I'm not getting riled up or anything here. This is a logical fallacy that YOU keep falling into, it's relevant to point out that you've made the same mistake here with your argument that you've made elsewhere.
And none of this invalidates the point that I've made in a calm and polite manner, so please don't try and pretend that I'm picking a fight where I absolutely haven't.
If the referee explicitly instructs not to flag in the absence of appeal, I assume we (as assistants) should adhere to such instruction even if we don't agree with it? Consistency and teamwork being more important than opinion on the matter?
I'm literally replying to a post that you've made - how is it inappropriate to use the word "you" when doing so? But fine, if that word really offends you so much, pretend I wrote this:Ok well you ignore my fallacies please because there are a small audience who are interested in them. Kindly consider anything you see of mine posted not relevant to you or your refereeing
That way, this forum can focus on help and advice instead of you jumping onto anything I post in an attempt to ridicule it.
Obviously that's entirely your prerogative.Not for me. I will flag that situation and make the ref make his call.
No offence will be taken by me whatever the decision and it wont affect my next decision
Far rather talk about it on the pitch than in the dressing room at ht
Obviously that's entirely your prerogative.
But for any up and coming referees out there who are starting to be given more AR responsibilities, worth remembering that you are there to assist the referee and flagrantly ignoring his or her specific pre match advice (whether on this issue or any other) is a sure fire way to get bad marks and an unhelpful reputation. Obviously feel free to clarify things pre match (and if you feel strongly about an issue to debate it at that point) but during the game, go against your instructions at your peril
Yup, interesting different perspective. I veer more towards the 'Assist the referee to have a great game' camp than a 'look after number one' camp. But I think we can both agree that if you intend doing something (anything!) different to your pre match instructions, that you should be flagging this to the referee pre game rather than surprising him during it??Accept your view point and forgive me in advance for paiting another senario
Ok you think its off but you dont flag as per instructions from ref...
Supervisor comes in at end, asks why you never flagged and you say, because the ref told you pre match not too!
Absurd, imo. You look after number one out there, i.e. You
Offer the advice and then by all means allow mr Ref his status
Might be diff where you are but the low mark, if its a concern, will come from getting the decision wrong, not from making the referee look good.
Repuation? I be very satisfied to be known as that lino who got the call right, rather than that lino who sheeps along
I guess it depends what your priorities are
Yup, interesting different perspective. I veer more towards the 'Assist the referee to have a great game' camp than a 'look after number one' camp. But I think we can both agree that if you intend doing something (anything!) different to your pre match instructions, that you should be flagging this to the referee pre game rather than surprising him during it??
But there's no reason to do that, so your entire point is moot. Hence why I'm confused that this avenue of thought keeps cropping up. You can use the reactions of players as a guide when appropriate, and not use it when it's not appropriate and that's absolutely fine.Am painting a picture of what I consider the point to be then applying it to different situations with a view to maintaining the same mindset when considering a call
Maybe just me but am flagging/not flagging based on my view point, understanding of the law, regardless of a gk sitting on the floor saying nothing, or running towards me with a sword.
But there's no reason to do that, so your entire point is moot. Hence why I'm confused that this avenue of thought keeps cropping up. You can use the reactions of players as a guide when appropriate, and not use it when it's not appropriate and that's absolutely fine.
Has anyone working as an AR on this thread been told "no surprises" by a ref when you're discussing possible penalty calls? When I was first introduced to it, it came across as "cowardly", but I've since come to appreciate the logic behind it. If you think you've seen a penalty but no one is appealing, perhaps the smart thing isn't to give the penalty, but assume that you've mis-seen what's happening and allow play to continue.
And that's exactly the principal we're talking about applying here. It might look offside, but if you're not sure and no-one appeals, surely it makes sense not to flag for the same reasons?I will express my points in the way I see fit regardless of your input thanks
As you also are free to do
Your second point to the post I understand and can relate too.
I have heard me ask in the pre match as referee that you dont give me pens that I have to justify and explain for the next 20 years......which I think is along same lines as you are intending
And yes as AR if am thinking, oh, maybe, yet no appeals and ref dont even consider it worth glancing at me for then we move on.
And that's exactly the principal we're talking about applying here. It might look offside, but if you're not sure and no-one appeals, surely it makes sense not to flag for the same reasons?