The Ref Stop

Bournemouth V Manchester City

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The Ref Stop
I think it's interesting (though perhaps only of academic interest) that up until this year, by the letter of the law Sterling might not have had to be cautioned since he did not actually climb onto the perimeter fence.

However with the additional phrase that was put in this year, it is now also a mandatory caution for:
approaching the spectators in a manner which causes safety and/or security issues
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Which in my opinion, is exactly what he did.
bloovee said:
I look forward to the same treatment for any scorer going near his own fans
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Except the law doesn't say it's a mandatory caution for merely going near the fans - however it is for doing it in a way that causes safety and/or security issues which as the pictures in the media show, this did.
 
Well, here you go. A bit clearer: https://www.clippituser.tv/c/zbeekq

Any apologies? Certainly not from Pleat for saying Jesus Gabriel jumped even when he saw that was total cobblers in the replay.

As for the second yellow for Sterling, that may be down to the rule change because it no longer says that referees should apply common sense. I'm not sure that means they shouldn't.

Old rule:

Celebration of a goal
While it is permissible for a player to demonstrate his joy when a goal has been
scored, the celebration must not be excessive.
Reasonable celebrations are allowed, but the practice of choreographed
celebrations is not to be encouraged when it results in excessive time-wasting
and referees are instructed to intervene in such cases.
A player must be cautioned if:
• in the opinion of the referee, he makes gestures which are provocative,
derisory or inflammatory
• he climbs on to a perimeter fence to celebrate a goal being scored
• he removes his shirt or covers his head with his shirt
•he covers his head or face with a mask or other similar item.

Leaving the field of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself but it is essential that players return to the field of play as soon as possible. Referees are expected to act in a preventative manner and to exercise common sense in dealing with the celebration of a goal.

New rule:

Celebration of a goal
Players can celebrate when a goal is scored, but the celebration must not be
excessive; choreographed celebrations are not encouraged and must not cause
excessive time-wasting.
Leaving the field of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence but
players should return as soon as possible.
A player must be cautioned for:
• climbing onto a perimeter fence and/or approaching the spectators in
a manner which causes safety and/or security issues
• gesturing or acting in a provocative, derisory or inflammatory way
• covering the head or face with a mask or other similar item
• removing the shirt or covering the head with the shirt

I can only presume Mr Dean thought "Thank IFAB I don't have to apply common sense".

On a more serious note, as Rooney made provocative gestures to City fans after scoring for Everton, does that mean that because City fans didn't make a fuss it's not a cautionable offence but if they did (i.e. the gestures had caused safety issues) he should have been cautioned? So cautions will now depend on opposition fans' behaviour... No so much LOTG as LOUC (..unintended consequences).
 
1. It isn't a rule, it is a law.

2. Ironically, he would have been OK with the old law as he didn't actually climb onto the perimeter fence. What he did however do was approach the spectators in a manner which causes safety and / or security issues. That he didn't could only be an argument put forward by a Man City supporter, as the evidence is plain to see for all.
 
I think, under the old law, you could still YC Sterling because running into a crowd of fans that are spilling onto the pitch can be regarded as excessive and provocative (towards own fans). Also easily justified as excessive time-wasting.
And then clearly it is also a YC under the new laws.

Deano again has this totally bang on IMHO.

I am once again very impressed by Dean and Oliver. Every game I watch I think they do very, very well. Inspiring for me.
 
I agree,
santa sangria said:
I think, under the old law, you could still YC Sterling because running into a crowd of fans that are spilling onto the pitch can be regarded as excessive and provocative (towards own fans). Also easily justified as excessive time-wasting.
And then clearly it is also a YC under the new laws.

Deano again has this totally bang on IMHO.

I am once again very impressed by Dean and Oliver. Every game I watch I think they do very, very well. Inspiring for me.
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I agree, I think that Mike Dean has been consistently strong and a safe pair of hands for many, many years now. Some referees don't like him though, often because they see him as too much of a "showman". That doesn't bother me and I'd rather see a referee with a bit of a style and personality than one that sticks to the expected script, what I call a paint by numbers referee.
 
Just watched the highlights, no doubt at all a 2nd YC was correct
I would like to add, that in the build up to the winning goal, he signalled and played what I consider an inadvisable advantage to City (seconds before he gave the foul that angered Bournmouth), had he slowed things down, taken sting out a frantic finale, and awarded said free kick then I doubt anyone would have raised an eyebrow. Instead, he signalled advantage, the move broke down due to a "foul?" which to me, he gave because his advantage had not accrued. Clearly at this point nobody knows its going to lead to the winning goal but am guessing driving home that night he wishes he had simply awarded the foul.
 
Ciley Myrus said:
Just watched the highlights, no doubt at all a 2nd YC was correct
I would like to add, that in the build up to the winning goal, he signalled and played what I consider an inadvisable advantage to City (seconds before he gave the foul that angered Bournmouth), had he slowed things down, taken sting out a frantic finale, and awarded said free kick then I doubt anyone would have raised an eyebrow. Instead, he signalled advantage, the move broke down due to a "foul?" which to me, he gave because his advantage had not accrued. Clearly at this point nobody knows its going to lead to the winning goal but am guessing driving home that night he wishes he had simply awarded the foul.
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I did something very similar in my game last week and was advised by a current premier league referee not to, however I disagreed with him at the time and I'll do the same here!

3-3 after a great game, home team lose possession in their attacking third and away side look to break, home team right back chases after the ball and intentionally fouls an opponent to stop the attack but away side retain possession - similar situation to the bournemouth v city game. They're pushing for the win, the only team that would benefit from the free kick would be the defending team as they then have time to regroup and get men behind the ball. You can always come back and caution the defender after.
 
Surprised that no one has mentioned/ridiculed Mr Shearer for saying Man City 2nd goal should have been disallowed because they took free kick from the wrong place (They took it 10 yards nearer their own goal, 80 yards from goal) but called the first goal - also following a fk taken from the wrong place (5 yards nearer oppo goal, in oppo half) 'quick thinking'!
 
es1 said:
I did something very similar in my game last week and was advised by a current premier league referee not to, however I disagreed with him at the time and I'll do the same here!

3-3 after a great game, home team lose possession in their attacking third and away side look to break, home team right back chases after the ball and intentionally fouls an opponent to stop the attack but away side retain possession - similar situation to the bournemouth v city game. They're pushing for the win, the only team that would benefit from the free kick would be the defending team as they then have time to regroup and get men behind the ball. You can always come back and caution the defender after.
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Did you miss my point about, the advantage as such, never accrued, as it, it was not really an advantage, merely a ball retention. Only Mr Dean will know what happened next but looks clear as day to me he regretted his advantage attempt but was given a lifeline by the foul? That he awarded a few secinds later. And, in your siuation, there would be nothing to stop offended team taking a quick short free kick, no YC was produced by Dean for the advantage foul, and certainly not for the one a few seconds later, which is a debateable foul at best!
If a top referee is giving advise but you think you know best, then next time you get the honour of that kind of prescence, why not politley decline the offer so the top referee can go give his wisdom to someone more worthy.
 
santa sangria said:
I think, under the old law, you could still YC Sterling because running into a crowd of fans that are spilling onto the pitch can be regarded as excessive and provocative (towards own fans). Also easily justified as excessive time-wasting.
And then clearly it is also a YC under the new laws.

Deano again has this totally bang on IMHO.

I am once again very impressed by Dean and Oliver. Every game I watch I think they do very, very well. Inspiring for me.
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Crawler. How can you be inspired by a ref who bottled out of a DOGSO, missed a SFP entirely, and then gave a "no common sense" second yellow?

Ciley Myrus said:
Just watched the highlights, no doubt at all a 2nd YC was correct
I would like to add, that in the build up to the winning goal, he signalled and played what I consider an inadvisable advantage to City (seconds before he gave the foul that angered Bournemouth), had he slowed things down, taken sting out a frantic finale....
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Come on - that's pandering to the spoiler teams, helping them disrupt play.
 
I think I am not making my casing point clear. Mike Dean DID blow for a free kick towards the half way line circle, which, you could say was, or was not a free kick in my opinion, it was not. It was this free kick that Bournmouth were livid about at the final whistle.
Seconds before he gave this free kick, he signalled advantage following an actual foul some 10 yards further back. My point is, this was NOT an advantage, it broke down easily but IMO Dean thought better of going back to the first foul, and saw the Bournmouth actual foul he awarded, as a get out clause for his failed advantage. I am trying to say, had he blown up for the first foul, nobody would have batted an eye lid, as it was a cast iron foul. The one he did blow up for, 50/50 foul, which led to big protests. There was nothing to stop Dean giving the first foul and City playing a short quick free kick. Instead, all I saw was a failed advantage. (people might need to re-run the incident to see what I mean)
 
bloovee said:
Crawler. How can you be inspired by a ref who bottled out of a DOGSO, missed a SFP entirely, and then gave a "no common sense" second yellow?
Come on - that's pandering to the spoiler teams, helping them disrupt play.
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LOL!
Bottled DOGSO... hmm... if you can use your sixth and seventh senses - you third eye raven you - to know that MD is a bottler, you are blessed.
Missed SFP... yes, looks like he genuinely missed how bad it was.
2nd YC... nailed on as discussed.

Well played though;)
 
bloovee said:
Crawler. How can you be inspired by a ref who bottled out of a DOGSO, missed a SFP entirely, and then gave a "no common sense" second yellow?


Come on - that's pandering to the spoiler teams, helping them disrupt play.
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I just read your post. The fact you would even dispute the 2nd yellow negates anything else you will ever post on (certainly this) topic.

True story, Inverness v Celtic some years ago, Celtic score winner in, 95 96 mins,, scorer (name escapes me, was either Bratvaak or Hesslink or something) does same as Sterling did.....crowd acted same as City fans did......police, via 4th, to referee "deal with that or he is arrested) (not sure about England but in Scotland its case of, ref deals with on pitch, police deal with off pitch). Cue referee, (who was prob going to do it anyway) cautioning the Celtic player, it was a 2nd yellow, and off he went. Howls of angst and protests and kill joy remarks for about a week until it emerged that the referee actually prevented the player from being arrested.

Scoring the winner at Bournmouth, agreed, it might get exciting, but I have seen Murray win Wimbledon without acting like that, Hendry win at the Crucible even when Ole won it at the Nou Camp, in front of 120,000 fans, he managed to stay away from the fans.....
The only lack of common sense was a player, already on a yellow, (who ignored and skipped past a team mate on the way to the fans), running to the fans and being part of an unsavoury incident.
 
Ciley Myrus said:
Did you miss my point about, the advantage as such, never accrued, as it, it was not really an advantage, merely a ball retention. Only Mr Dean will know what happened next but looks clear as day to me he regretted his advantage attempt but was given a lifeline by the foul? That he awarded a few secinds later. And, in your siuation, there would be nothing to stop offended team taking a quick short free kick, no YC was produced by Dean for the advantage foul, and certainly not for the one a few seconds later, which is a debateable foul at best!
If a top referee is giving advise but you think you know best, then next time you get the honour of that kind of prescence, why not politley decline the offer so the top referee can go give his wisdom to someone more worthy.
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or we could debate the issue like we did on the night...i was booking the player so i couldn't have allowed a quick free kick
 
Ok so the incidents are not the same, Deans "advantage" did not lead to a card and the "foul" seconds later was not a cast iron free kick far less a card.
 
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