A&H

A couple of incidents....

R

Robert Neale

New Member
More often than not, when a player is being cautioned, they will come to the referee and remain for about as long as it takes to spit out their name like a scolded child, then turn and walk away. I always make them come back so they see the card, which then gets the 'Get on with it' and 'You're on a power trip ' comments. This doesn't bother me, but how do other ref deal with this?
 
The Referee Store
Same as you, bring them over get their number and name, tell them that they're being cautioned for xxx show the card in a non confrontational manner.

If they walk away I call them back to show the card.

The only comment I've ever had is a "Yeah, I know what colour a yellow is".
 
Secondly, if you've aked a player to play the ball back to the keeper at a drop ball, and they refuse, how do you handle it? On Saturday I had to accept it. It was the away sides most beligerent player, self styled hardman, who refuse. As we were then lining up to actually contest the drop ball he made a stupid comment about a second player not being ten yards so as I then leaned forward as if to make this player retreat I craftily dropped the ball when hardman wasn't watching, and in his panic he fluffed it out for a throw not five yards away!!
Small victories!!!
 
I always begin by telling them "I'm cautioning you for that reckless challenge/dissent/USB". I then ask him his name (as I write in my notebook) and then I say "please do NOT walk away until I've shown you this card - thank you." Works for me. ;)

The above method also helps you to slow everything down and to remain in control whilst carrying out your job. This is particularly effective in a "needle" match or when tempers are becoming a bit short. You have to be confident and "forceful" when insisting that they remain in place until you've shown the card though. :)
 
Kes said:
I always begin by telling them "I'm cautioning you for that reckless challenge/dissent/USB". I then ask him his name (as I write in my notebook) and then I say "please do NOT walk away until I've shown you this card - thank you." Works for me. ;)

The above method also helps you to slow everything down and to remain in control whilst carrying out your job. This is particularly effective in a "needle" match or when tempers are becoming a bit short. You have to be confident and "forceful" when insisting that they remain in place until you've shown the card though. :)
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Indeed, and also by not letting the player walk away, or by calling him back if he does then you are, in some small way, demonstrating that you control what happens in the match and not the players.

And of course, if he walks away and refuses to come back then it's an easy second yellow for dissent.
 
i'd not really thought about it much tbh, i was of the opinion that if he's given name and number and told he's being cautioned for ______, then he's aware hes going in the book hence irrelevant if he sees the yellow with his own eyes or not. However @Kes, very good point about using it as a means of slowing things down, i like that
as for the drop ball situation, ive not been in that spot, as if i'm asked by a player what to do at an uncontested, i always say that its up to them, but just bear in mind why we're dropping the ball in the first place
 
Robert Neale said:
Secondly, if you've aked a player to play the ball back to the keeper at a drop ball, and they refuse, how do you handle it?
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First off, you don't ask them to do that. You can, as a couple of others have mentioned above, simply note why this is happening. Let them draw their own conclusions.

There'll always be idiots though...

Robert Neale said:
It was the away sides most beligerent player, self styled hardman, who refuse. As we were then lining up to actually contest the drop ball he made a stupid comment about a second player not being ten yards...
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Does he realize that all 22 players can contest the dropped ball? No requirement for anyone to be 10+ yards away at a dropped ball. Ever.
 
Pet hate of mine is seeing referees show a card to a player who has his back to the ref, walking away.
 
Does the same apply if you're showing red? I personally prefer a player to see the yellow, but if I'm sending them off, I'm more than happy to see them going in the right direction before I can get the card out.
 
GraemeS said:
Does the same apply if you're showing red? I personally prefer a player to see the yellow, but if I'm sending them off, I'm more than happy to see them going in the right direction before I can get the card out.
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Put it this way, if you're assessed and you're showing a card, whether that card is yellow or red, and you show it to a players back, or to a player on the floor, you'll be marked down.
 
You need to ensure the player sees the card so they cannot later contest the action you have taken. Yes it is a communication device and the failure to show does not change the effect of the sanction.

You could however find yourself in the situation the referee had yesterday. The player thought he was only getting cautioned for calling the AR a cheat and walked away. He had to be turned around by his team mate and told to look at the red card so he could realise he was being sent off.

As for why he would think that was only a caution, that's a whole different story.
 
So if I've told a player he's been sent off and he starts to walk, I'm supposed to make him turn round so that I can wave a red card in his face? As someone who only tends to referee on his own, with club CAR's against at least 11 people who are likely to be unhappy with me - no thanks! Why would I be expected to take deliberately inflammatory action?
 
GraemeS said:
So if I've told a player he's been sent off and he starts to walk, I'm supposed to make him turn round so that I can wave a red card in his face? As someone who only tends to referee on his own, with club CAR's against at least 11 people who are likely to be unhappy with me - no thanks! Why would I be expected to take deliberately inflammatory action?
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Because that's what the rest of us do, the 99% of other users on this forum who also referee on their own. Do your job properly.

Retain contact with the player until you have displayed the card. If he walks away, ask him to turn around and look at the card. If you have handled the dismissal appropriately, then it's not going to be inflammatory. Don't raise your voice, make eye contact with the player, remain at least 5 feet away from the player, preferably at an angle and not directly face to face, ask for their name, tell them they are being sent off, raise the card in the hand furthest from the player in a smooth motion (not thrusting it in his face or towards him), hold it there for one-two seconds and lower it slowly again then ask the player to leave the field.
 
GraemeS said:
Does the same apply if you're showing red? I personally prefer a player to see the yellow, but if I'm sending them off, I'm more than happy to see them going in the right direction before I can get the card out.
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It should never really be completely obvious to any player that you're about to flash red at him unless it's for VC. Even then you'll often find he's still hoping for yellow. :D
For me it's therefore almost exactly the same procedure for a dismissal as it is for a caution: Whistle, call him to you (isolate wherever possible) don't tell him you're sending him off (until you've got his name - sorry Brian :D ) ask for his name, then, as your explaining what you've seen and what he's done ie VC, OFFINABUS, excessive force etc, bring the card out and say "Sorry, but you've given me no choice - leave the field please (and go back to the changing rooms"). It's all about your demeanour and personality when it comes to dishing out the red news. Fortunately, I've only had 9 red cards to issue in entirety since I took up refereeing ( 4 years ago). :)
 
Robert Neale said:
More often than not, when a player is being cautioned, they will come to the referee and remain for about as long as it takes to spit out their name like a scolded child, then turn and walk away. I always make them come back so they see the card, which then gets the 'Get on with it' and 'You're on a power trip ' comments. This doesn't bother me, but how do other ref deal with this?
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Personally when I call a player across for a caution for example, once they start to come across and are within speaking distance I ask the name of the player then ask for his full attention.

'What's the name pal?... Carl? Ok Carl, we won't restart until you're back in, but please give me your full attention for a minute. I'll let you know when we're done.'

Never failed me yet. Only had one clown do that annoying thing where they mess with their socks/shoes/shin pads.

He got the better of my patience. 'Carl, I asked for your full attention and you can't manage that for one minute. I guess it's quicker and easier for us both to just get the cards out. Particularly if I'm wasting my time.'
 
GraemeS said:
So if I've told a player he's been sent off and he starts to walk, I'm supposed to make him turn round so that I can wave a red card in his face? As someone who only tends to referee on his own, with club CAR's against at least 11 people who are likely to be unhappy with me - no thanks! Why would I be expected to take deliberately inflammatory action?
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I can understand the concern. However, as it has been stated, it is our job to show that the player is being sanctioned (be it yellow or red). Even if it seems "inflammatory", it needs to be done, and professionally since that's how we maintain our image.
 
Raider025 said:
I can understand the concern. However, as it has been stated, it is our job to show that the player is being sanctioned (be it yellow or red). Even if it seems "inflammatory", it needs to be done, and professionally since that's how we maintain our image.
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There's a difference between showing that the player has been sanctioned (ie. showing the red card in their direction) and making sure the player sees that he's been sanctioned (making him turn round/walk back towards you so that he sees the card from <5m away). This specifically is the distinction I'm taking issue with.

Does it still count if the player has his eyes closed? What if he's taken a blow to the forehead in the process of committing a dismissable offence and can't see as a result of blood in the eyes? Is it theoretically possible to send a player off if he's been knocked out in the process of committing VC? I'm being intensely facetious, but are you trying to argue that in any of these situations, the dismissal wouldn't count if the player doesn't literally "see red"?

The way I see it, my job is to identify the player (either by shirt number, by taking their name or both) and then make it clear to them and eventually, the rest of their team that they have been dismissed from the FOP. The red card is a tool in this process, but if I can successfully communicate the dismissal to the player verbally and then can't immediately access the cards (let's say a fight kicks off elsewhere and I have to move to view any cautions/dismissals arising from that, or perhaps another dismissed player has literally taken my cards off me in anger), does the dismissal not count until I can find where the player's gone and show him red?
 
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