is being indicated and the body language of all the players should be screaming something isn’t right.
Really good clip as it shows how alert you need to be
 
I had this happen in an academy game not too long ago. Shot was hit hard and straight, to me it appeared to hit the post and fly back out. Defender caught it and rolled it back to the keeper. Luckily, I took a second to process what i'd just seen and in that time everyone retreated to the halfway line, with not 1 shout from anyone for handball, telling me this was an obvious goal kick.
I'm not a fan at all of those wheels for this exact reason.
 
At the weekend I had a free kick taken from left hand side about 10yds from the corner of the penalty box. Cross was high and wide.

The attacking player leapt, salmon-like, taking the ball above his head and rolled it back to the keeper. He didn't realise that he was still about a yard on the pitch and had thought the ball had gone (or was about to go) out of play. There followed about 5 seconds of puzzled looks from everyone - me included!
 
Anubis said:
Excellent clip.

its easy for us to sit on our couch with a cuppa and go, goal kick , real time, things might appear different. I feel ref should have taken control, thanked AR for his input and went goal kick, if it turns out it was a pk, ref can then take that responsibility too.

what had it been a club assistant?

supppse what you are praying for is the attacking team to knock the pk wide
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I'd almost be more inclined to trust a club assistant here to be honest!

Typically CAR's run their own team's defensive line, so you would expect this to be a call the club AR is making against their own team. So either they're honest and giving what they genuinely think they've seen, or they're the stereotypical CAR and are still going to essentially give a decision that they know will lead to a penalty against their own team.
 
Viridis1886 said:
At the weekend I had a free kick taken from left hand side about 10yds from the corner of the penalty box. Cross was high and wide.

The attacking player leapt, salmon-like, taking the ball above his head and rolled it back to the keeper. He didn't realise that he was still about a yard on the pitch and had thought the ball had gone (or was about to go) out of play. There followed about 5 seconds of puzzled looks from everyone - me included!
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And what did you do?
 
The majority of portable goals I've seen around the midland area have front wheels that are closer to the front post than a balls diameter. Some can be folded back though.

Never seen any referee give anything other than a goal kick or corner kick

Had one incident where it hit a wheel and then managed to spin into the goal
 
JamesL said:
And what did you do?
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First offence was bewilderment, closely followed by handball. We restarted with a direct free kick.

I considered whether it needed to be a caution for deliberate handball, but felt that that wasn't in the spirit and it wasn't what the game needed. I also considered whether it actually was a deliberate handball. It was a deliberate catch, but as far as he was concerned he thought he was just catching a ball out of play so not perhaps a deliberate attempt to handle the ball to gain an advantage.
 
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Viridis1886 said:
First offence was bewilderment, closely followed by handball. We restarted with a direct free kick.

I considered whether it needed to be a caution for deliberate handball, but felt that that wasn't in the spirit and it wasn't what the game needed. I also considered whether it actually was a deliberate handball. It was a deliberate catch, but as far as he was concerned he thought he was just catching a ball out of play so not perhaps a deliberate attempt to handle the ball to gain an advantage.
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I had this discussion with a referee I observed. A player saw the ball was going out of play for a throw-in, jumped and caught the ball but unfortunately he was still on the pitch as was the ball, but at least in doing it he stopped another ball from going in the pond. The referee correctly gave a free kick, but to my suprise also cautioned the player. When I asked him why he just kept saying deliberate handball, and no matter how much I explained it wasn't an attempt to score and didn't break up a promising attack he just wasn't having it. Far from breaking up a promising attack, it turned what would have been a throw-in to his team (once they had got the ball back from the fish pond) into a free kick for the opposition.
 
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