Germany vs Saudi Arabia

[one]

World cup VAR and penalty encroachments seem to be hot topics of late. This is a World Cup warm up. Had it been a World Cup game, this goal should have been disallowed. Lets wait and see. Would be interesting if in a similar situation the goal scorer is not the encroaching player.






https://ok.ru/video/786695391778?fromTime=812

 

[Deleted member 3014]

Germany had a goal chalked off Aswell for offside, in real time I could see the Lino had flagged for the wrong player, the replay proved it.

It’s gonna be all game every game this VAR, the added time at the end of halves is gonna be double figures in most cases.

 

[CapnBloodbeard]

The goal should have been disallowed at any game. Why does the referee even both standing there? He may as well just stand on the goal line for ball in/out judgements.
2 players encroaching by 2-3 yards....what if the goal had gone in, at what point would you consider ordering a retake for encroachment?
Most other sports, if there's a line you can't cross, then the players know that if they cross the line there's consequences and there's no arguments.

Football is weird. There are laws about things but for some reason nothing gets done when those laws get blatantly broken. And we wonder why this game has so many problems - it really just complicates it all (and then makes it 'all about the referee' on the blue moon when a ref does do something.

It's going to be interesting seeing VAR intervention for encroachment. Of course, it shouldn't be necessary....

 

[Deleted member 3014]

On your subject of encroachment if VAR is pulling back pens for re takes or IDFK’s then it will turn into a circus as we have covered on numerous occasions encroachment occurs on nearly every pen taken, surely VAR won’t be pulling back a pen everytime a foot is in the box.

 

[cwyeary]

the added time at the end of halves is gonna be double figures in most cases.

LOL.

 

[CapnBloodbeard]

On your subject of encroachment if VAR is pulling back pens for re takes or IDFK’s then it will turn into a circus as we have covered on numerous occasions encroachment occurs on nearly every pen taken, surely VAR won’t be pulling back a pen everytime a foot is in the box.

The only thing that turns it into a circus is changing a behaviour. Going from ignoring a thing, to enforcing it. If it's done consistently and a standard is set, it's fine. if it's done inconsistently, then it's problematic. If encroachment is pulled up strictly in the first game or two then it should be simple throughout the tournament - and the VAR may well help with that consistency.

 

[one]

The only thing that turns it into a circus is changing a behaviour. Going from ignoring a thing, to enforcing it. If it's done consistently and a standard is set, it's fine. if it's done inconsistently, then it's problematic. If encroachment is pulled up strictly in the first game or two then it should be simple throughout the tournament - and the VAR may well help with that consistency.

That's where I see an issue and players getting confused. The VAR protocol says only review if the encroaching player gets involved even thoght it's a clear factual offence in a goal - no goal situation.
99.9 percent of the pundits don't know about the finer points of the protocol. All they see is some encroachment are penalised and some are not. So in reality it's going from consistently ignoring a thing to sometimes ignoring the thing.

 

[OIREF!]

Is it time for a review of the LOTG relating to encroachment? It's so common yet I struggle to think of a scenario where a player has gained any advantage by encroachment. I'm not sure what needs to be changed but it has the potential to become a hot issue as VAR is introduced.

 

[GraemeS]

Agreed. Sensible thing to do is codify the fact that the encroaching player must get involved in a rebound for it to result in a retake, although that does make it much trickier for the refs to track than if they simply enforced the current very straightforward in/out of the box law.

 

[Sheffields Finest]

Love it on here when members who are forthright on certain Laws being implemented to the letter are completely wooly on others if leeway is required.

 

[cwyeary]

Agreed. Sensible thing to do is codify the fact that the encroaching player must get involved in a rebound for it to result in a retake, although that does make it much trickier for the refs to track than if they simply enforced the current very straightforward in/out of the box law.

This would create a big issue though. It would give the attackers a reason to encroach. If they encroach and the PK is scored then no offense. If they encroach and it's saved, then get to the rebound and score it. PK is retaken. If the defense encroaches on a save and then clear it, it's retaken. The attacking team would be happy to retake a save. The defending team would be punished. So you'd set up a standard where the attacking team can risk encroaching while the defending team couldn't.

 

[Deleted member 3014]

This would create a big issue though. It would give the attackers a reason to encroach. If they encroach and the PK is scored then no offense. If they encroach and it's saved, then get to the rebound and score it. PK is retaken. If the defense encroaches on a save and then clear it, it's retaken. The attacking team would be happy to retake a save. The defending team would be punished. So you'd set up a standard where the attacking team can risk encroaching while the defending team couldn't.

So how about leave it as it is then & conceed that you don’t have to blow for the sake of it, 99% of the time encroachment doesn’t affect the outcome of a pen..

Why cause yourself a whole heap of needles agg!

Last time I checked the European club elite & media haven’t raised it as an issue, so why start something for the sake of it!

 

[Deleted member 3014]

Surely the fact that referees hardly ever if ever blow for encroachment says it all, it rarely has an affect on the outcome of a penalty.

So if the best in the business bypass that particular law why are so many on here insistent on implementing it, strikes me that certain members are looking for a reason to be centre of attention & take the limelight on the pitch.

 

[JamesL]

This would create a big issue though. It would give the attackers a reason to encroach. If they encroach and the PK is scored then no offense. If they encroach and it's saved, then get to the rebound and score it. PK is retaken. If the defense encroaches on a save and then clear it, it's retaken. The attacking team would be happy to retake a save. The defending team would be punished. So you'd set up a standard where the attacking team can risk encroaching while the defending team couldn't.

But the punishment for attacker encroachment is an idfk when a goal is scored so they'd lose out all together.

 

[cwyeary]

But the punishment for attacker encroachment is an idfk when a goal is scored so they'd lose out all together.

I was responding to the idea of "only punish encroachment when they get to the rebound" idea.

 

[one]

This would create a big issue though. It would give the attackers a reason to encroach. If they encroach and the PK is scored then no offense. If they encroach and it's saved, then get to the rebound and score it. PK is retaken. If the defense encroaches on a save and then clear it, it's retaken. The attacking team would be happy to retake a save. The defending team would be punished. So you'd set up a standard where the attacking team can risk encroaching while the defending team couldn't.

That also highlights an issue with the current VAR protocol (heavily favouring attacking team). In effect it only comes into the equation if there is a save which means defender have a lot more to loose from an encroachment than attackers do.
An attacker encroachment turns a no goal review into a IFK against his team.
A defender encroachment turns a no goal review into a retake of a penalty.

And what happens if both teams encroach but only one gets 'involved'? The whole thing is one big mess the way i see it.

 

[JamesL]

I was responding to the idea of "only punish encroachment when they get to the rebound" idea.

Exactly, so still punishing it with an idfk gives weight to the idea as that removes the barrier which you described

 

[JH]

The goal should have been disallowed at any game. Why does the referee even both standing there? He may as well just stand on the goal line for ball in/out judgements.
2 players encroaching by 2-3 yards....what if the goal had gone in, at what point would you consider ordering a retake for encroachment?
Most other sports, if there's a line you can't cross, then the players know that if they cross the line there's consequences and there's no arguments.

Football is weird. There are laws about things but for some reason nothing gets done when those laws get blatantly broken. And we wonder why this game has so many problems - it really just complicates it all (and then makes it 'all about the referee' on the blue moon when a ref does do something.

It's going to be interesting seeing VAR intervention for encroachment. Of course, it shouldn't be necessary....

There needs to be a point where, when competitions sit down with managers and players before the season, they mentions laws like this that get ignored and say the referees are cracking down this year. Instruct the referees to give no leeway to encroachment and if the players do it, they've already been warned, it's their fault.

 

[santa sangria]

Have you ever seen a ref blow just before the kicker takes it and YC for encroachment?

We do this before corners are taken, to manage the game and avoid 50/50 penalty decisions.

 

[cwyeary]

Have you ever seen a ref blow just before the kicker takes it and YC for encroachment?

I hope not because it's not allowed. Once the ref signals for the PK it must be taken. Law 14 then sets out the procedures on how to handle encroachment.