Fairness/match control Vs the law

[Mr Dean]

Home team captain wins the coin toss. I give him the choice of kick off or which goal to attack. He says that he wants to kick off second half. Without thinking, I say ok then turn to away captain and ask him which goal he'll like to attack.

A short while later, something in my brain clicks - 'I did that a bit wrong, didn't I?'

Anyway, I think I handled things much more fairly than the laws. If I gave the home captain both choices (of kick off and which goal to attack), the away captain might have felt aggrieved. This is one law I can't strictly apply.

 

[Eddie]

Home team captain wins the coin toss. I give him the choice of kick off or which goal to attack. He says that he wants to kick off second half. Without thinking, I say ok then turn to away captain and ask him which goal he'll like to attack.

A short while later, something in my brain clicks - 'I did that a bit wrong, didn't I?'

Anyway, I think I handled things much more fairly than the laws. If I gave the home captain both choices (of kick off and which goal to attack), the away captain might have felt aggrieved. This is one law I can't strictly apply.

In a round about way, home captain essentially selected choice of ends and to stay as it was. I don’t know why he didn’t just say that!

 

[one]

I don't know about fairness. Giving one side the choice for something that should be random is not really fair at all. The only fair bit here is the side that chooses is selected randomly. The more choices they get the less fair it becomes.

The fairest thing is one toss to assign (not choose) the ends and another to assign who kicks off. But that would too much "laws" for something so trivial.

 

[Arbiter]

The most fair thing is to uphold the laws that both teams, by virtue of playing the match, agree to play by.

 

[Justylove]

I did an under 18’s Academy game at the weekend. First teams play in Championship and League 1 respectively, so pretty good set ups.

Away captain wins the toss, at this point I always say "choice of ends or kick off" at which point he says “we’ll stay as we are and I’d like kick off please”

In the end he chose kick off.

 

[one]

Choosing the end can be a significant advantage. Last week's game was 5pm kick off with clear skies. Sun goes down just before 6pm behind one of the goal. Home captain won the toss. He chose wisely.

 

[GraemeS]

Choosing the end can be a significant advantage. Last week's game was 5pm kick off with clear skies. Sun goes down just before 6pm behind one of the goal. Home captain won the toss. He chose wisely.

I've seen the same with a slope.

I always thought that away teams should be turning the game around every time they win the toss. The home team will usually get to the pitch first and will pick an end to do their warm-up's - they'll then line up at this end when the game is about to start. If there's even the slightest chance there's a reason for this that isn't immediately obvious, spin them and see if that throws anything off!

 

[one]

I've seen the same with a slope.

Ah but the slope remains there for the second half, sloping the same way . In my game the sun was gone by the time second half kicked off.
It wasn't just the away keeper annoyed by it in the first hlaf, it was defenders and attackers. Of course the home team was impacted too but nowhere near as much.

 

[RustyRef]

Ah but the slope remains there for the second half, sloping the same way . In my game the sun was gone by the time second half kicked off.
It wasn't just the away keeper annoyed by it in the first hlaf, it was defenders and attackers. Of course the home team was impacted too but nowhere near as much.

My old captain always chose to kick uphill first, the argument being we'd overrun them in the second half. What actually happened every single time was we'd be too knackered by half time to take any advantage of kicking downhill in the second half. Captain was giving the chance of towing the line or not being captain, although it did take me half a season to work out what was going wrong ...

 

[socal lurker]

Home team captain wins the coin toss. I give him the choice of kick off or which goal to attack. He says that he wants to kick off second half. Without thinking, I say ok then turn to away captain and ask him which goal he'll like to attack.

A short while later, something in my brain clicks - 'I did that a bit wrong, didn't I?'

Anyway, I think I handled things much more fairly than the laws. If I gave the home captain both choices (of kick off and which goal to attack), the away captain might have felt aggrieved. This is one law I can't strictly apply.

You're making the simple complicated. This is about as simple of a law as can be and has no impact on game control or fairness. When he says he wants to KO in the second half, you simply laugh and say that it wasn't one of his choices--he can either choose the KO or which end he wants to attack. It's not more fair to mishandle this.

Historical note: The current choices are what they were for decades until a change automatically gave the team that lost the coin flip the KO (I believe that change was in the 90s). It was changed back because of teams that won wanting to take the KO instead of choosing an end.

 

[Martiju]

My old captain always chose to kick uphill first, the argument being we'd overrun them in the second half. What actually happened every single time was we'd be too knackered by half time to take any advantage of kicking downhill in the second half. Captain was giving the chance of towing the line or not being captain, although it did take me half a season to work out what was going wrong ...

I used to referee a team on a sloping pitch that always did this. When it was dry every ball over the top just ran away out of play before anyone could catch it, especially in the second half!

 

[Big Cat]

There's a slope at St James which isn't evident on TV
NUFC always kick downhill second half (towards Gallowgate). Sort of a tradition now. We play 7 at the back regardless of direction of play

 

[Peter Grove]

Historical note: The current choices are what they were for decades until a change automatically gave the team that lost the coin flip the KO (I believe that change was in the 90s)

You've got that the wrong way round - the law as it was before the current one, had it that the team winning the toss automatically got to choose ends, not to kick off. That change came in part of ”the great rewrite" of 1997. Prior to that, the law allowing choice of ends or kick off had actually remained unchanged for more than 120 years, since 1873.

As part of the original laws of 1863 and up to 1873, the team winning the toss had choice of ends and the losing team kicked off - same as it was from 1997 to 2019.

 

[one]

You've got that the wrong way round - the law as it was before the current one, had it that the team winning the toss automatically got to choose ends, not to kick off. That change came in part of ”the great rewrite" of 1997. Prior to that, the law allowing choice of ends or kick off had actually remained unchanged for more than 120 years, since 1873.

As part of the original laws of 1863 and up to 1873, the team winning the toss had choice of ends and the losing team kicked off - same as it was from 1997 to 2019.

You got wrong what he got wrong. Note the word 'lost' in his post .

 

[Ben448844]

My old captain always chose to kick uphill first, the argument being we'd overrun them in the second half. What actually happened every single time was we'd be too knackered by half time to take any advantage of kicking downhill in the second half. Captain was giving the chance of towing the line or not being captain, although it did take me half a season to work out what was going wrong ...

I played for a Sunday League team whose pitch had a considerable slope and the wind always seemed to go in the uphill direction too. We always played uphill first, the idea being that we would get away with alot more time wasting in the first half that we would the second. Not sure it ever worked!

 

[Peter Grove]

You got wrong what he got wrong. Note the word 'lost' in his post.

Oops - misread it, obviously.

My sincere apologies to @socal lurker.

In my defense I'd say it's a bit odd to express it that way - the law has always talked about what happens for the team winning the toss so that's the way I would always think of it.

 

[PinnerPaul]

I did an under 18’s Academy game at the weekend. First teams play in Championship and League 1 respectively, so pretty good set ups.

Away captain wins the toss, at this point I always say "choice of ends or kick off" at which point he says “we’ll stay as we are and I’d like kick off please”

In the end he chose kick off.

Does seem to confuse captains :- when they HAD to choose ends, you would regularly get some wanting to kick off, now the huge choice!, seems to confuse them as well!

 

[one]

Oops - misread it, obviously.

My sincere apologies to @socal lurker.

In my defense I'd say it's a bit odd to express it that way - the law has always talked about what happens for the team winning the toss so that's the way I would always think of it.

LOL given I know how @socal lurker knows how the laws are worded part of me wants to think he set a trap to see who will fall into it . TBH I had to read it twice to get the logic.

 

[socal lurker]

LOL given I know how @socal lurker knows how the laws are worded part of me wants to think he set a trap to see who will fall into it . TBH I had to read it twice to get the logic.

I may be devious at times, but not that one!

As to why I framed it that way, maybe it's because I always write down "KO1" on the team that is going to kick off, so the losing team on the KO is what I would write down?

 

[QuaverRef]

Anyone have a preference of who gets to call for the coin toss? Mine is always the captain who reaches me first when I call them in, a little reward for being punctual