Runner Ref
Well-Known Member
What do we think on the pen?
Everton Vs Newcastle
- Thread starter Runner Ref
- Start date
Sean Dyche teams have been getting away with murder at corners for years!
Glad to see one finally punished, sorry Toffee fans.
Glad to see one finally punished, sorry Toffee fans.
Runner Ref
Well-Known Member
Think that’s a great spot on the non-pen decision for Everton
I think it's a penalty - Burn's put his foot in, not played the ball, and tripped Calvert-Lewin. Careless tackle/trip.
Runner Ref
Well-Known Member
For me, it’s a case of DCL initiating contact just as much as Burn.
I was thinking about this yesterday, and I can't help but agree - we see plenty of fouls given where an attacker manages to put their foot in between the attacker and the ball as the defender is making a challenge and kicks/trips them, and there is usually little argument when those are given. So you could definitely argue that DCL is the one who actually fouls Burn.
My own gut feeling is that a penalty is the "morally right" decision - IMO Burn deliberately stuck his leg in to trip DCL/prevent him from shooting. However, it's certainly less clean-cut than I originally thought, and can't argue with anyone either giving nothing, or a defensive free kick.
There is an argument to say that Burn was fouled by Calvert-Lewin, as he kicked Burn with some force on the back of his leg. Yes, he had absolutely no idea that Burn's leg was there, but intent means nothing and plenty of penalties have been given for defenders kicking into attackers like that.
I guess they will cover this one on the next Mic'd up show. I still don't see that Burn did anything wrong, if he had completely changed direction to put his leg into the path of DCL I would agree with penalty, but don't think he did, and he has to put his foot down somewhere.
Howard Webb has come out on the Mic'd up show to say it was a correct on-field decision and VAR were correct to go nowhere near it. Same argument as I and others used, Dan Burn doesn't change direction, he carries on his normal motion and is then just kicked. There's nothing in law to say that a defender has to get out of the way of an attacker who is about to shoot.
The defender moves his leg into try and get the ball and the attacker has nowhere to go but into his leg. You’re right that Webb said it’s not a penalty, but everyone else said it was.
I don’t see how that’s not given in real time. I think refs now expect VAR to correct things, but VAR isn’t getting as involved as it did last season.
However this issue again shows how subjective being a referee is. While majority of decisions are clear cut, there are lots they depend on an element of subjectivity and that’s why VAR will always struggle.
I don’t see how that’s not given in real time. I think refs now expect VAR to correct things, but VAR isn’t getting as involved as it did last season.
However this issue again shows how subjective being a referee is. While majority of decisions are clear cut, there are lots they depend on an element of subjectivity and that’s why VAR will always struggle.
ladbroke8745
RefChat Addict
Love how Dermot just casually stays calm when explaining how wrong the presenters are.
Paraphrasing:
"Dan Burn gets kicked by DCL, it's clever getting his foot in front, and it's a foul."
Then referring to another similar incident where Gordon gets his leg in front and wins a penalty and the host says it's not the same and should have also been a free kick.
Erm, they are the same. Defender gets in front of attacker and attacker kicks. No penalty. If anything, free kick to defender.
Flip it over. Attacker gets in front of defender and defender kick. Penalty.
Either way, the person doing the kicking is "penalised" with either a no penalty call or giving a penalty away.
And then the "pros" co hosting agreeing with the host and not Dermot. Just shows that pros are useless.
They were saying that it was DCL space basically and that Dan Burn had no right to put his body (or leg) in the way.
Paraphrasing:
"Dan Burn gets kicked by DCL, it's clever getting his foot in front, and it's a foul."
Then referring to another similar incident where Gordon gets his leg in front and wins a penalty and the host says it's not the same and should have also been a free kick.
Erm, they are the same. Defender gets in front of attacker and attacker kicks. No penalty. If anything, free kick to defender.
Flip it over. Attacker gets in front of defender and defender kick. Penalty.
Either way, the person doing the kicking is "penalised" with either a no penalty call or giving a penalty away.
And then the "pros" co hosting agreeing with the host and not Dermot. Just shows that pros are useless.
They were saying that it was DCL space basically and that Dan Burn had no right to put his body (or leg) in the way.
The boot is on the other foot (Presenters correct) just as often
I'd listen to Stephen Warnock with more interest than DG
SW is more intelligent. DG offers very little in terms of his media skills and does nothing to bridge the divide between refs and participants
Employ (what's her face) from the WC. The American. Knows the rules. Great at communicating them. Seemed to work very well with the media
Get rid of DG and chuck him on the same rubbish heap as Phillip Walton and Mike Dean. Dinosaurs, no good for the roles they're in
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Love how Dermot just casually stays calm when explaining how wrong the presenters are.
Paraphrasing:
"Dan Burn gets kicked by DCL, it's clever getting his foot in front, and it's a foul."
Then referring to another similar incident where Gordon gets his leg in front and wins a penalty and the host says it's not the same and should have also been a free kick.
Erm, they are the same. Defender gets in front of attacker and attacker kicks. No penalty. If anything, free kick to defender.
Flip it over. Attacker gets in front of defender and defender kick. Penalty.
Either way, the person doing the kicking is "penalised" with either a no penalty call or giving a penalty away.
And then the "pros" co hosting agreeing with the host and not Dermot. Just shows that pros are useless.
They were saying that it was DCL space basically and that Dan Burn had no right to put his body (or leg) in the way.
I usually enjoy Rob Wotton's role of playing devil's advocate and you can clearly see him and Dermot are good friends off camera but he had a bit of a stinker here of playing devil's advocate.
I got to admit I am surprised how there's quite a few who think this is a penalty, it makes it sounds like how dare the defender trying to defend the ball and we are robbed of seeing DCL having a shot and potentially scoring a goal. I think Howard explained it well why he feels it wasn't a penalty but it will probably still divide opinion.
ladbroke8745
RefChat Addict
Thing is, all the fans will listen to the pundits and say it was a penalty rather than DG.