Dealing with Neutral ARs

[Libano Ref]

Just wondering how some of you deal with the Neutral ARs with you, especially ones that aren't "great" and may flag for fouls that aren't really fouls...

Had one on Saturday, which I'd seen as a perfect tackle and was about to shout "play on" when I saw him flag for an offensive freekick... It was in his credible area, but I happened to be not too far, and my angle was good to spot it. The defenders couldn't believe it... when lining them up for a wall, I told them I felt it was a good challenge, but my assistant had a closer view. In reality, there was no way that was a foul!! Both teams couldn't believe it and the expectation was that it was a good challenge.

What would you do in cases like these?
How do you deal with rash NARs?

 

[RustyRef]

There's not really anything you can do about it, other than provide feedback to him after and also to the appointing authority. If it is really obviously wrong you could wave him down, but that really doesn't look good with NARs. Possibly a better option is to go with his free kick and then just "find" a defensive free kick on the restart, at least that way nothing bad has come from it. There's usually at least some contact at attacking free kicks so there should be something to loosely justify giving a free kick.

Even as a L4 referee the quality of NARs can be variable, it is only really when you get to L3 that you can have some level of confidence about the quality of your ARs. I had a game where one of the ARs called me over for a chat four times in the first half. He said a player wasn't wearing shin pads, he was. He said a different player had jewellery on, he didn't. He said the goal post wasn't on the line, it was and had been all game, and then told me a player had swore at him but couldn't tell me which player so I couldn't do anything. After this I told him that I wouldn't be going over again.

 

[es1]

Make sure they don't score from a free kick at all costs. Find a defensive fk...

 

[santa sangria]

The pre-match is important. Ask about their experience. I think there’s two camps: NAR’s that need help/education/basics; and NAR’s that can handle a more sophisticated brief.

For beginners, 3 things is already a lot. E.g. I go with three jobs:

- ball in/out - including goal/no goal - take your time, look for tips
- offside wait and see
- penalties/fouls - look to me first, do I want help, have i seen it, am I already signalling

Expect the unecpected. If something crazy happens I’ll come to you to talk. Take your time

 

[Redref34]

As an inexperienced AR (but I think a fairly competent one ) I have to add here that I will rarely be flagging for a foul unless it was

A) absolutely nailed on
B) the ref had already given it and I flag quickly to agree

I flagged once for a defensive foul and the ref gave it to the attacking team didn’t look great but was sold well seeing as it could have probably gone either way, just wish we had gone the same way!

I want to focus on offside as much as possible ..

 

[JamesL]

As an inexperienced AR (but I think a fairly competent one ) I have to add here that I will rarely be flagging for a foul unless it was

A) absolutely nailed on
B) the ref had already given it and I flag quickly to agree

I flagged once for a defensive foul and the ref gave it to the attacking team didn’t look great but was sold well seeing as it could have probably gone either way, just wish we had gone the same way!

I want to focus on offside as much as possible ..

Don't do b). It adds no value to the game and draws unnecessary attention to you.
I only flag when the game expects me too or the referee needs me too, ie I am the one with the information.

 

[wazztie16]

Don't do b). It adds no value to the game and draws unnecessary attention to you.
I only flag when the game expects me too or the referee needs me too, ie I am the one with the information.

I was told by a current experienced L3 to flag with the referee on a foul if I'm in a credible position, it makes it all "look better".

In reality, it's rare that I do, maybe once a game if that, I'm surprised to read/hear 2 different opinions from the same level referees though.

 

[JamesL]

I was told by a current experienced L3 to flag with the referee on a foul if I'm in a credible position, it makes it all "look better".

In reality, it's rare that I do, maybe once a game if that, I'm surprised to read/hear 2 different opinions from the same level referees though.

If you want to support the ref give him a thumbs up.
Imo if the referee has seen and given the foul you aren't adding anything by flagging it.
That said if it really is in your credible area and the game expects you to give it id give you first bite anyway

 

[Redref34]

I was told by a current experienced L3 to flag with the referee on a foul if I'm in a credible position, it makes it all "look better".

In reality, it's rare that I do, maybe once a game if that, I'm surprised to read/hear 2 different opinions from the same level referees though.

Yeh I was just told on this game to do it to make the sell a bit easier by a level 4

 

[JamesL]

If the referee is asking you for it then fair enough...but I don't really understand why he wants or needs that but each to own.

 

[RustyRef]

I was told by a current experienced L3 to flag with the referee on a foul if I'm in a credible position, it makes it all "look better".

In reality, it's rare that I do, maybe once a game if that, I'm surprised to read/hear 2 different opinions from the same level referees though.

If you make it to senior levels you will likely get pulled up for mirroring the referee's foul signal. You might get away with it if it is simultaneous, but not if you follow after the referee.

 

[Refollie]

If the referee is asking you for it then fair enough...but I don't really understand why he wants or needs that but each to own.

Some I’ve worked with prefer assistants to flag if the ref has given a foul particularly near to them, even if they haven’t seen it necessarily. Just so the benches don’t think the referee has given something that wasn’t there - aka if the lino hasn’t flagged the bench may say “even the lino hasn’t given it ref” etc etc.

Each to their own really.

 

[RustyRef]

Some I’ve worked with prefer assistants to flag if the ref has given a foul particularly near to them, even if they haven’t seen it necessarily. Just so the benches don’t think the referee has given something that wasn’t there - aka if the lino hasn’t flagged the bench may say “even the lino hasn’t given it ref” etc etc.

Each to their own really.

Conversely it leads to shouts of "you only gave it cos he did lino". It almost feels like referees giving that instruction are trying to protect themselves whilst chucking their ARs under the bus at the same time. It used to be fairly common but much less so these days, watch top level and you will very rarely see it happen.

 

[GraemeS]

Conversely it leads to shouts of "you only gave it cos he did lino". It almost feels like referees giving that instruction are trying to protect themselves whilst chucking their ARs under the bus at the same time. It used to be fairly common but much less so these days, watch top level and you will very rarely see it happen.

I don't think comparing it to "top level" is reasonable, purely because of comms. Watching a PL game, no one will have any idea who has actually seen the foul, and it makes perfect sense to agree the decision over comms and then choose between flag-then-whistle or whistle-only depending on area of credibility.

That's not the case at grassroots, we have to do the best we can with just flags and maybe buzzers if we're lucky. Which requires a different system and different approaches. Discussing the pros and cons of supportive flagging is fine, but comparisons to the PL and what they choose to do are a red herring.

 

[RustyRef]

I don't think comparing it to "top level" is reasonable, purely because of comms. Watching a PL game, no one will have any idea who has actually seen the foul, and it makes perfect sense to agree the decision over comms and then choose between flag-then-whistle or whistle-only depending on area of credibility.

That's not the case at grassroots, we have to do the best we can with just flags and maybe buzzers if we're lucky. Which requires a different system and different approaches. Discussing the pros and cons of supportive flagging is fine, but comparisons to the PL and what they choose to do are a red herring.

Fair enough, but I also don't think you'll see it on the National League North and South, which is the highest level where comms isn't used. Nor on contrib leagues for that matter.

 

[JamesL]

Fair enough, but I also don't think you'll see it on the National League North and South, which is the highest level where comms isn't used. Nor on contrib leagues for that matter.

Correct. As far as I am aware/concerned.