A&H

Open Age First Game, First Red

CallumRushton13

CallumRushton13

Well-Known Member
Level 6 Referee
First open age game yesterday, but if a rubbish game really pitch didn't help but neither team were if a particularly high standard anyway... 85 minutes in and I award a goal kick.. Looked obvious to me but usual disagreement from the side who thought it was a corner... Number 12 then says to me very loudly "have you been paid off ref?" As I call him in he then calls me a "stupid pr**k". Was quite loud and he began to get aggressive in his body language and stuff.. Sent him off for OFINABUS... Whilst he's off the pitch he apparently says he's going to wait for me after them game (never followed through just usual I'm harder than you talk). You think I was right to send him off??
 
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Cast iron OFFINABUS.

The first comment about being paid off would have earned a request for an explanation also, call me a cheat and off you go. Not that it matters as he then earned a clear red with the ***** comment.

That final comment deserves a misconduct report? A clear threat to me, regardless of whether he followed through with it or not. Did he say it to you or is this what someone else has told you? If he has said it to you then it is a definite misconduct report.

Don't dwell too much on this, you were correct in what you did. Make sure your paperwork is nice and tight (stick to the facts, nice and simple statement leaving no space for interpretation) send it in, forget about it (can't see this one being contested). Another game is right around the corner and not all games are like this.

Example of statement: in the 80th minute player x shouted directly at me you are a stupid *****. He was shown a red card for use of offensive, abusive and insulting language and told to leave the field of play.

On the correct form of course.
 
The final comment was what my dad who was watching tolde he said... All forms sent off.

Had a top of the table your match today, just one yellow and all went smooth :)
 
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Supermonkey said:
Example of statement: in the 80th minute
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Just a quick word of advice here, which was given to me by a well respected and experienced ref. He said, never put the minute, just put 'late in the second half' or similar, because there can also be that person who challenges that, and says "No, it was in the 81st Minute" etc etc.
 
Always put the minute was the advice I was given, and always make sure you record when the incident happened in your notes - lazy refereeing not to record the time of the offence when it happens. Make sure you record the time of the yellow cards also as that may become relevant if the player picks up a second.

You as the ref have the watch. Arguing the point of the exact time by a player is nuts as only you really know.
 
I know, and I do record time of all cards. I agree that you should put the minute, but that was the advice I was given, and just thought I'd put it in the mix!
 
Lol fair enough.

It opens up the question, if it did go to disciplinary "didn't you record the time of the incident?" Which leads onto questioning your ability to record information accurately. If you put a time and they say "well it was such and such" you can easy respond with "when I was recording the incident, I looked at my watch to record the time played and it said x". Ain't no coming back from that.
 
Could you compromise, and put in your report "Around the 80th minute,..."?
 
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Supermonkey said:
Cast iron OFFINABUS.
Example of statement: in the 80th minute player x shouted directly at me you are a stupid *****. He was shown a red card for use of offensive, abusive and insulting language and told to leave the field of play.
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I know that you have put your forms in, but for future reference you ought to say how you felt. I don't think it is enough just to say what offence you sent him off for. In the example given above there is no "evidence" that his language was offensive, insulting or abusive. You would be better with saying"...........directly at me "You are a stupid *****." I found this offensive and insulting and so he was ........red card etc..
Also, it is good evidence if you put the actual words used in direct speech (if you can recall it).
 
They just want fact, nothing more - no interpretation, thoughts or feelings. Give nothing that can be argued if it goes to hearing.

The evidence is he called him a stupid *****. That is clear.

Was also advised by a senior colleague never to use quotation marks.
 
Mick. said:
I know that you have put your forms in, but for future reference you ought to say how you felt. I don't think it is enough just to say what offence you sent him off for. In the example given above there is no "evidence" that his language was offensive, insulting or abusive. You would be better with saying"...........directly at me "You are a stupid *****." I found this offensive and insulting and so he was ........red card etc..
Also, it is good evidence if you put the actual words used in direct speech (if you can recall it).
Click to expand...

My old RDO told me to do that as well mick so i made sure that i did... i put something along the lines of : he said loudly and directly at me "have you been paid off" ... there were no players in between the two of us... as i called him over he called me a "stupid p**k" (no ** in real report).... i was offended and insulted my what was said and therefore took his name and number and dismissed him.

shouldnt be much room for an appeal should there??
 
RE Quotation marks, not been directed by anyone but these are my thoughts: If you put something in quotation marks then you have to be sure that they are the exact words that the player said, leave it without question marks and there's some room for interpretation.
 
Mike said:
RE Quotation marks, not been directed by anyone but these are my thoughts: If you put something in quotation marks then you have to be sure that they are the exact words that the player said, leave it without question marks and there's some room for interpretation.
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Totally agree. That is my point. If that is exactly what is said that is what you should put. There is no room for interpretation there.

Supermonkey said:
They just want fact, nothing more - no interpretation, thoughts or feelings. Give nothing that can be argued if it goes to hearing.

The evidence is he called him a stupid *****. That is clear.

Was also advised by a senior colleague never to use quotation marks.
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Monkey, I understand where you are coming from but how you feel is also a fact. Otherwise, where is the evidence that someone is offended, insulted or abused? I accept that the words as laid out may direct you to believe that, but think about an example where players are using everyday language of the street on a field near to where people live/children play. The words in themselves (e.g Oh for f#cks sake - shouted loudly in frustration) have begun to become more "acceptable" to some. However in the environment given above, you may find this offensive. Without making a reference to how you felt, how can you say that the word f#ck is, of itself, offensive?
 
Fair point. However, Let's move this to OFFINABUS aimed at someone else on the pitch. would you put down their feelings?

You are not providing evidence that someone WAS offended, insulted etc but that the language used WAS deemed offensive, insulting or abusive. subtle difference, but an important one.
 
It's always a good idea to state 'I saw and heard him, number *, say/shout "********" Cuts out any mistaken identity challenge, and puts the offence directly onto the correct player, especially if he was close to other players at the time.

Trivial, but it's always done me well.

Never repeat what they've said either, you'll always get a smart alec claim you 'swore' at him
 
Mike said:
RE Quotation marks, not been directed by anyone but these are my thoughts: If you put something in quotation marks then you have to be sure that they are the exact words that the player said, leave it without question marks and there's some room for interpretation.
Click to expand...

Spot on. I only use quotation marks when I can remember clearly what they said, means that there's no room for argument. Just as a side note, for OFFINABUS I tend to write down what they've said in my notebook and i've always found doing that extremely useful.
 
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