Improving VAR - Brainstorm

[Max2]

As it dominates most discussions about matches at the highest level, VAR is a hot topic. What changes do you propose would improve the system (excluding abolishing it)? Living in southern England (note: am not English), I don't tend to watch the foreign tinpot farmers' leagues, so my only real experience of VAR is with the Premier League who seem to just do what they want and balls to FIFA and everyone else.

SO, LET'S BRAINSTORM - How would you improve VAR.

As OP I'll start:

Two-way system which isn't heard by broadcasters (mic / watch / button / whatever) where either the Referee or VAR can inform the other that "can you have another look at that?" then it goes to a VAR check. Stadium, commentators, broadcasters don't need to know who initiated it - we've all been there in the middle where you're thinking "wouldn't mind another look at that" - or upstairs can go "think you might have missed one there" - just maybe a symbol shown on a screen that a VAR check has been requested. Then at the approprate moment or stoppage, it's checked either way. None of this "clear and obvious" ballocks, just a "did we get that right?"

NOW, YOUR TURN...

 

[JamesL]

It's been mooted here many times, but a challenge system.
Take the onus off the referees. Let the players/management decide if they want something reviewed.

Or Rugby style seems to work OK with the very very limited I have seen of it.

I also think, opposed to yourself that the voice should be broadcast.. If folks understood the why there would be less debate and drama.

 

[one]

I also think, opposed to yourself that the voice should be broadcast.. If folks understood the why there would be less debate and drama.

Or it exposes the flows of the system or the referees. For example VAR says something that is not fact. I actually think this actually creates more debate and drama in incidents that are not clear cut.

 

[JamesL]

Or it exposes the flows of the system or the referees. For example VAR says something that is not fact. I actually think this actually creates more debate and drama in incidents that are not clear cut.

Yet when we have seen the examples given to us (Gilett (spelling?) and Oliver) it's given a great insight to the decision making process.

Even just the final decision would help. I've awarded X because Y and Z.

Of course this only works if the referee is truly autonomous in that final decision and not being sent to the monitor means they have to agree with what they are shown.

 

[Big Cat]

Obviously I'm about the most vociferous VAR opponent on the Forum
I perceive that FIFA have been disingenuous with regards to VAR. I'm inclined to suspect that FIFA thought it would help drive up the popularity of the game in the U.S. and/or appease anyone with vested financial clout in the game. Whenever propaganda is needed (like the 99.***% accuracy b0ll0cks FIFA/IFAB insult us with), something stinks at a deep rooted level. Even with the recent disgust of the breakaway European League or the irreversible Nation State involvement in the game, I can't see anything changing with regards what drives the game... money

So if I could change anything, it would be the motivation. I'd like to feel that VAR was there for the 'good of the game'. I'm near enough entirely convinced that this is not what fuels the way the game is refereed

 

[es1]

Even just the final decision would help. I've awarded X because Y and Z.

this would be a massive advance and i'd be all for it

i'm a massive fan of the challenge system and would love to see it. i'd propose that only the captain may instigate a challenge and must do so by making a specific claim / asking a specific question (#15 wasn't offside / #3 fouled our defender) within 10 seconds of the incident happening (to prevent teams from using video reviews to assist).

i also like the american way of reviewing offsides and using the cameras only and no lines, you keep the idea of 'level' which has totally disappeared from our game now

i'd like to see many other changes to the game but for now i'll stick with that

 

[JamesL]

Obviously I'm about the most vociferous VAR opponent on the Forum
I perceive that FIFA have been disingenuous with regards to VAR. I'm inclined to suspect that FIFA thought it would help drive up the popularity of the game in the U.S. and/or appease anyone with vested financial clout in the game. Whenever propaganda is needed (like the 99.***% accuracy b0ll0cks FIFA/IFAB insult us with), something stinks at a deep rooted level. Even with the recent disgust of the breakaway European League or the irreversible Nation State involvement in the game, I can't see anything changing with regards what drives the game... money

So if I could change anything, it would be the motivation. I'd like to feel that VAR was there for the 'good of the game'

Very philosophical - love it!

 

[Macca]

The scope of review should be defined by the on field referee (e.g. can you tell me if that was offside, or was there a foul in the lead-up to the goal). Problem now is the review takes way too long with every possible infringement reviewed in an overly scientific way.

Limit goal reviews to 30 seconds. If the technology/VAR can't give an answer in 30 seconds, either stop doing VAR until we get a better solution, or just go with the original decision.

Don't require the on-field official to make the decision. Allow them to take the word of the VAR when changing the decision.

Stop the clock for all reviews where play is held up.

 

[santa sangria]

Obviously I'm about the most vociferous VAR opponent on the Forum
I perceive that FIFA have been disingenuous with regards to VAR. I'm inclined to suspect that FIFA thought it would help drive up the popularity of the game in the U.S. and/or appease anyone with vested financial clout in the game. Whenever propaganda is needed (like the 99.***% accuracy b0ll0cks FIFA/IFAB insult us with), something stinks at a deep rooted level. Even with the recent disgust of the breakaway European League or the irreversible Nation State involvement in the game, I can't see anything changing with regards what drives the game... money

So if I could change anything, it would be the motivation. I'd like to feel that VAR was there for the 'good of the game'. I'm near enough entirely convinced that this is not what fuels the way the game is refereed

Is it cake?

Yeah but no.

I want Video Review moved to Mon-Tues, with the referees and their observer reviewing the whole game. And retrospective sanctions. GLT would stay. Goal decisions would not be overturned.

the worst thing about VAR is how it destroys goal celebrations and kiils the atmos in the ground. It has to stop.

 

[Anubis]

As it dominates most discussions about matches at the highest level, VAR is a hot topic. What changes do you propose would improve the system (excluding abolishing it)? Living in southern England (note: am not English), I don't tend to watch the foreign tinpot farmers' leagues, so my only real experience of VAR is with the Premier League who seem to just do what they want and balls to FIFA and everyone else.

SO, LET'S BRAINSTORM - How would you improve VAR.

As OP I'll start:

Two-way system which isn't heard by broadcasters (mic / watch / button / whatever) where either the Referee or VAR can inform the other that "can you have another look at that?" then it goes to a VAR check. Stadium, commentators, broadcasters don't need to know who initiated it - we've all been there in the middle where you're thinking "wouldn't mind another look at that" - or upstairs can go "think you might have missed one there" - just maybe a symbol shown on a screen that a VAR check has been requested. Then at the approprate moment or stoppage, it's checked either way. None of this "clear and obvious" ballocks, just a "did we get that right?"

NOW, YOUR TURN...

Along your thinking. Utopia is the correct decision, granted how we get there would be fantastic stuck to a process but, imo, if we get the correct call ( which sometimes might be the call the ref would like to make given the luxury of replays/angles) then hey Presto. ( or Safeways, Morrisons)

Am not needing broadcasts to the stadium or the masses at home, ceo of Tesco does not zoom all clubcard holders re pricing next weeks Pringles, they simply appear on the shelf at £1.49 . You will never appease the baying throngs, they thrive on scandal, there more plant food you feed them, the most floral they become. We open an infinite Pandoras Box, not a definitive.

cant buy into a three call thing either, three errors in the first twenty mins and thats the teams quota used, leaving the officials free to make six more errors which now go unaltered as the first three only get changed.


summary, just get to the correct call. There is already more help than ever before, in every aspect.

 

[JamesL]

the worst thing about VAR is how it destroys goal celebrations and kiils the atmos in the ground. It has to stop.

I'll be honest, from what I have seen I am not seeing this.
I've yet to see a goal, where the original call is goal, that isn't celebrated in the normal way.

 

[es1]

I'll be honest, from what I have seen I am not seeing this.
I've yet to see a goal, where the original call is goal, that isn't celebrated in the normal way.

as a fan who's been to away games / finals in the VAR era i can categorically say this is an issue which has impacted my matchday experience

 

[JamesL]

cant buy into a three call thing either, three errors in the first twenty mins and thats the teams quota used, leaving the officials free to make six more errors which now go unaltered as the first three only get changed.


summary, just get to the correct call. There is already more help than ever before, in every aspect.

That's the beauty. 3 incorrect decisions would lead to still having all of your quota. It's not restricting the total number, but appealling for appealing sake might cost you.
Works in cricket. Works in tennis. Use it and win, keep your challenge.
Use it frivolously or incorrectly, one challenge lost.
If the referee somehow made 9 errors in a game, and they were correctly challenged the team could go on challenging this poor ref who is obvs having a very bad day at the office.

 

[JamesL]

as a fan who's been to away games / finals in the VAR era i can categorically say this is an issue which has impacted my matchday experience

You haven't celebrated a goal because of VAR? I think you are in a minority here then. When I see goals on TV they get celebrated.
I'm not doubting the current experience in stadium is poor, long waits, no one knows why, so yes I can see how that affects the overall enjoyment and atmosphere.
Yet, every time a goal is scored, and the important part here is that the on-field decision is goal, it is celebrated by players and seemingly fans.

As refs we watch the game differently. An example, at a non VAR game, I've been amongst fans and players going wild, and I am literally the only person whose looked at the AR with his flag up for offside.
I imagine with VAR it's similar, watching as a ref you'll sniff when somethings not right.

 

[es1]

You haven't celebrated a goal because of VAR? I think you are in a minority here then. When I see goals on TV they get celebrated.
I'm not doubting the current experience in stadium is poor, long waits, no one knows why, so yes I can see how that affects the overall enjoyment and atmosphere.
Yet, every time a goal is scored, and the important part here is that the on-field decision is goal, it is celebrated by players and seemingly fans.

As refs we watch the game differently. An example, at a non VAR game, I've been amongst fans and players going wild, and I am literally the only person whose looked at the AR with his flag up for offside.
I imagine with VAR it's similar, watching as a ref you'll sniff when somethings not right.

genuinely, on several occaisions inc in cup finals.

as a city fan i've been bitten by VAR when it wasnt expected, with last minute winners...so i've learned to be wary of it

 

[JamesL]

genuinely, on several occaisions inc in cup finals.

as a city fan i've been bitten by VAR when it wasnt expected, with last minute winners...so i've learned to be wary of it

And everyone around you?

 

[es1]

And everyone around you?

a fair comment, not to the same extent but i have friends who feel the same and i have seen the same mentioned on city forums by others

 

[JamesL]

a fair comment, not to the same extent but i have friends who feel the same and i have seen the same mentioned on city forums by others

Fair enough then. From an outsider watching games on tele its not apparent so when I see things like Santa said it really doesnt appear that way for the most part.

 

[bester]

While the goal may initially be celebrated, the celebration is often curtailed and the raise in atmosphere thereafter is greatly diminished by a VAR check.

 

[JamesL]

While the goal may initially be celebrated, the celebration is often curtailed and the raise in atmosphere thereafter is greatly diminished by a VAR check.

I can see this. And makes sense.
And I guess from a team perspective some momentum as well.

I wonder what stats say about teams coming back to win from behind since VAR...

Team scores to go 2-1, lengthy VAR process to confirm goal leading to atmosphere from goal being diminished and the momentum that comes along with that.