A&H

Keeper using hands from back pass to DOGSO is potentially fouled?

M

Moortz

New Member
Level 6 Referee
Interesting one from Sunday, u18s girls at a decent standard - home team are winning 3-0 with a few minutes left. Away team midfielder under pressure in the centre circle plays a straight ball back to a defender who isnt expecting it, the ball runs through to the keeper but a striker has seen the pass and is also running towards the ball.
Keeper goes to ground and slides in the box, gets her hands on the ball outstretched but the striker challenges at the same time, and the ball pops out and she puts it in the net. I give the goal.

Defenders are angry and remonstrate with me, as does the keeper who says 'I got my hands on it'. I said it would have been a back pass anyway, and explained to her that if the ball hadn't popped out and been scored (I was not convinced she had her hands on it when the striker played it) it would have been an indirect free kick inside the box and a yellow card.

Looking back it's a bit of a grey area that I'm not sure I handled correctly, my thoughts are these -

Was the pass intended for the goalkeeper - if not (was a poor pass to the defender if not), can she pick it up or use her hands to stop the striker scoring? If it is a back pass and she handles it, whats the sanction if the striker doesn't score (YC and IDFK or RC for DOGSO)? Under the circumstances of the game, late on, no other cards or issues, have I just taken the easy option by awarding the goal? Should I have said, no goal, foul on the keeper to score, but the keepers used her hands first so IDFK and no cards?

Cheers
 
The Referee Store
By the wording you have used, it is not a deliberate pass to the gk .
If we keep things simple and start from there, the rest does not occur.
 
Ok so it's a judgment call on the intent of the pass, fair enough. If it had have been a back pass and the keeper handballs it to DOGSO whats the sanction?
 
The only time the keeper can be sanctioned with cards for an offence involving handling in her own PA is if she touches it again with hand after a restart by her (double touch). Any other offence is no card. Fe 'backpass' if deemed to be so, it's just IFK.
 
I'm guessing here but sounds like you are a new referee. So whilst there are a few bits that aren't quite right, it's good that you are checking. After all it's how we learn.

Your questions are reasonably straight forward to answer and as Anubis says if you get the first one right, the rest does not happen.

First off, it's an offence for a keeper to handle a ball that has been deliberately kicked to them by a team mate. A misplaced pass, miskick etc. Does not prevent the keeper using his hands.

Next it sounds like the keeper was in control. So even if you believed it was a "pass back" (sorry @Russell Jones) I don't feel like advantage is appropriate here because the attacker also committed an offence.
A keeper is in control when they have the ball between both hands, in one hand, between hand and surface or any part of the hand is touching the ball.

So even if it was a "pass back" the correct outcome would have been an idfk to the attacking team as you can't really ignore the attackers offence as part of advantage and as such order of offences comes into play.

Finally, keepers are not cautioned or sent off for goalkeeper specific handling offences such as passback.

The only time it becomes SPA or DOGSO is second touch offences from restarts e.g. GK, FK, with or without the hand or arm (but then it's not the handling that is an offence.)
 
based purely on how I read the words used, am giving a fk to the gk here
The time, the score, the ambiguity of the ' passback" , sounds like the sensible thing would have been to award fk to the gk, you would pi$$ off the attacking team for thirty secs, however come the final whistle, it be long since forgotten about
Very few folk will protest a safety call given to a kids goalkeeper

Obv as a newer ref, things like this are confusing and come with experrience, so, lesson learnt, esp in early stages of refereeing, just give what you see, or, dont see
If midfielder knocks a pass from 50 yards out, back to defender, thats your pass
if it ends up rolling to the glk, its not deliberatley been played there
you then have an ace card tho, a foul. Take it.

thats when you are refereeing the game and not the decision.

lots of gd advice from other posters there too,
 
yeah first season officially reffing.
Thanks for the advice all, It's been a learning curve certainly. I've disallowed a few goals recently for challenges on the keeper where they have a hand/hands on it, I think I was clouded on this one by the backpass (or not as it stands!)

I don't think many players or coaches know the back pass rule, they often shout 'he/she cant pick it up' when it's bounced off a knee or a mis-kick. I'll admit I didn't know it had to be a deliberate pass to the keeper and not just a deliberate pass, so yes lesson learned.

Not wanting to cloud the issue with whatiffery, but if the midfielder's pass intended to the defender and the defender intentionally steps over it and allows it to run through (and keeper collects with hands), laws as written would say that was ok - obviously in a game that wouldn't be accepted.
 
Anubis said:
based purely on how I read the words used, am giving a fk to the gk here
The time, the score, the ambiguity of the ' passback" , sounds like the sensible thing would have been to award fk to the gk, you would pi$$ off the attacking team for thirty secs, however come the final whistle, it be long since forgotten about
Very few folk will protest a safety call given to a kids goalkeeper

Obv as a newer ref, things like this are confusing and come with experrience, so, lesson learnt, esp in early stages of refereeing, just give what you see, or, dont see
If midfielder knocks a pass from 50 yards out, back to defender, thats your pass
if it ends up rolling to the glk, its not deliberatley been played there
you then have an ace card tho, a foul. Take it.

thats when you are refereeing the game and not the decision.

lots of gd advice from other posters there too,
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Yes. That sounds like the correct decision based on what is written. I don't know if I made that clear enough in my response. Was looking to cover all of the bases in the what if it was a "passback" scenario as well
 
Moortz said:
I'll admit I didn't know it had to be a deliberate kick to the keeper and not just a deliberate pass,
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Made slight correction there. And a kick is defined a touch of the ball with any part of the foot/ankle.


Moortz said:
but if the midfielder's pass intended to the defender and the defender intentionally steps over it and allows it to run through (and keeper collects with hands), laws as written would say that was ok -
Click to expand...
I have only seen this happen once in 20 years. First time it happens in a game I'd give them benefit of doubt and warn them they shouldn't be doing it. Second time I would stop, caution kicker for circumventing the laws and give IFK from where the ball was kicked.

(And then watch this thread grow :) )
 
one said:
The only time the keeper can be sanctioned with cards for an offence involving handling in her own PA is if she touches it again with hand after a restart by her (double touch). Any other offence is no card. Fe 'backpass' if deemed to be so, it's just IFK.
Click to expand...
I'd tweak slightly. The GK can never be sanctioned for one of the GK handling offenses. But the use of the hands does not preclude sanction if the GK violates a different provision of the laws.

(And for historians, that was different a few years ago)
 
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