Grass Roots Season Curtailment (?)

[PinnerPaul]

Pragmatism rather than pessimism We've had games kick off after 7pm in the past that have ended up being abandoned due to fading light, so we ending up saying no kick off after 6.45 without floodlights or agreeing to shorten the game.

Sunset in London tonight was 17:07, which just happens to be the exact moment the train pulled into the station on my way home from work and there is no way you could play football in that level of light. Sunset is just that, the final act of the sun going down, the light starts to fade well before that time. The team that I managed trained on the grass in Kennington Park, we only went onto the astroturf pitch in September to save money, and we never trained beyond around 8.45 as it was just too dark. I can remember it well as we always got into the pub next door just as the second half of whatever game was on was kicking off ..!

Ok, I've just done some extensive research! Its 4.53, sunset was a minute ago and its perfectly fine to play football.

BUT more to the point, it certainly was at 3.52, an hour ago, so no reason on earth why you can't kick off a game at 7.15 - 7.30 in June, without floodlights and finish it.

 

[LothianRef]

I think if I was running a youth league I would say we were resuming when government says so and allocate friendlies, but would be the same fixtures if if they were league games. Any teams/clubs did not want to participate - fine just let us know.

No need for teamsheets or match report cards but obviously use FA appointed refs paid as usual and they would issue cards as usual!

Those who wanted to play would get in maximum amount of games possible - cricket and fading light permitting! - those who didn't for whatever reason - fine, no problem, see you in again in September!

That’s what happened before Christmas for the girls league I’ve been refereeing in. Their season is March to November, so they did this from October to Christmas there instead of clubs having to organise friendlies for up to 6 months. From what I gather, it seemed to work alright, and they’re now ready to start a proper season, whenever it’s allowed - having only lost a few weeks.

From looking at youth football for boys across Scotland, it looks like there is some variation. Leagues tended to reduce their season, whether by league games not being on a home and away basis, or also less cup competitions. This has meant they’ll probably be able to finish the season whenever it’s allowed to restart.

 

[RustyRef]

Curious post, referencing light levels in winter at sunset on an overcast night . Any angle from which to be negative? I wonder what % of people are commuting into London at the moment. I had to get to Euston for 9am one morning last week and the train was a skeleton
Unlike other years in which midweek fixtures were admittedly quite unpopular/impracticable, I'd bet most people would jump at the opportunity this year because the Cities will remain quiet, players are not otherwise fatigued towards the end-of-season; and most players will be straining at the leash to do anything
The world is not likely to conform with past experience this year. Besides, there's plenty of regular KO times to take advantage of before the season ends
In our area, I'd be aghast if the H&D League and Sunday Leagues dismissed the opportunity to finish the season
The HSCL would have too many games without changing the rules and I'm not referring to the Spartan because they're toast

Agree, very few people are commuting in. I went in for the first since since last March at the the end of January and it is spooky, been in 6 other times since then and always very quiet (still didn't stop someone without a mask sitting bang opposite me on a train with only three other people on it ).

By June though things might be different, I know a lot of people who are keen to get back into the office as they are going stir crazy at home, will depend on what offices do around reopening.

My point around sunset today is valid though. Yes, it was overcast today, but you get overcast days in June and any games on those days will have to finish significantly earlier on one of those nights than one where it has been sunny all day.

This may be a moot point anyway as I suspect the FA will do what they did last season and order the season to be voided. We canvassed our clubs and a very significant percentage have said they don't want to restart the season, many citing the issues around being able to get a pitch. At least three local authorities that I know of have said they will not be reopening football pitches, we'll need to wait and see what happens though.

 

[RustyRef]

Ok, I've just done some extensive research! Its 4.53, sunset was a minute ago and its perfectly fine to play football.

BUT more to the point, it certainly was at 3.52, an hour ago, so no reason on earth why you can't kick off a game at 7.15 - 7.30 in June, without floodlights and finish it.

And today hasn't been an overcast day like yesterday was, lots of sunshine, so much so I had to close the office blinds.

I got the same train as yesterday and even after a clear day it was very close to being too dark to safely play football at 17:07. Kicking off at 19:30 even on the longest day of the year would be nuts unless you agreed to play less than 90 minutes.

 

[Big Cat]

suspect the FA will do what they did last season and order the season to be voided

Well, yes, there is that. The FA have seen participation levels plummet drastically over recent decades, so they may as well give the game another kick whilst it's on its backside

 

[st john]

I think if I was running a youth league I would say we were resuming when government says so and allocate friendlies, but would be the same fixtures if if they were league games. Any teams/clubs did not want to participate - fine just let us know.

No need for teamsheets or match report cards but obviously use FA appointed refs paid as usual and they would issue cards as usual!

Those who wanted to play would get in maximum amount of games possible - cricket and fading light permitting! - those who didn't for whatever reason - fine, no problem, see you in again in September!

I suggested the exact thing to my local league.....cancel league tables but run the remaining fixtures as friendlies so no pressure on teams who struggle to play any matches and risk facing fines etc

 

[PinnerPaul]

And today hasn't been an overcast day like yesterday was, lots of sunshine, so much so I had to close the office blinds.

I got the same train as yesterday and even after a clear day it was very close to being too dark to safely play football at 17:07. Kicking off at 19:30 even on the longest day of the year would be nuts unless you agreed to play less than 90 minutes.

Sorry but why?

Sunset 9.30 - dark 9.45 - KO 7.30 Finish 9.20 - think you're looking for problems that aren't there.

 

[Big Cat]

Some Newspapers are reporting today that restrictions on outside exercise will be lifted on March 8th
Which is what I've been expecting for a while

 

[PinnerPaul]

Some Newspapers are reporting today that restrictions on outside exercise will be lifted on March 8th
Which is what I've been expecting for a while

That the R number coming down to below 1, are a couple of positives to hang on to!

 

[RustyRef]

Some Newspapers are reporting today that restrictions on outside exercise will be lifted on March 8th
Which is what I've been expecting for a while

I've just watched Boris's interview, all he said for 8th March was that is when they hope to reopen schools. He said that non-essential retail would follow as soon as possible after, followed by hospitality at a later date. There was no mention of sports at all, but surely no one thinks they will allow contact sports to resume at the same time they reopen schools, that would be political suicide.

 

[Big Cat]

I've just watched Boris's interview, all he said for 8th March was that is when they hope to reopen schools. He said that non-essential retail would follow as soon as possible after, followed by hospitality at a later date. There was no mention of sports at all, but surely no one thinks they will allow contact sports to resume at the same time they reopen schools, that would be political suicide.

I only reported, 'what the newspapers said'
My expectation is that kids football will coincide with schools reopening, because it makes sense for the two to go together. To be honest, the return of kids football is probably more important to me because I've got one lad playing U11 and another U9 and the lockdown has affected the kids more than me. I'd also be more than happy to referee some youth football again. I enjoyed youth football anyway, but the promotion program puts emphasis on OA

I wouldn't be hugely surprised if OA football is allowed from March 8th also... because a very strong case could be made that the benefits outweigh the risks. The research I've encountered indicates that virus spread outdoors has always been extremely low, although there's a small degree of risk associated with sport associated 'mixing'

 

[RustyRef]

I only reported, 'what the newspapers said'
My expectation is that kids football will coincide with schools reopening, because it makes sense for the two to go together. To be honest, the return of kids football is probably more important to me because I've got one lad playing U11 and another U9 and the lockdown has affected the kids more than me. I'd also be more than happy to referee some youth football again. I enjoyed youth football anyway, but the promotion program puts emphasis on OA

I wouldn't be hugely surprised if OA football is allowed from March 8th also... because a very strong case could be made that the benefits outweigh the risks. The research I've encountered indicates that virus spread outdoors has always been extremely low, although there's a small degree of risk associated with sport associated 'mixing'

There's obviously been a(nother) government leak most of the papers are reporting the same thing today. From 8th March the only adjustments will be schools reopening and two people being allowed to mix outside without needing to exercise (e.g. on a bench or a picnic). Golf and tennis are deemed low risk so they will follow not long after, no mention of other sports though. So I very much doubt that there will be any team sports on 8th March, but if the papers are correct that pubs will be able to reopen from 30th March, for outside drinks only but no curfew or substantial meal required, you would have to hope that football would be before that or at the very least at the same time.

Newspaper headlines: 'Back in the pub garden' and 'final lockdown' call - BBC News

 

[Big Cat]

There's obviously been a(nother) government leak most of the papers are reporting the same thing today. From 8th March the only adjustments will be schools reopening and two people being allowed to mix outside without needing to exercise (e.g. on a bench or a picnic). Golf and tennis are deemed low risk so they will follow not long after, no mention of other sports though. So I very much doubt that there will be any team sports on 8th March, but if the papers are correct that pubs will be able to reopen from 30th March, for outside drinks only but no curfew or substantial meal required, you would have to hope that football would be before that or at the very least at the same time.

Newspaper headlines: 'Back in the pub garden' and 'final lockdown' call - BBC News

Besides, FaceSpam and Tweeter run the country, The Govt. is merely a mouthpiece for whatever gets decided on Social Media. I was just hoping that they also tap into RefChat when deciding what to do

Ironically, that the exact same BBC page from which my quote came from yesterday!

 

[Ben448844]

Had a text today stating that 2 of the local Saturday Leagues are being "cancelled" and will resume with a new season starting in September.

 

[Southerner In The North]

Had a text today stating that 2 of the local Saturday Leagues are being "cancelled" and will resume with a new season starting in September.

A mate of mine just been told his League should restart in March he is down south we seem to be asking clubs up here.

 

[RustyRef]

That's the challenge, my understanding is that many leagues and clubs have said they are not interested in restarting this season. The only question seems to be whether the FA allow leagues to make the decision, or whether as per the previous season they order them to be null and voided.

Interesting that in a league that is still playing, Dover from the National League Premier have seemingly chucked the towel in today, furloughing all of their players and staff and refusing to play any further games until they receive funding to make up for the lack of spectators and associated revenue.

 

[Ben448844]

Most amateur leagues will cancel the season following next Mondays announcement imo. I think there will be alot of teams organising friendlies in April and maybe even some quickly scheduled tournaments to sneak in a bit of competitive football before the off season, but the reality is that there just isn't enough time for most leagues to finish. Clubs may also be reluctant to players and fans mixing on their property when the vaccination program is doing so well and it appears that we are going to be in a very different place by the start of the new season.

Kids football may be different. I can see it going into the summer.

On a personal note I have my exam coming up for 6-5 but if truth be told I've lost a bit of interest in football. This will be reignited in September no doubt but I've basically worked every day since this new lock down began to earn some extra cash whilst there's little else to do. Football just seems so far away at the minute. I'm looking forward to the cricket season hopefully beginning something like on time and I'll return to football mid September. Don't think I'll be doing the 5-4 though, I'll probably stay in the local leagues (which I've only done 2 games in since moving to the South West in November). It would be interesting to hear how others are feeling about their refereeing futures post pandemic.

 

[es1]

Most amateur leagues will cancel the season following next Mondays announcement imo. I think there will be alot of teams organising friendlies in April and maybe even some quickly scheduled tournaments to sneak in a bit of competitive football before the off season, but the reality is that there just isn't enough time for most leagues to finish. Clubs may also be reluctant to players and fans mixing on their property when the vaccination program is doing so well and it appears that we are going to be in a very different place by the start of the new season.

Kids football may be different. I can see it going into the summer.

On a personal note I have my exam coming up for 6-5 but if truth be told I've lost a bit of interest in football. This will be reignited in September no doubt but I've basically worked every day since this new lock down began to earn some extra cash whilst there's little else to do. Football just seems so far away at the minute. I'm looking forward to the cricket season hopefully beginning something like on time and I'll return to football mid September. Don't think I'll be doing the 5-4 though, I'll probably stay in the local leagues (which I've only done 2 games in since moving to the South West in November). It would be interesting to hear how others are feeling about their refereeing futures post pandemic.

i cannot wait to get back into it TBH and am as keen/eager as ever

 

[Big Cat]

My Sunday League is intent on some form of resumption, probably completion of their Cup competitions

 

[lincs22]

That's the challenge, my understanding is that many leagues and clubs have said they are not interested in restarting this season. The only question seems to be whether the FA allow leagues to make the decision, or whether as per the previous season they order them to be null and voided.

Interesting that in a league that is still playing, Dover from the National League Premier have seemingly chucked the towel in today, furloughing all of their players and staff and refusing to play any further games until they receive funding to make up for the lack of spectators and associated revenue.

Now NL North and South are going null & void, I can't see it being too long before the FA does the same for all other grassroots football. It will probably wait until after the PM's announcement on Monday, so it will know the earliest possible re-start dates makes it impractical to continue any meaningful league fixtures.
A few cup comps may be possible, but that will be it until pre-season next year.