The Ref Stop

First AR appointment

First of all, I enjoyed my first experience as an AR.

It was a very physical match between 2 physical academy sides, one a lot more dominant going forward and winning the game 2-0.

The referee for the night was VERY experienced and guided me through the process smoothly aware that it was my first time (the other assistant was pretty seasoned as well).

He said he didn't want me calling fouls as it was my first time , just to focus on the offsides and ball in and out to get me used to the positioning and signalling. First half I must admit I did get caught ball watching a few times as most of the action was at the other and there were no offsides to give in my half (well, not that I saw anyway!).

Second half with the teams changing ends I saw a lot more action. I had to call about 5 Offsides, a couple very tight but following the helpful advice from this forum, I tried to be strong with my signalling, which definitely gave the referee (and players, spectators) more confidence in my decisions.

A few points to query did arise from the game:

1. Positioning on corners (in my corner)- Where is the best place to stand here, as I was almost standing behind the taker (to not be in his way) to be in line with the 2nd last defender, which somewhat obscured my view.

2. Signalling for Goalkicks, when is it necessary to align yourself with the 6 yard line and signal for the Goalkick? if there is an over hit pass which goes straight out of play for a GK, do I need to run down and signal , or is that not necessary? if yes, when?

Thanks,

Joe
 
The Ref Stop
Glad it went well Joe! Fun isn't it? You'll get a lot of officials on here say they prefer AR'ing for various reasons, and there's definitely an art to it. It's a great opportunity to officiate at a level usually a step above your normal level, and being out with colleagues is always great. New experiences, new advice, new grounds, bit of banter, can see how other colleagues do things (rarer than you'd think - everyone's reffing when you're reffing, or it's top tier stuff on TV).

Both your points are things I'd cover in a pre-match briefing for my ARs up to a certain level.

atfccookie said:
1. Positioning on corners (in my corner)- Where is the best place to stand here, as I was almost standing behind the taker (to not be in his way) to be in line with the 2nd last defender, which somewhat obscured my view.
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Fair assumption to make that there's probably a defender on one/both posts, 'keeper yard or so off the line. Stand back from the corner flag level with goal line (I tend to go as far back as possible), and you can easily see an out-swinger going out of play, then it's half a step at most to be level with the offside line. Wouldn't over think this one.

atfccookie said:
2. Signalling for Goalkicks, when is it necessary to align yourself with the 6 yard line and signal for the Goalkick? if there is an over hit pass which goes straight out of play for a GK, do I need to run down and signal , or is that not necessary? if yes, when?
Click to expand...

Depending on pre-match briefing whether your Referee wants "always flags" or body language, or if they're wanting you to "check" goal kicks in the 6 yarder. Personally, in that situation I'd head down towards the six yard box and flag if defenders have been coming short-ish, then just move back up to them. If it's been absolutely hooned out of play and all the defenders usually stay up for a long kick, may want to at least head towards the area, keeps you on your toes, moving, signalling, and concentrating.
 
Grayson said:
Glad it went well Joe! Fun isn't it? You'll get a lot of officials on here say they prefer AR'ing for various reasons, and there's definitely an art to it. It's a great opportunity to officiate at a level usually a step above your normal level, and being out with colleagues is always great. New experiences, new advice, new grounds, bit of banter, can see how other colleagues do things (rarer than you'd think - everyone's reffing when you're reffing, or it's top tier stuff on TV).

Both your points are things I'd cover in a pre-match briefing for my ARs up to a certain level.



Fair assumption to make that there's probably a defender on one/both posts, 'keeper yard or so off the line. Stand back from the corner flag level with goal line (I tend to go as far back as possible), and you can easily see an out-swinger going out of play, then it's half a step at most to be level with the offside line. Wouldn't over think this one.



Depending on pre-match briefing whether your Referee wants "always flags" or body language, or if they're wanting you to "check" goal kicks in the 6 yarder. Personally, in that situation I'd head down towards the six yard box and flag if defenders have been coming short-ish, then just move back up to them. If it's been absolutely hooned out of play and all the defenders usually stay up for a long kick, may want to at least head towards the area, keeps you on your toes, moving, signalling, and concentrating.
Click to expand...

Thankyou for your response, this forum is excellent!

Have been on the phone to the county F.A this morning to find out how i can get involved with AR at county level. might be a route i'll go down.
 
Grayson said:
Fair assumption to make that there's probably a defender on one/both posts, 'keeper yard or so off the line. Stand back from the corner flag level with goal line (I tend to go as far back as possible), and you can easily see an out-swinger going out of play, then it's half a step at most to be level with the offside line. Wouldn't over think this one.
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I agree you want to be on the GL extended and out of the way of the kicker. (Sometimes that means a half step off one way or the other and moving back to the line as the kicker moves past on his run up--depends on field spacing.) I'd just add that you want to read the play in advance, too. Know if there are players on the posts. Recognize in or out-swinger. Identify possible hot spots for an OS after a ball to the middle. Watch to see if there might be a short corner coming--the short corner creates more possibilities for OS, particularly on a pass back to the kicker.
 
Grayson said:
Glad it went well Joe! Fun isn't it? You'll get a lot of officials on here say they prefer AR'ing for various reasons, and there's definitely an art to it. It's a great opportunity to officiate at a level usually a step above your normal level, and being out with colleagues is always great. New experiences, new advice, new grounds, bit of banter, can see how other colleagues do things (rarer than you'd think - everyone's reffing when you're reffing, or it's top tier stuff on TV).

Both your points are things I'd cover in a pre-match briefing for my ARs up to a certain level.



Fair assumption to make that there's probably a defender on one/both posts, 'keeper yard or so off the line. Stand back from the corner flag level with goal line (I tend to go as far back as possible), and you can easily see an out-swinger going out of play, then it's half a step at most to be level with the offside line. Wouldn't over think this one.



Depending on pre-match briefing whether your Referee wants "always flags" or body language, or if they're wanting you to "check" goal kicks in the 6 yarder. Personally, in that situation I'd head down towards the six yard box and flag if defenders have been coming short-ish, then just move back up to them. If it's been absolutely hooned out of play and all the defenders usually stay up for a long kick, may want to at least head towards the area, keeps you on your toes, moving, signalling, and concentrating.
Click to expand...

Don't forget LOTG now allows the discretion of not signalling obvious GKs
 
Grayson said:
Glad it went well Joe! Fun isn't it? You'll get a lot of officials on here say they prefer AR'ing for various reasons, and there's definitely an art to it. It's a great opportunity to officiate at a level usually a step above your normal level, and being out with colleagues is always great. New experiences, new advice, new grounds, bit of banter, can see how other colleagues do things (rarer than you'd think - everyone's reffing when you're reffing, or it's top tier stuff on TV).

Both your points are things I'd cover in a pre-match briefing for my ARs up to a certain level.

Fair assumption to make that there's probably a defender on one/both posts, 'keeper yard or so off the line. Stand back from the corner flag level with goal line (I tend to go as far back as possible), and you can easily see an out-swinger going out of play, then it's half a step at most to be level with the offside line. Wouldn't over think this one.

Depending on pre-match briefing whether your Referee wants "always flags" or body language, or if they're wanting you to "check" goal kicks in the 6 yarder. Personally, in that situation I'd head down towards the six yard box and flag if defenders have been coming short-ish, then just move back up to them. If it's been absolutely hooned out of play and all the defenders usually stay up for a long kick, may want to at least head towards the area, keeps you on your toes, moving, signalling, and concentrating.
Click to expand...

I am interested in this as I've been doing lines with the new laws for a few weeks...

Corners - (just because it hasn't been mentioned) when the kick is taken: AR level with the goal line, back out of the way of the kicker. This is because the ball is the offside line, and wherever it is in the arc, the offside line is the goal line. It's after it is kicked it gets tricky! I see fewer and fewer players on the posts. So, it's important to anticipate, after the kick, how far you are going to have to move to get in line with the second last defender - especially e.g. if the ball comes back to the kicker, or if there is a flick on.

Goal kicks - (as in previous threads) for normal goal kicks taken long, there used to be a clear procedure. AR level with the 6 yard box to check the ball is spotted correctly, AR then goes to level with 18 yard box to check the ball leaves the area, then AR moves to level with 2nd last defender. In reality, this used to mean a tiny stutter step at the edge of the 18 yard box as the AR moves to level with the 2nd last defender. But...

But it's all changed now with the new laws. In all the games I am doing now, no one is taking long goal kicks. So, AR is level with the 6 yard box when the kick is taken, and then moves level with the 2nd last defender, which might be behind the GK! But hang on, what about the 18 yard box? What's changed is it's now much more important to watch for attacking players entering the area before the ball is kicked - it's often a 2-3 player press against the GK and two defenders - this is tricky for the officials because the AR is at the 6 yard box and the ref now has to be pretty central and so is square on to the 18 yard box...

- I'm interested - how are ARs instructed to handle GKs now, in particular how are associations and referees dealing with goal kick encroachment by attackers?
 
I don't think the changes to the goal kicks requires a specific change in guidance.

It's easy to tell when they are planning to play the ball short. So once the ball is placed move to a position inline with the second to last defending player.

As for attacking encroachment, surely you just flag for it
 
Grayson said:
No change in my brief, just stay with the offside line. If it needs a retake, signal for a GK.
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AR is not looking along the goal line though so who takes responsibility?

(Interested as I have first competitive match with the new laws this weekend and it’s a good one, top level U17s ;) )
 
I think you're making this more complicated than its needs to be.

Last season, what did the ARs do if it was a short goal kick, or it was a long goal kick but a player took the kick instead of the keeper (admittedly more like at grass roots)?

They watched placement of the ball and then moved to the offside line.

You only have to be inline with the second to last defending player, so if a player is between the keeper and the goal line you stay inline with the keeper and then adjust your position as the game dictates.
 
santa sangria said:
AR is not looking along the goal line though so who takes responsibility?
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I can't imagine a scenario where an offence occurs without either the AR being near the penalty area (in line with a defender coming short), or it being blindingly obvious that the 'keeper has fluffed it and AR and Ref should be on their toes getting to where the ball is in play. You can see a painted line from more than a yard away. Think you're overcomplicating the matter.

Good luck for the game!

Edit: Just sunk in that it's the first game for you and the players with the new Laws in your part of the world. Can't give much more advice that just be proactive and see how it goes. If they're playing short, go short with the defender. If it's going long, get up the field. If the keeper has a brainfart and the ball's live, just be where you need to be :D
 
@santa sangria I agree with "don't overthink this." I think common sense is going to tell you where you need to be in the actual game--you know the things you need to be aware of (ball placement, OS, encroachment). If more than one defender is in the PA, being precisely lined up with the 2LD isn't that important, as there is no possibility of OS with the attackers all outside the PA. So hedging/cheating isn't a problem if you're reading a potential attacker coming in early and need to be able to better see the line. But you don't need to be precisely on the PA line to see the encroachment the same way you would want to be precisely there to judge if the ball came all the way out of the PA (under the former law). I'd also add that having thought through this, you are probably already ahead of many ARs on this . . .
 
...you’ve missed the point about attacking encroachment.

I had a game on Tuesday as AR for a very experienced ref, but he has only done a couple of games with the new laws. It was a youth tournament, no time for a brief.

He spotted some blatant encroachment at a GK, whistled a retake and did the sensible thing and warned them.

I was level with the 6 yard box (and GK snd two players) wondering why I hadn’t spotted it and if it should be my responsibility.

So, what I am after, at e.g. L4 and above with the new laws, how are ARs instructed regarding encroachment at goal kicks?
 
P 201 of the magic book:

"The AR must first check if the ball is inside the goal area. If the ball is not placed correctly, the AR must not move from the position, make eye contact with the referee and raise the flag. Once the ball is placed correctly inside the goal area, the AR must take a position to check the offside line."

The green sentence is new this year with the law change. It used to say:

"The AR must first check if the ball is inside the goal area. If the ball is not placed correctly, the AR must not move from the position, make eye contact with the referee and raise the flag. Once the ball is placed correctly inside the goal area, the AR must move to the edge of the penalty area to check that the ball leaves the penalty area (ball in play) and that the attackers are outside. Finally, the AR must take a position to check the offside line. "
 
...implying that encroachment (hate the word!) is the ref's responsibility I suppose... but is that how top refs and e.g. UEFA etc. are briefing it?
 
santa sangria said:
...you’ve missed the point about attacking encroachment.

I had a game on Tuesday as AR for a very experienced ref, but he has only done a couple of games with the new laws. It was a youth tournament, no time for a brief.

He spotted some blatant encroachment at a GK, whistled a retake and did the sensible thing and warned them.

I was level with the 6 yard box (and GK snd two players) wondering why I hadn’t spotted it and if it should be my responsibility.

So, what I am after, at e.g. L4 and above with the new laws, how are ARs instructed regarding encroachment at goal kicks?
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Don't forget as well that the old laws forbade attacking encroachment as well. So as far as that specific part of the law is concerned, nothing has changed (obviously we know in reality that attacking encroachment is going to be much more tempting now).

Your main responsibility is still the offside line - as a ref with neutral AR's, I always want them worrying about this first as it's the one thing I can't really help with from the middle.

So overall? It's just one of those things that's a little down the priority list and you just have to hope is caught. AR's priority is offside, referee's priority is monitoring drop zone if it does go long, or the first challenge if it's short. I don't think you can afford to sacrifice either of those things in favour of precisely monitoring encroachment, so you have to maintain your normal positions and just keep half an eye out.

If it's obvious to either of you from a less-than-ideal position then call it - if you're not sure, then play on.
 
santa sangria said:
...you’ve missed the point about attacking encroachment.

I had a game on Tuesday as AR for a very experienced ref, but he has only done a couple of games with the new laws. It was a youth tournament, no time for a brief.

He spotted some blatant encroachment at a GK, whistled a retake and did the sensible thing and warned them.

I was level with the 6 yard box (and GK snd two players) wondering why I hadn’t spotted it and if it should be my responsibility.

So, what I am after, at e.g. L4 and above with the new laws, how are ARs instructed regarding encroachment at goal kicks?
Click to expand...
My briefing to my ARs re Goal Kicks has changed this season and is early in the conversation. I now stress the importance for ALL of us to be extra vigilant on this phase of play and remind them that it is NOT an offence for an attacker to simply be in the area (when the GK is taken) IF it is taken very quickly and they genuinely haven't had a chance to clear the area. Any doubt in our minds however and we will take the safe option of a retake! Where comms are available then ARs are generally alerting the referee when the kick has been taken quickly ... just in case :)
 
socal lurker said:
P 201 of the magic book:

"The AR must first check if the ball is inside the goal area. If the ball is not placed correctly, the AR must not move from the position, make eye contact with the referee and raise the flag. Once the ball is placed correctly inside the goal area, the AR must take a position to check the offside line."

The green sentence is new this year with the law change. It used to say:

"The AR must first check if the ball is inside the goal area. If the ball is not placed correctly, the AR must not move from the position, make eye contact with the referee and raise the flag. Once the ball is placed correctly inside the goal area, the AR must move to the edge of the penalty area to check that the ball leaves the penalty area (ball in play) and that the attackers are outside. Finally, the AR must take a position to check the offside line. "
Click to expand...
This is just a lazy way of modifying the instructions as they know the new goal kick law has made thing much more complicated for ARs depending on a combination of how the goal is taken and how opponent attackers play against it.

Only done a couple of trial game with new laws this season. First game AR. Team on my side first half continually played short goal kicks to a defender inside the goal area and opponents qickly worked out to be on the edge to run in. I also worked out being on the edge of PA was the best place to be and run back immediately after the kick is taken.

Second half completely different for long goal kicks, ball placement and then offside line 40 yards out.
 
Russell Jones said:
My briefing to my ARs re Goal Kicks has changed this season and is early in the conversation. I now stress the importance for ALL of us to be extra vigilant on this phase of play and remind them that it is NOT an offence for an attacker to simply be in the area (when the GK is taken) IF it is taken very quickly and they genuinely haven't had a chance to clear the area. Any doubt in our minds however and we will take the safe option of a retake! Where comms are available then ARs are generally alerting the referee when the kick has been taken quickly ... just in case :)
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Thanks for this.

Good point, with comms it’s important (and easy) to give feedback like “ball in play”. TBH when I get comms the best refs ask for this.
 
one said:
I also worked out being on the edge of PA was the best place to be and run back immediately after the kick is taken.
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Yes, I was also thinking about this. I wonder if this could become the standard instruction.

It’s like the opposite of corner positioning, where the AR starts on the goal line then moves to the second last defender.

Starting level with the 18 yard box puts the focus on preventing encroachment but... well, two buts, not being level with ball/second def and not being close to the goal line in case of goal/no goal when the ball gets played in the goal area... hmm
 
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