Covid

[James P]

I have just been re-infected with Covid, however you no longer have to self-isolate in England (it's only advised).
Was wondering if you had Covid, would you still be refereeing or would stay at home.
Personally, I have made both teams aware of the situation and if they don't feel comfartable with me refereeing then I'll be giving it a miss.

 

[wazztie16]

I put yes, but ONLY if mild symptoms (or none at all) and I'd do my best to keep away from players. I think it should be treated like the common cold, there's enough vaccination and immunity around that it's something we just have to live with.

Edit - I'll add, I've worked all through covid going in and out of doctors, dentists etc, never once have I tested positive, I've never had symptoms, I've had all my jabs and even self isolated for 10 days when I was a close contact of a positive test but I didn't actually need to SI, just felt it was the correct thing to do morally.

I feel I've done my bit, washed my hands, kept distance etc.

 

[es1]

No, don't see why you would under any circumstances

 

[Anubis]

Absolutely not. Its a contagious viral infection, Pre covid, pretty selfish and ignorant to risk infecting others with a viral infection, far less in todays environment.

day will come too when someone sues someone for passing this on.

that plus your own body might not perform to the level you need for a game.

 

[RustyRef]

I have long been an advocate that anyone showing symptoms of any contagious illness should stay away from work if they can possibly do so, and that goes back way before Covid. Obviously some jobs you can only do by being there, you can't work from home, and obviously refereeing is one of those. These days though a huge number of people can work from home, and going into work when you know you are unwell with a potentially contageous illness is, in my opinion, selfish.

For refereeing I would say that if you know you are unwell you shouldn't be doing the game. If you 100% know that you have Covid then you absolutely should not be anywhere near a football pitch and to do so would be incredibly irresponsible.

 

[Anubis]

I have long been an advocate that anyone showing symptoms of any contagious illness should stay away from work if they can possibly do so, and that goes back way before Covid. Obviously some jobs you can only do by being there, you can't work from home, and obviously refereeing is one of those. These days though a huge number of people can work from home, and going into work when you know you are unwell with a potentially contageous illness is, in my opinion, selfish.

For refereeing I would say that if you know you are unwell you shouldn't be doing the game. If you 100% know that you have Covid then you absolutely should not be anywhere near a football pitch and to do so would be incredibly irresponsible.

100%. Folk even pre covid get too wrapped up in their own issues to realise when calling in sick, or told to go home, thinking its for their own benefit
its not, its so they dont infect a dozen others and lead to a mass absence of staff.

Anyone ( at least today) who turns up to officuate a football match whilst aware they have covid is basically risking the health, welfare, and income, and families, of dozens of people. Its not a game, or a show of strength to turn up to a game infected, its, ludicrious.

 

[Max2]

Of course I freaking wouldn't, who'd be so selfish to willingly mingle with 30+ individuals inclose proximity knowing they were virulant. Arsehole behaviour.

 

[Joe Harrison]

While I come down a firm "no" on whether I would be officiating (or encouraging any other officials to) when positive for COVID, I think it is important to recognise the contextual factors that exist in such a decision.

Personally, I referee entirely for the enjoyment (as I think a number of us do here). I do not referee too often (mainly because of the time taken in writing up my PhD). I have only covered 16 games so far this season across a variety of leagues. The match fees do not factor into my decision on whether to take a game or not. However, I have recently become aware that for some match officials this is a very real consideration.

Last week, I covered a "red-flag" U15 game at a multi-pitch 4G venue for a secretary friend (the game was a walk in the park, no disciplinary sanctions issued). However, before the game I was speaking to a fellow match official who shared that refereeing is now a "lifeline" for him and his young family. He had been made redundant from his job and was open and honest to a brutal extent about how refereeing kept his family afloat. He is unemployed and officiates between 5 and 8 games a weekend. He officiates five back to back youth games on a Saturday (for anything up to £125). He then officiates three youth games between U13 and U18 on a Sunday for up to £120. He shared the fact that because we have had a "good winter" this year (with few games called off), that directly impacted his ability to buy his children Christmas presents. Based on how he was speaking and his attitude towards COVID (given the hardship he has experienced), he clearly inferred that he will no longer continue to isolate.

While I do not advocate officiating with COVID and I think it is a morally complex issue for individuals such as in the example above. I fully understand the science and implications of COVID however felt myself unable to criticise this particular individual despite the clear assertion that if he tests positive in the near future, he will officiate up to sixteen teams that weekend.

 

[Anubis]

While I come down a firm "no" on whether I would be officiating (or encouraging any other officials to) when positive for COVID, I think it is important to recognise the contextual factors that exist in such a decision.

Personally, I referee entirely for the enjoyment (as I think a number of us do here). I do not referee too often (mainly because of the time taken in writing up my PhD). I have only covered 16 games so far this season across a variety of leagues. The match fees do not factor into my decision on whether to take a game or not. However, I have recently become aware that for some match officials this is a very real consideration.

Last week, I covered a "red-flag" U15 game at a multi-pitch 4G venue for a secretary friend (the game was a walk in the park, no disciplinary sanctions issued). However, before the game I was speaking to a fellow match official who shared that refereeing is now a "lifeline" for him and his young family. He had been made redundant from his job and was open and honest to a brutal extent about how refereeing kept his family afloat. He is unemployed and officiates between 5 and 8 games a weekend. He officiates five back to back youth games on a Saturday (for anything up to £125). He then officiates three youth games between U13 and U18 on a Sunday for up to £120. He shared the fact that because we have had a "good winter" this year (with few games called off), that directly impacted his ability to buy his children Christmas presents. Based on how he was speaking and his attitude towards COVID (given the hardship he has experienced), he clearly inferred that he will no longer continue to isolate.

While I do not advocate officiating with COVID and I think it is a morally complex issue for individuals such as in the example above. I fully understand the science and implications of COVID however felt myself unable to criticise this particular individual despite the clear assertion that if he tests positive in the near future, he will officiate up to sixteen teams that weekend.

Lets see when he infects you, then you your loved ones, if you find yourself unable to criticise.

" ah I caught it off that poor guy who had bills to pay so reffed with covid, we just had to bury my dad but its ok cos Micky got £50 that weekend"

i seriously cant believe its even a question, Should one officiate whilst carrying an infectious disease. No, pre covid, and, unequivocally no today.

i would say half my games I do require a covid declaration form to be filled in pre match, so, this guy is simply going to lie on that form, knowingly endangering health, if not life. He needs flagged to your association, not sympthasied with.

any condoning such practise is equally complicit .



I can just see this afternoon my AR turning up at half one, " hi, am xxx, just to let you know, i have covid, i do understand its contagious but i need the cash, hope thats ok?"

 

[Joe Harrison]

Lets see when he infects you, then you your loved ones, if you find yourself unable to criticise.

" ah I caught it off that poor guy who had bills to pay so reffed with covid, we just had to bury my dad but its ok cos Micky got £50 that weekend"

i seriously cant believe its even a question, Should one officiate whilst carrying an infectious disease. No, pre covid, and, unequivocally no today.

i would say half my games I do require a covid declaration form to be filled in pre match, so, this guy is simply going to lie on that form, knowingly endangering health, if not life. He needs flagged to your association, not sympthasied with.

any condoning such practise is equally complicit .

As stated in my post, I come down a firm "no" and do not condone any match official officiating with COVID.

I am well aware, more than most, of the scientific and policy basis of COVID.

I just want to raise the point that contextual factors exist and to think that, match officials officiating with COVID and players playing with COVID will not occur, is optimistic to say the least.

This forum is a homogenous sample of like-minded officials who are open to learning and discussion with the privalage to see issues from often informed, knowledgeable and educated viewpoints.

I am just merely adding in the counter that in a country with no remaining restrictions where vaccines (what we know are the best line of defence against serious disease) have been rolled out (with 4th boosters for the most clinically vulnerable coming) it is inevitable that we will see people engaging in society everywhere everyday who breath out infectious disease. Football will be no different.

I will reiterate, that I do not condone such behaviour but simply, having considered the matter find myself unable to criticise certain cases because of the discussions/examples I have detailed above.

The secondary consequences of COVID (i.e., not being able to heat your home in winter and or adequately feed your children) are now, as a scholar, of equal concern to me as the risk posed by the virus (in the UK).

 

[Anubis]

As stated in my post, I come down a firm "no" and do not condone any match official officiating with COVID.

I am well aware, more than most, of the scientific and policy basis of COVID.

I just want to raise the point that contextual factors exist and to think that, match officials officiating with COVID and players playing with COVID will not occur, is optimistic to say the least.

This forum is a homogenous sample of like-minded officials who are open to learning and discussion with the privalage to see issues from often informed, knowledgeable and educated viewpoints.

I am just merely adding in the counter that in a country with no remaining restrictions where vaccines (what we know are the best line of defence against serious disease) have been rolled out (with 4th boosters for the most clinically vulnerable coming) it is inevitable that we will see people engaging in society everywhere everyday who breath out infectious disease. Football will be no different.

I will reiterate, that I do not condone such behaviour but simply, having considered the matter find myself unable to criticise certain cases because of the discussions/examples I have detailed above.

The secondary consequences of COVID (i.e., not being able to heat your home in winter and or adequately feed your children) are now, as a scholar, of equal concern to me as the risk posed by the virus (in the UK).

Guy be better mugging a granny for her bag without violence, He needs cash after all, that way though, he causes distress to one oap.

Infecting dozens, he puts them into the very issues he himself is trying to escape from!!

Rest assured if said individual was to turn up near me today, he would be out of pocket for his travels as he would not be officiating anything other than his drive home. " hi teams, am your referee today, i have covid btw, hope thats ok"

beyond lunacy

 

[Joe Harrison]

Guy be better mugging a granny for her bag without violence, He needs cash after all, that way though, he causes distress to one oap.

Infecting dozens, he puts them into the very issues he himself is trying to escape from!!

Rest assured if said individual was to turn up near me today, he would be out of pocket for his travels as he would not be officiating anything other than his drive home. " hi teams, am your referee today, i have covid btw, hope thats ok"

beyond lunacy

I don't really find myself disagreeing to any great extent in a personal capacity.

I think for the majority of referees, with respective assumed social and economic circumstances, such behaviour could arguably be considered lunacy.

But I know, as a scholar who takes a keen interest in behaviour/decision making, polarising issues (especially around COVID) fails to help.

I think it is fundamentally wrong to officiate with COVID, but some people will do.

The issue we now have concerns how we manage and approach this. Telling someone who intends to officiate with COVID that their behaviour is "beyond lunacy" is likely to have complete opposite effect (and actually more likely to make them officiate).

 

[one]

I don't referee or go to work if I have cold/flu. I don't see how I would with COVID.

 

[QuaverRef]

Potentially. Realistically I won’t be testing anymore as this is basically being treated as a ‘normal’ illness so it’ll be whether I’m feeling ok to referee or not

 

[JamesL]

Potentially. Realistically I won’t be testing anymore as this is basically being treated as a ‘normal’ illness so it’ll be whether I’m feeling ok to referee or not

I think I will test symptomatically. If its covid I'll stay home. Got a good amount of LFTs stored up.

 

[James P]

Potentially. Realistically I won’t be testing anymore as this is basically being treated as a ‘normal’ illness so it’ll be whether I’m feeling ok to referee or not

Once tests are no longer free, hoards of people will be playing and refereeing, whilst having covid. However it will just be undiagnosed

 

[RustyRef]

Once tests are no longer free, hoards of people will be playing and refereeing, whilst having covid. However it will just be undiagnosed

Every time I walked past the local shopping centre they shoved a box of tests into my hands, even if I told them I din't need any. And since the new year that was packs of 20, so I probably have enough to test until the next pandemic comes along

Don't really think we are talking about people that are asymptomatic here though, rather people that know they are feeling unwell going out to referee, and you don't need a test to tell you that.

 

[RobOda]

I caught COVID (classed as vulnerable) and it wiped me out for a solid week.

If I caught it again, I don't think I'd be in a state to be able to referee in the first place. And even if I was, I would absolutely not go out refereeing, as I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Besides, we're banned from refereeing with COVID in Wales. You're supposed to have a negative test before every match.

 

[Justylove]

For me there's two issues here. The first is obviously the potential for transmission of Covid to players, which I think is a risk, but depending on the setup involving changing rooms, post match hospitality etc could be manageable. If it's a game where I'd be in close indoor proximity to AR's that would ramp the risk profile up significantly.

The second is actually more practical and I'm speaking from experience. Twice I've done games where I've been feeling unwell (even with quite mild symptoms - not Covid to be clear) and both times it's come back to bite me on the backside.

My running was laboured and I felt like I was giving each decision through a fog which got worse as the game went on. On the second occasion when it happened I ended up feeling really unwell in the days after the game and was out for a couple of weeks afterwards to recover.

 

[GraemeS]

I genuinely cannot imagine knowing you have Covid and choosing to just go about your normal life. I'm fully aware that the people in charge have bowed to the pressure of idiots and changed the rules too early again, but no - if I test positive and confirm it with a PCR, I won't be leaving the house for 10 days unless 100% necessary.

Earlier in the season I was refereeing and about 40 minutes in had to pause because a player had gone down complaining of chest pains. Fortunately, despite the low level of the game we did actually have a qualified physio on the side, and she was able to control the situation and get him away for assessment without it turning into anything serious. 2 minutes before that you wouldn't have known this player was any more vulnerable than any of the other 21 players on the pitch.

The idea that I would choose to interact with people for the sake of £40 while knowing I'm carrying a disease that could be deadly if any one of them has underlying issues like this is just so far outside what I consider morally acceptable, I can't even get close to understanding why people think it's OK.