The Ref Stop

Disgusting abuse of referee

O

Ori

Well-Known Member
I was AR to a young ref today for an u18 final.
The lad did exceptionally well with his calls and positioning. One of the coaches who I’m unfortunately familiar with from a league match earlier this year was constantly giving him and me verbals. Questioning every decisions and was eventually given a red card for calling the ref a cheat and swearing at me.

He was actually quite threatening to the young lad with his aggressive shouts at him. The lad wasn’t fazed at all and top marks for handling the situation.

After the match he was swarmed by said managers players and the manager. It was disgraceful when one of the players pushed the ref. He calmly dismissed the player and for that was rewarded with more verbal abuse and accusations of being a cheat.

While all of this isn’t new to you guys and gals on here, it raises a question for me. When will this end? Why is it tolerated so much?. I know this coach is a bad egg and his players all behave like he does. Thinking they are entitled to behave appallingly to the ref and assistants.

I think today was a huge learning experience for the young ref and the only advice I gave him was to engage less with the manager.

Ps. We both filed misconduct reports with the fa as there was a lot more than what I wrote here.
 
The Ref Stop
Ori said:
He may have been just 18 himself. In my eyes still a kid, but in old! ;)

Just found it rather disturbing watching a middle aged man shout and abuse what I consider a kid. Who does that? On a human level it’s just wrong.
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But he could have been under 18? That is a fairly important fact that needs to be established as there are safeguarding implications (probably are anyway given the behaviour at an U18 match). The County FA will hopefully be able to support the referee though and it sounds like he handled it well.
 
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I agree with you, but it’s just amazing how people can try a bully a ref with horrid abuse.
I will say that majority of managers (at junior level) are excellent and appreciate the ref, but there are too many bad apples for my liking. These incidents occur far too often.
 
Make sure you mentioned the push in your report! No matter how petulant or powerful, that counts as assault of a match official. The players and coaches should be expecting long bans in my opinion. Sounds like the two of you handled it well though.
 
santa sangria said:
Ban them. Cards. Reports. Fines. Bans.
It really is up to every single referee not to be “last week’s ref.”
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Just finished up the discipline on a particularly nasty incident in New Zealand. Four players involved .. various types of OFFINABUS and then up to threatening behaviour from one player. 34 matches worth of bans in total and significant fines. Good to send out a very clear message.
 
The only reason these participants get away with this disgusting behaviour is referees don't always report it. Show them red cards, report it, and if it is escalated behaviour like this submit an extraordinary incident. Even if they get away with a fine on a first offence, it it keeps happening they will eventually be forced from the game.

Said it before, but it was one of my biggest annoyances as a RefsSec, getting emails bemoaning the disgraceful behaviour by a team but then checking the details and finding not a single sanction was issued during or after the game. Referees are the only people that can deal with this behaviour, even if leagues have suspicions they are powerless to act without referees having taken action. To use my own example, there was one notorious manager on a league I refereed on, who referees moaned about every week. I showed him a red card three times in a season, and he walked away from managing as he couldn't afford the fines anymore.

Only we have the power to get rid of these abusive idiots from the game. Don't leave it to the authorities as they simply cannot act before the league's referees have acted.
 
Russell Jones said:
34 matches worth of bans in total and significant fines. Good to send out a very clear message
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It really is. I feel everyone who in any way behaves poorly to the match officials should receive a significant ban, like other sports. They'd soon stop! The worst sanction I think I've heard of in my league this season was when they just kicked a team out based on my report. Other than that, it tended to be £30 fines, which anyone could pay.
 
There is an issue of enforcement too though. I agree with everyone that we need to fill in reports and get the bans and fines issued, but I was speaking to a ref yesterday who sent off a manager one game and had the same team again the following week and guess what? The manager was there ignoring his ban. Ref said game not going ahead with him there, but had it been another ref he wouldn’t have known!
 
Ori said:
There is an issue of enforcement too though. I agree with everyone that we need to fill in reports and get the bans and fines issued, but I was speaking to a ref yesterday who sent off a manager one game and had the same team again the following week and guess what? The manager was there ignoring his ban. Ref said game not going ahead with him there, but had it been another ref he wouldn’t have known!
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That's down to the league and CFA to enforce, Did the referee know the manager was actually suspended, it could be he had been charged with misconduct instead of being given an automatic ban in which case his suspension wouldn't have kicked in yet.

All leagues need to do is put out a list of suspended players and officials each week, then if they try to play or manage the opposition are likely to spot and report it.
 
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RustyRef said:
The only reason these participants get away with this disgusting behaviour is referees don't always report
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Hate to disagree with you. While we as referees can take some of the blame, many leagues don't take appropriate actions when reported.

To give you an example, a league (association) I used to referee in had a board made up of club president. Their disciplinary process was to send the referee report to the club of the offending player and let them handle the matter including determine any bans. Basically putting the fox in charge of the henhouse. Needless to give you examples of cases of total ignorance of send off reports from some clubs with influential presidents. It took the local RA a couple of years to convince them to abandon this practice.
 
one said:
Hate to disagree with you. While we as referees can take some of the blame, many leagues don't take appropriate actions when reported.

To give you an example, a league (association) I used to referee in had a board made up of club president. Their disciplinary process was to send the referee report to the club of the offending player and let them handle the matter including determine any bans. Basically putting the fox in charge of the henhouse. Needless to give you examples of cases of total ignorance of send off reports from some clubs with influential presidents. It took the local RA a couple of years to convince them to abandon this practice.
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Different in England, leagues aren't allowed to take any disciplinary action against players or clubs, can only be done by the FA or County FA. Once that has been dealt with leagues can refuse or cancel the registration of a player who has been found guilty of undesirable conduct (defined as receiving in excess of 112 days / 10 matches suspension in a 2 year period), but they have to apply to the sanctioning authority to do this (FA or CFA).

To get rid of a club there has to be a proposal at an AGM or SGM and two thirds of clubs have to vote for it to pass.
 
Ori said:
I was AR to a young ref today for an u18 final.
The lad did exceptionally well with his calls and positioning. One of the coaches who I’m unfortunately familiar with from a league match earlier this year was constantly giving him and me verbals. Questioning every decisions and was eventually given a red card for calling the ref a cheat and swearing at me.

He was actually quite threatening to the young lad with his aggressive shouts at him. The lad wasn’t fazed at all and top marks for handling the situation.

After the match he was swarmed by said managers players and the manager. It was disgraceful when one of the players pushed the ref. He calmly dismissed the player and for that was rewarded with more verbal abuse and accusations of being a cheat.

While all of this isn’t new to you guys and gals on here, it raises a question for me. When will this end? Why is it tolerated so much?. I know this coach is a bad egg and his players all behave like he does. Thinking they are entitled to behave appallingly to the ref and assistants.

I think today was a huge learning experience for the young ref and the only advice I gave him was to engage less with the manager.

Ps. We both filed misconduct reports with the fa as there was a lot more than what I wrote here.
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What was the outcome?

I know of a young ref who was threatened by a Manager of a kids team and the FA ban for Improper Conduct against a Match Official (a child) that included including threatening and abusive language and behaviour was . . . . . . . Six months. £70 fine and some online training.

It does not end with punishments like that. Men who threaten kids should be banned for life from football.
 
Pembroke said:
What was the outcome?

I know of a young ref who was threatened by a Manager of a kids team and the FA ban for Improper Conduct against a Match Official (a child) that included including threatening and abusive language and behaviour was . . . . . . . Six months. £70 fine and some online training.

It does not end with punishments like that. Men who threaten kids should be banned for life from football.
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Funnily enough the result came through and that is exactly the fine and ban and some training.
 
Ori said:
Funnily enough the result came through and that is exactly the fine and ban and some training.
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That seems to be a common outcome for this particular type of misconduct. Of the 3 ERs I had to do last season, 2 of them ended up with this outcome.
 
Ori said:
Funnily enough the result came through and that is exactly the fine and ban and some training.
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I think its the maximum punishment. Threatening kids is abuse. Threatening a child referee is abuse. Why is abusing a minor a slap on the wrist?

If a teacher, or care worker did similar to a child they lose their jobs and get put on the dbs barring system so they cannot work with the vulnerable (kids) again.
 
Pembroke said:
I think its the maximum punishment. Threatening kids is abuse. Threatening a child referee is abuse. Why is abusing a minor a slap on the wrist?

If a teacher, or care worker did similar to a child they lose their jobs and get put on the dbs barring system so they cannot work with the vulnerable (kids) again.
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Whataboutary I know… but… in another ”job” no employer would allow - or would legally be allowed to allow this kind of abuse without proper safeguards, support, punishment, process etc. etc.

We really are the call centre workers of the 80s and Amazon dupes of the 21st century.
 
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