The Ref Stop

Not allowed to referee on 2 consecutive days.

arbitre

arbitre

Active Member
Hi Guys,

How about shooting your own game in the foot.

The FFF, equivalent of the FA in England, have decreed that referees at all levels are no longer to referee matches on consecutive days. It is possible to be assistant one day and referee the next or vice-versa.

Here in France most adult games are played on a Sunday, with a few on Saturday evening. Saturdays are mostly used for youth matches (up to U19). There are a number of senior referees who have middled on both days for many years. Thanks to these guys the youth matches are very rarely without a referee. Now, the youth matches are being played using a coach from one team as the referee, and also to blood new referees, but the latter was always the case anyway!

I believe that this is to do with health concerns! However, many referees here always have a gentle run anyway on a Saturday if not having a match.
U19 youth matches can be tough, but the rest U17, U15, U13,U11 & U9 are easy, and it teaches the young players respect for the referee having an officially appointed match official in the middle.

Apparently most clubs are up in arms, but we will have to see if that has any effect!
 
The Ref Stop
The youth divisions in my county would have about 10 refs on a Sunday on a good day. I thought it was only the brits who came up with idiotic ideas like this. The FA can not get 100% coverage on any weekend for either Saturday or Sunday limiting refs to one game per weekend would cripple grassroots footie round here for youth.
 
It’s an intrestkng discussion being had here. As a Teen Ref I have only just moved from from youth to OA games but before that move I’d regularly be doing 3-4 game over a weekend. Often 2 alone Saturday morning simply by having games in close proximity and varying start times. The odd second game of the day I did feel as though my judgement was going a bit, but I feel the teams would still rather they had a wearing red than no ref!
 
Jeeezzzz.....is it an EU working time thing? Used to do three most weekends, an open age and two older youth matches....
 
arbitre said:
I believe that this is to do with health concerns!
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Makes sense...

When I went in for physio at the start of this season they were not impressed I had done two games on the bounce in the same day. So, I could probably see that concern being extended to games on two consecutive days.

I wouldn't mind seeing the information/evidence they making the decision based on though.
 
Some weeks il do two 70 minute games Saturday morning and we had three on a Sunday, ive told league i can only do two on a Sunday as by the time it comes to the third game i was struggling.
 
arbitre said:
Hi Guys,

How about shooting your own game in the foot.

The FFF, equivalent of the FA in England, have decreed that referees at all levels are no longer to referee matches on consecutive days. It is possible to be assistant one day and referee the next or vice-versa.

Here in France most adult games are played on a Sunday, with a few on Saturday evening. Saturdays are mostly used for youth matches (up to U19). There are a number of senior referees who have middled on both days for many years. Thanks to these guys the youth matches are very rarely without a referee. Now, the youth matches are being played using a coach from one team as the referee, and also to blood new referees, but the latter was always the case anyway!

I believe that this is to do with health concerns! However, many referees here always have a gentle run anyway on a Saturday if not having a match.
U19 youth matches can be tough, but the rest U17, U15, U13,U11 & U9 are easy, and it teaches the young players respect for the referee having an officially appointed match official in the middle.

Apparently most clubs are up in arms, but we will have to see if that has any effect!
Click to expand...
Oh dear... that is just daft.

I understand at higher levels it's important that all refs are sharp. Here, in the divisions just below the top level, it's frowned upon if you take too many games. It gets noticed and won't help with promotion. But lower down at grassroots, the most important thing is to get games refereed.

Fit refs can do a pair of serious grassroots, U14s on Sat and Sun no problem. Elite U18s, one a day, any more you are asking for trouble. But limiting youth or grassroots to alternative days is just crazy!

I wasn't at the Paris World games but at the Iber cup it was 3-5 games a day for 5 days.
 
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unwritten rule here is seniors don't do say, 2 games Sat....not just injury but travel, and also, reputation, senior ref doing kids/pub game in morning then doing top flight in afternoon does not look good.
Away from that, no restrictions in place, common place for guys to have 3/4 games weekend, until very recent, myself included... 3 in a day, not a problem fitness wise but mentally its too tough.
Limiting grass roots to 1 middle weekend is fine if you have numbers to go round I guess. 90% of refs will never be senior and simply service the game, and that is what it is all about.
 
Our appointments officer used to appoint some referees four centres in one day. Two youth in the morning and two OA in the afternoon. His goal was coverage. I am always against it. There is no way the ref can do a decent job in any of those games. His response was, he understood this but the ref would still do a better job than a parent or a mate.

I have seen referees on their fourth game for a day. The fastest they move is a slow jog and that doesn't happen often either.

A good balance for me is a line and a centre each day of the weekend and no more than one centre mid-week.
 
It's completely down to individual capability. I do 3 games a weekend and physically it's absolutely no problem. I do a few miles walk with the dog when I get back too. I'm fitter than the players at grass roots!

The mental side of things is different. On my 2nd game of the day (I only do u18 and OA so I don't have any kids matches, which are literally a steady jog at best most of the time) I don't enjoy it as much and I do lose concentration if I allow myself to. But I do the game because I've been asked to help out and the game would have no ref if I didn't.

To conclude, it's not reasonable or right to put a limit on games for health or fitness reasons. To some people, due to age or current fitness, 2 games is a huge physical demand. To some people, 4 games is pretty easy. Its not one size fits all, we are all at different fitness levels and are all more than capable of deciding for ourselves where our limit is.
 
I wonder what is driving this? Protection for unfit referees who feel pressure to do 2-4 youth games a weekend? That’s the only angle I can see - they cant’ be doing it for the clubs as this would surely result in fewer matches with an appointed referee.

Let’s be honest - if you are fit and in any sort of running form (say you can run a 10km in around 50 mins) then refereeing is not a “hard work out”. I only do OA and I track it on my Apple Watch and I average 8km-10km in the middle...over 105 minutes with a 15 minute break. This is usually less than 300 Kcal burned. I’m not being entirely scientific as the sprinting can have an impact on leg fatigue and definitely the brain power/focus required is very hard work but Kcal is a measure of energy and it can be replenished with nutrition. This equation changes dramatically if a referee would struggle to finish a 5km run in 30 minutes and is carrying extra weight - in that case he/she could burn double the calories in the same time and that could significantly impact their ability to complete multiple matches.

I’m in no way saying I can do 4 OA matches in a weekend. The mental fatigue is the issue I think and I would even hesitate to do two OA on the same day, but back to back days for a fit referee should not be a problem. When you consider youth and small pitches etc etc this seems like a very confused policy, with an unclear objective, and one that’s destined not to last.
 
I used to do 2 in a day with little or no issues from Local my footballing authorities
Back in the day it was a case of getting the games played
 
I do have a bit of an issue with buying the argument of 'beeing fit enough' to do multiple games in one day. The way I see it if you have something left in the tank after doing the first game, you haven't run hard enough or haven't put the Sprint for the long balls etc etc. If you give your first game 100%, all you got, then surely your second game won't be 100 %.

Don't compare your fitness to others who are less fit than you, compare it to those who are more fit, or even to yourself when you only do one game.

If you are doing it for coverage, then that's a different matter. So long as you RA, teams, clubs and the competition organisers are happy with it then I'm am fine with it.
 
Regardless of fitness, doing more than one game in a day must diminish a referee's performance. Not so much physically, but preparation for a second game is bound to be compromised and concentration it's difficult to concentrate fully in the second game
I like the commitment of challenging OA on Saturdays, followed by youth on Sundays. I do get roped into a second game sometimes by doing favours, but it doesn't sit that well with me
Someone dictating game count is totally absurd however (unless ref coverage is almost 100%)
 
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one said:
If you give your first game 100%, all you got, then surely your second game won't be 100 %.
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Aye. By the second half of the second game I'm a long way off if there's a long ball/breakaway.

I'm by no means unfit, I had to do the fitness test the day after a match... :cry:

Unfortunately, double fixtures down here are assigned for coverage in spring/summer. Usually the first team kicks off in the early afternoon and the reserves kick off in the second fixture in the evening.

Last season I had a tricky one, a lower league game in the afternoon and then a top division match immediately after in the evening. That was tough, because I had half a mind on conserving energy in order to maintain fitness for the second, faster, more important game. I ended up getting injured in that match anyway! :P

Then because of the crap weather and delays, I ended up doing four games on the bounce in midweek. I managed to pull respectable distance numbers for the first two games, but the last one saw a serious drop off.

WilliamD said:
but back to back days for a fit referee should not be a problem.
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In theory yes, but I disagree, as there are usually other factors. I was on the line for the development leagues recently and the other assistant was not enjoying it as he had a cup match the day before that happened to run into extra time and penalties. I too, wasn't enjoying it as I had a match the day before on what was a bog-field and running in that was extremely taxing and both sides played kick and rush football, so I had to slog through it.

Ben448844 said:
To conclude, it's not reasonable or right to put a limit on games for health or fitness reasons.
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It is actually, it's something you see in every area of life and likely they are considering things from a liability issue as well because they may well have a duty of care to the fitness/health of the referees under their control. No doubt, there will be opt-out clauses written into these rules if they came into force, permitting referees to elect to do multiple games. Most likely, the opt out will include them waiving any liability should injury or incident occur. In theory anyway.
 
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When I was younger I was known to do 3 games a weekend, Saturday morning and afternoon and Sunday morning. Then 2 (sometimes) 3 games midweek.

In France each referee (and player for that matter) must get a doctors report at the start of the season that he/she is fit enough for this activity and only then will the referee be given a licence for the season. If the referee is over 50 he must also undergo an ECG and fitness test for the doctor as well. Apart from fitness tests in England, I was never once asked to provide a doctor report for refereeing (or playing).

My colleagues here are of the opinion that it might be related to the recent death of a player in his 30s. This guy was also a rugby player, and played rugby on Saturday and football on Sunday. In December he was playing his usual football match when he collapsed and died (heart attack), having played rugby the day before.

As some of you have rightly pointed out, it depends on each person and how he copes, especially with the physical aspect of the game. If it is because of the above mentioned incident, it does seem a pretty knee jerk reaction to one isolated incident. I doubt if they can do anything about players playing both sports consecutively, and with the chance of playing 2 football matches consecutively here almost nil, it seems that the referees are the only ones to be 'protected'!
 
arbitre said:
In France each referee (and player for that matter) must get a doctors report at the start of the season that he/she is fit enough for this activity and only then will the referee be given a licence for the season. If the referee is over 50 he must also undergo an ECG and fitness test for the doctor as well
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This is sensible. Those of us over 40 ought to be arranging our own screening imo
 
Where's their evidence base? I suspect this will do more to harm referees health than protect it.
 
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