A&H

Junior/Youth speaking to 16+ year olds

K

Kent Ref

RefChat Addict
Sometimes my decisions are questioned by 16 year olds during the game. I mean publicly and from over 20 yards away.

I sometimes reply with "Number ?, if i need your help i will ask but thank you.".

A short while back a Child Welfare Officer came accross to me at full time.

"You cannot speak to children ike that. That's totally inappropriate. You're getting reported." When i asked if she would prefer i sin-binned them each time she just walked off.

Out of interest what response would you give? The card, a 1-1 chat or something else?

With younger players the 1-1 chat work well for me and i use it often but with the 16+ i feel i'm just wasting my time so i do what i do.
 
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Kent Ref said:
Sometimes my decisions are questioned by 16 year olds during the game. I mean publicly and from over 20 yards away.

I sometimes reply with "Number ?, if i need your help i will ask but thank you.".

A short while back a Child Welfare Officer came across to me at full time.

"You cannot speak to children ike that. That's totally inappropriate. You're getting reported." When i asked if she would prefer i sin-binned them each time she just walked off.

Out of interest what response would you give? The card, a 1-1 chat or something else?

With younger players the 1-1 chat work well for me and i use it often but with the 16+ i feel i'm just wasting my time so i do what i do.
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This is one area of refereeing where the safeguarding has "run ahead" of the referee development. Yes, it is vital that the CWO looks out for their players (which at a few ckubs doesn't happen); but we as referees need to be mindful of this. I think your response should have been to ask her advice on what you should have said would have been better for you than what you said. I see referee development by the CFA's only aimed at adult football, rather than youth football. And safeguarding is only done when we need a course.

You can then see if she knows what she is talking about.... It may have been the child had other issues (not known to you).

However, as a normal response, I don't have any problems as to what you said.
 
@Kent Ref - I don't see you've done anything wrong in what you said to the 16yo (or from about U12s up). Regular occurrence where comments are falling short of qualifying as dissent. I'm absolutely mindful of how you speak to children when refereeing but if you can be respectfully stern to them we may as well give up (if we haven't already). I also don't personally take issue with what you said to the CWO but @lincs22 suggestion is sensible.
 
I'm also conflicted that "children" are not behaving like "children".

When i was 16 i wouldn't have spoken to adults or referees like the youth do now.

When you give a bit back suddenly parents and/or players become enraged but don't or cannot see what they have done wrong at all. They're blind of thier own offences.

Makes you wonder what sort of parenting is going on. I fear this decline is nowhere near over yet.

Sad times.
 
Kent Ref said:
I'm also conflicted that "children" are not behaving like "children".

When i was 16 i wouldn't have spoken to adults or referees like the youth do now.

When you give a bit back suddenly parents and/or players become enraged but don't or cannot see what they have done wrong at all. They're blind of thier own offences.

Makes you wonder what sort of parenting is going on. I fear this decline is nowhere near over yet.

Sad times.
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It's barely beginning at the current rate of escalation. Not had many bad experiences in two years to be fair, but being loudly called a "useless f***ing c***" last week by a parent after an U15s game in clear earshot (approx 10 yards) of the players and coaches was a new low!
 
The Gump said:
It's barely beginning at the current rate of escalation. Not had many bad experiences in two years to be fair, but being loudly called a "useless f***ing c***" last week by a parent after an U15s game in clear earshot (approx 10 yards) of the players and coaches was a new low!
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I had those exact words once. It is disgraceful at the minute.
 
The Gump said:
Too true too often Gabriel.
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I do think a lot more needs to be done about it. In 12 games this season (had a long break due to injury and circumstances etc) I have had to put in 5 extraordinary reports due to player or spectator behaviour etc either during or after the match, which is 5 times too many IMHO.
 
You were spot on in your wording. Firm, clear and polite. What would the CWO have preferred you say exactly? I cannot see how any of what you said should provide anyone with an issue. Perhaps if players learnt their place in the game a little more and thought through what they said before speaking, and were respectful of the referee, then situations like this wouldn't arise in the first place.
 
It's difficult to offer advice without the context. You say that sometimes you say.............. then a short while back a CWO approached you after the game. You don't say what you actually said in that game or what tone you used, could it have sounded confrontational to someone on the side?

I can see a circumstance for example that if a teacher said that to a child that they may be pulled in dependent upon who heard it, the tone that used etc. There is an argument that well this isn't an educational setting, it is a football pitch. But then again, I often hear players use that reasoning as an excuse to be verbally aggressive and abusive to the match officials and match officials stating that they can't use that as an excuse. I'm actually arguing with myself here I think!

I'm not disagreeing with what you have said or with other posters, I'm trying to maybe offer a different opinion on how someone else may view it.

Although after advising that their team lost 6 0, it probably doesn't need discussing any further.
 
I just had a survey through from my local FA about what issues we face and how they could be tackled.

I basically said I thought it was a problem with the sport, the culture and society in general and I doubt there was anything they could do that would make any difference.
 
Kent Ref said:
I'm also conflicted that "children" are not behaving like "children".

When i was 16 i wouldn't have spoken to adults or referees like the youth do now.

When you give a bit back suddenly parents and/or players become enraged but don't or cannot see what they have done wrong at all. They're blind of thier own offences.

Makes you wonder what sort of parenting is going on. I fear this decline is nowhere near over yet.

Sad times.
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And that right there is modern society
 
DazN said:
I just had a survey through from my local FA about what issues we face and how they could be tackled.

I basically said I thought it was a problem with the sport, the culture and society in general and I doubt there was anything they could do that would make any difference.
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Exactly. Society has brought a lot of them up to be horrible and disrespectful. Added to that, the professional game openly encourages backchat, verbal abuse of refs, cheating etc. The FA keep doing the surveys, but they know what the issues are and are too spineless to do anything about it.
 
Protzko and Schooler report that since 624 BC people have complained about the decline of the present generation of youth compared to earlier generations. They call this the "kids these days effect"

I love reading people write about the decline of society. Studied it in uni, people have been complaining about the next generation and generally society since at least 624 BC
 
Kent Ref said:
A short while back a Child Welfare Officer came accross to me at full time.

"You cannot speak to children ike that. That's totally inappropriate. You're getting reported." When i asked if she would prefer i sin-binned them each time she just walked off.
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Treat her totally worthless comments with the contempt they deserve. ...
 
Kent Ref said:
"You cannot speak to children ike that. That's totally inappropriate. You're getting reported."
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My response would have been: "You are not allowed to enter the field of play to confront a match official or speak to us like that. You are also getting reported." I know that makes it sound like a team official but a spectator should not be on the pitch in the first place (assuming that is where she came to make the comment).
 
I try to avoid non-football words or additional talk in youth matches. Dissent is very rare, so low tolerance fits.

Just the facts. I don’t think spending time sweet talking is anyone’s interest. The exception is with a very young player that is hurt/upset - even then, if I say a few kind words, it is part of the segue to the responsible adult.

I find the players at 15-19 mercifully straightforward (and predictable) - it’s the coaches that are hard to handle!
 
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