The Ref Stop

In or Out?

Should the UK remain in, or leave, the European Union

  • Remain

  • Leave

  • Undecided

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The Ref Stop
HRW said:
In - balls deep, all the way to the hilt, every time.

Oh ..... you meant .........

we're not talking about when it's just you and the .......... oh sh-ite.

delete..... Delete............DELETE..............AAARRRGGHHHHHH

bugga!

FWIW the split ive seen seems to be generational - those generally over 40 / 50 seem to say out and those under 40ish seem to say in. Just what I've seen / heard around Londonish.

Personally?............ it's my choice even if I spoil my paper.
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Was that a sexual based joke?

Surely not from you.

Perhaps I too should pretend to be morally outraged and find that report button...?

But then I won't. Because I'm not a complete knobhead. :cool:
 
The referendum is about Tory marginal seats and taking votes back from the UKIP.
It is a very high risk strategy for Cameron. But surely he (and the Cons) would have not have gone down this route if they were not sure of winning (remain).
Surely there are going to be some big guns coming out in the next week...?
 
I fear boredom will set in by the 23rd

LBC had a debate between Alex Salmond and Ian Duncan Smith yesterday. Now if that's not the most uninspiring pairing of people i don't know what is :eek:
 
ol' Ian Duncan 'I quit my job to make a stand and the public didn't give a ****' Smith? lol

I'd be voting Trump ... I think we too should have a similar set up - the guy is a ridiculously fantastic business man, and ultimately, a country is a massive business - I mean, we haven't had a great history of Government figures, ever. maybe it would be good to vote in people like Trump, people that haven't sat 5 years at Uni studying 'politics' ... I mean, is that even a real thing to study? 'I study politics at University' ... oh so you mean you are taught how to not answer direct questions, lie, produce incorrect figures and make promises that you are never going to keep? I can do that, and not have a £35k loan ...
 
Trump isn't an Old Etonian which would make a change.
But his business record... he got 40m cash inheritance and family favours worth many times that. If he had put his 100m in 1978 in a basic index-linked fund... well, he'd have 6bn now. That's more than his best guessed net worth of 4bn.
He is a business fantasist and a marketeer.
He is not a credible leader and in this position because he is a reality TV star (must confess, I have watched about 6 series!).

Such a shame that it is not possible for an electorate to identify the skills and art of running a country amidst the bread, circuses and cronyism.
 
santa sangria said:
Such a shame that it is not possible for an electorate to identify the skills and art of running a country amidst the bread, circuses and cronyism.
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This is Britain in the 21st century mate.
There are thousands and thousands who are completely state-dependent and have little or no responsibility for themselves. The important things in life for them are their favourite soap opera, "I'm A Celebrity", "Britain's Got Talent" "The X Factor" and how much they can relate to the trials and traumas of similar illiterates on "The Jeremy Kyle Show". :rolleyes:
The fact that these people even have a vote is a crime. Any UK TV star could end up running for office in a general election and get thousands of votes just for saying something "speshul". :(
 
Kes said:
This is Britain in the 21st century mate.
There are thousands and thousands who are completely state-dependent and have little or no responsibility for themselves. The important things in life for them are their favourite soap opera, "I'm A Celebrity", "Britain's Got Talent" "The X Factor" and how much they can relate to the trials and traumas of similar illiterates on "The Jeremy Kyle Show". :rolleyes:
The fact that these people even have a vote is a crime. Any UK TV star could end up running for office in a general election and get thousands of votes just for saying something "speshul". :(
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"Every nation gets the government it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre, 1811
 
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Brexiteers: If we leave we can stop THEM coming here.

Meanwhile in France..." You want to go to Britain? Go right ahead, they're nothing to do with us anymore. Oh and we'll lock the gate behind you ;)

I've said before, there are only 2 true superpowers left; China and the US. To compete against their might blocs are needed. The EU is our opportunity, and sadly the real issue has been obscured BY BOTH SIDES. For almost a thousand years the states of Eastern Europe sturggled under foreign domination - Khans (Mongols in the east), Habsburgs, Nazism and then the Warsaw Pact. They don't want some supranational federal state-like apparatus any more than we do.

Aside from the triviality that is immigration (as a substantive issue; not a media whipped frenzy mind you) is that the EU is run for the benefit of itself, and "Old Europe" - France, Belgium and Germany. Excuse me for stating the bleedin' obvious but shouldn't we try to change that? How about siding with 10 new allies to break this stranglehold? You know, make it WORK FOR US? No we're British, we'll go it alone thanks.

I despair. :(
 
Tealeaf said:
Aside from the triviality that is immigration (as a substantive issue; not a media whipped frenzy mind you) is that the EU is run for the benefit of itself, and "Old Europe" - France, Belgium and Germany. Excuse me for stating the bleedin' obvious but shouldn't we try to change that? How about siding with 10 new allies to break this stranglehold? You know, make it WORK FOR US? No we're British, we'll go it alone thanks.

I despair. :(
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Have you actually read anything already written about the immovable unelected people who run the EU? :rolleyes:

How exactly are we (or anybody else) to "break the stranglehold?"

That's the whole point of it. It can't and won't be broken. It's been getting stronger, more bureacratic and less democratic every year since 1973!! They are poised to really go for it after the referendum as well - believe it.
 
Tealeaf said:
I've said before, there are only 2 true superpowers left; China and the US. To compete against their might blocs are needed.
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Absolutely. Blocs are the way to go. And not a conjoined federal states of countries that have no desire to be merged in to one.
  1. When we leave the European Union, we could join the European Free Trade Association, a trading bloc that has internal access to the "EU" markets. The existing four countries that belong to EFTA demonstrate that you don't need to be part of the federalisation of Europe to have free and open trade with it.
  2. We are already a member of the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation, a defence bloc of North America and certain European countries, which was originally put in place in 1949 - quite some time before the EU came in to existence - and demonstrates that you don't need to be part of the federalisation of Europe to have an effective defence force (i.e. no need for a European army).
Blocs. Bang on. Let's have a Bloc Party.
 
Kes said:
Have you actually read anything already written about the immovable unelected people who run the EU? :rolleyes:

How exactly are we (or anybody else) to "break the stranglehold?"
.
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Without wanting to sound like a t**t or worse a smart arse, 3.5 years of intense academic study. ;) How do we break the stranglehold? Trying would be a good start.

And to xPositor, the problem with EFTA is you can play with the EUs ball, but they make the rules and if they decide that you have to stay in goal until you concede 3 instead of 2 then that's what you have to do. EFTA members lack a voice, but have to go along with the decision made.
 
Realistically to have influence in the EU we'd have to join the Euro, scrap the rebate,and join the Schengen area.
 
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