A&H

Match brawl

RustyRef said:
Yellow card him then. Remember he doesn't need to swear, if he doesn't behave in a responsible manner that is enough for a caution, then if he still doesn't behave in a responsible manner he's gone.

I've had several occasions where I've binned a gobby manner and the behaviour of his team has improved markedly after it.
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You often put things so bluntly and binary, but yes - this is it - if someone’s being a pain in the arse, use the tools at your disposal. First minute, last minute.
 
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FirsFox40 said:
You often put things so bluntly and binary, but yes - this is it - if someone’s being a pain in the arse, use the tools at your disposal. First minute, last minute.
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Think that stems from my days as a RefsSec. You wouldn't believe the number of times I'd get emaiuls saying things like "the home manager was a disgrace", "worst behaved team I've ever seen", and various other varieties, then I'd open their match report form and not a single caution has been issued. What did they expect I would be able to do about it?

So I am very much an advocate of referees using the tools available to them.
 
In the older youth league I ref in, a few years ago the commissioner got tired of refs comp,aiming about coach behavior. She came to the start of season meeting and said so. This was before cards to coaches, and she said coaches needed to be tossed when they misbehaved, and the league would back the refs. And a coach getting tossed is an immediate forfeit. And she told the coaches that she told the refs to toss them if they misbehaved. Refs tossed, teams forfeited, the league backed the refs, and behavior improved. We now rarely have more than one or two coaches tossed. (One season I tossed the only coach all year--who mysteriously couldn’t stop with his team leading by three and only a couple of minutes left. All I can think is he didn’t believe I’d actually pull the trigger at that point, so he figured he was free to be a knucklehead. Which turned a win to a loss, plus a penalty point in the standings for a forfeit, and another penalty point for the send off.)
 
socal lurker said:
In the older youth league I ref in, a few years ago the commissioner got tired of refs comp,aiming about coach behavior. She came to the start of season meeting and said so. This was before cards to coaches, and she said coaches needed to be tossed when they misbehaved, and the league would back the refs. And a coach getting tossed is an immediate forfeit. And she told the coaches that she told the refs to toss them if they misbehaved. Refs tossed, teams forfeited, the league backed the refs, and behavior improved. We now rarely have more than one or two coaches tossed. (One season I tossed the only coach all year--who mysteriously couldn’t stop with his team leading by three and only a couple of minutes left. All I can think is he didn’t believe I’d actually pull the trigger at that point, so he figured he was free to be a knucklehead. Which turned a win to a loss, plus a penalty point in the standings for a forfeit, and another penalty point for the send off.)
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I can't be the only one sniggering here... 😉
 
socal lurker said:
In the older youth league I ref in, a few years ago the commissioner got tired of refs comp,aiming about coach behavior. She came to the start of season meeting and said so. This was before cards to coaches, and she said coaches needed to be tossed when they misbehaved, and the league would back the refs. And a coach getting tossed is an immediate forfeit. And she told the coaches that she told the refs to toss them if they misbehaved. Refs tossed, teams forfeited, the league backed the refs, and behavior improved. We now rarely have more than one or two coaches tossed. (One season I tossed the only coach all year--who mysteriously couldn’t stop with his team leading by three and only a couple of minutes left. All I can think is he didn’t believe I’d actually pull the trigger at that point, so he figured he was free to be a knucklehead. Which turned a win to a loss, plus a penalty point in the standings for a forfeit, and another penalty point for the send off.)
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This sounds great but I don’t see leagues and the FA giving it enough backing up for it to be worth the hassle.
 
Ori said:
Manager was the type who stokes the fire. The one who constantly questions every decision you make and that filters to the players.
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Nip this immediately. After the second one, at least approach the touch line and calmly tell the coach that his behavior is out of line. Future instances can then go up the misconduct chain.

If you let several of these go, it will funnel to the players and make things tougher.
 
Swearing at a child isn’t necessarily a safeguarding concern. Is the child at risk of harm or being harmed? If he/she is being shouted at that is more concerning I just wouldn’t automatically assume that a swear word aimed at a child is a safeguarding concern
 
I’m not deliberately trying to be pedantic here but if an adult is swearing at a 17 year old I’m not sure that does need reporting unless of course the particular referee finds it offensive insulting or abusive. There’s potential misconduct there but it is not safeguarding
 
Gamespoiler said:
I’m not deliberately trying to be pedantic here but if an adult is swearing at a 17 year old I’m not sure that does need reporting unless of course the particular referee finds it offensive insulting or abusive. There’s potential misconduct there but it is not safeguarding
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Of course it is.
Swearing in front of, maybe not. At, definitely so.
 
JamesL said:
Of course it is.
Swearing in front of, maybe not. At, definitely so.
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It’s wrong, inappropriate and certainly misconduct. But I’m sorry it isn’t safeguarding. Safeguarding us about keeping the children safe in the main, it could be at the younger age groups but not at a 17 year old. There is a difference between safeguarding and misconduct. Don’t suppose we’ll agree on this well know we won’t, just differing opinions
 
Let the proper authorities determine if it’s safeguarding or not. Report everything you heard. Don’t add any editorials. If you heard an adult say to a kid “You are a (expletive)”, report it just like that.

What you don’t want to foster is any sort of hearsay that might get someone let off the hook when they should be properly punished.
 
Gamespoiler said:
It’s wrong, inappropriate and certainly misconduct. But I’m sorry it isn’t safeguarding. Safeguarding us about keeping the children safe in the main, it could be at the younger age groups but not at a 17 year old. There is a difference between safeguarding and misconduct. Don’t suppose we’ll agree on this well know we won’t, just differing opinions
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A 17 year old is a child so if it's a safeguarding at a lower age group it's a safeguarding at 17 years old.
Safeguarding doesn't relax the older a child is.

Swearing at someone is verbal abuse. Verbally abusing a child is, quite simply, a safeguarding issue.
 
Verbal abuse is safeguarding I agree. Swearing isn’t. Just as swearing during a match isnt a straight forward dismissal. In the scenario from this thread we don’t even know what was said in what time or context. If we think every swear word to a child is a safeguarding concern then the safeguarding teams will be working around the clock
 
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