West Ham v Manchester City
- Thread starter bloovee
- Start date
It's very common to see a throw given and the winger grab the ball looking for a quick throw, then realise the quick throw isn't on and so underarms it to a full back. In that situation, which of those two has entered/left the FOP without permission? And why haven't we seen it punished, or the original player who left made to take the throw in the past?
Agree with all the above, this is nonsense.
Agree with all the above, this is nonsense.
The point being made is that they second player is off the FOP when play restarts through their own actions/decision.
Stupidly technical yes, but as I said, that is the reason why. I'm not passing any comment on whether it is important or otherwise etc. A question was asked and that is the answer!
I won't bother next time.
Stupidly technical yes, but as I said, that is the reason why. I'm not passing any comment on whether it is important or otherwise etc. A question was asked and that is the answer!
I won't bother next time.
ladbroke8745
RefChat Addict
Just to be pedantic...
Attacker slides off pitch chasing ball over the top...
As he lays on the turf, catching his breath, he pulls his socks up that have come down a little.
Keeper has taken a quick goal kick.
Attacker still off the field off play and play has resumed. Are we penalising the player for coming back on a few seconds later after play restart or just getting on with it? Has he your permission, without indication, to come back on?
It's all silly if I'm being honest.
Attacker slides off pitch chasing ball over the top...
As he lays on the turf, catching his breath, he pulls his socks up that have come down a little.
Keeper has taken a quick goal kick.
Attacker still off the field off play and play has resumed. Are we penalising the player for coming back on a few seconds later after play restart or just getting on with it? Has he your permission, without indication, to come back on?
It's all silly if I'm being honest.
I don't see how making him wait is supportable in law.
ladbroke8745
RefChat Addict
I was just being pedantic.
I wouldn't make him wait. But in this scenario, he has delayed himself coming back on by taking a breather, sorting himself out. Could argue he could be trying to delay restart by making people wait for him.
As said, being pedantic and we could look at many situations where players are off the field of play, other than ones we give permission for without verbally giving it, by the allowing of corners etc.
one
RefChat Addict
As you described it, without any other factors involved, get on with it. Let me add a few other things and it's not such an obvious decision.
Keeper distributes the ball quickly down sideline. Defender is making a run on sideline near where attacker is 1m off and still stuffing around with his sucks and adjusting shinpads giving NO sign of he is about to come back on. But as soon as the defender about to pass him, in sudden sly move, he slides in 1m and tackles the ball. What do you do now? Clever move or unsporting deception?
As for the corner, I don't mind if more than one player is off the field for 'normal' reasons. Heck there can be 5 of them. But as soon as they are doing it to deceive opponents then I'm stopping them. There has been enough precedents of directives in the past preventing this type of deception, some even are worded in law, for us to know it shouldn't be allowed.
Under Delaying the Restart, NOT under entering/leaving without permission.
If you can make a case that having 2 players by a corner flag so as to disguise if it's in/outswinging is delaying the restart, I'll accept a card (or accept a referee trying to manage it). But in reality, all a referee does by getting involved there is delay the restart further - and we have precedent from a throw-in that it's perfectly acceptable for multiple players to choose to enter/leave play for the sake of carrying out a restart.
Feinting at a FK is allowed. You can have any number of players running over the ball before one actually kicks it.
Alternative corner takers is hardly unsporting deception any more than if a goal kick is going short or long (or a corner).
Just referees making more work for themselves to do. Pointless.
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santa sangria
RefChat Addict
This is fandom.
If you allow players to leave the field then attackers will stand in the goal at corners.
Leaving the FoP is allowed as part of a “natural playing action” or something… where is it in the LotG… trying to find it…?
If you allow players to leave the field then attackers will stand in the goal at corners.
Leaving the FoP is allowed as part of a “natural playing action” or something… where is it in the LotG… trying to find it…?
ChasObserverRefDeveloper
Regular Contributor
From the USA 13 years ago:
Ask A Soccer Referee
Answers to Soccer Laws of the Game and Practical Soccer Refereeing Questions
POSTED ON FEBRUARY 5, 2010 BY JIM ALLEN
LEAVING THE FIELD OF PLAY
Question:
The attacking team is awarded a corner kick. Player A from the attacking team lines up to take the corner kick. Player B from the attacking team leaves the field of play – about three yards past the touch line. Player A taps the ball from the corner kick and Player B runs from his position off the field of play onto the field of play and kicks the ball towards the goal.
Has Player B infringed on the laws of the game by leaving the field of play without the permission of the center referee and then played the ball. Leaving the field of play has allowed Player B to develop more speed at the point he plays the ball from Player A and perhaps also involves some trickery as the other team might not have accounted for this player to defend.
USSF answer (February 5, 2010):
Players are permitted to leave the field without the referee’s permission (1) during the course of play to avoid an obstacle (opponent, teammate, referee), (2) to retrieve the ball when it has left the field, (3) to put the ball back into play at a throw-in or a kick restart, (4) to signal that they are not involved in play during a possible offside situation.
Players are not allowed to leave the field of play simply to station themselves conveniently for a restart being taken by another player. As we said in an earlier response, with the exceptions noted above, players are expected to be and remain on the field of play. Leaving under the circumstances described would NOT be in the course of play and, if the referee decided that it was being done for unfair tactical reason, the action would be cautionable.
POSTED IN "INVENTIVE COACHES", LAW 12 - FOULS & MISCONDUCT, LAW 18 - COMMON SENSE
Ask A Soccer Referee
Answers to Soccer Laws of the Game and Practical Soccer Refereeing Questions
POSTED ON FEBRUARY 5, 2010 BY JIM ALLEN
LEAVING THE FIELD OF PLAY
Question:
The attacking team is awarded a corner kick. Player A from the attacking team lines up to take the corner kick. Player B from the attacking team leaves the field of play – about three yards past the touch line. Player A taps the ball from the corner kick and Player B runs from his position off the field of play onto the field of play and kicks the ball towards the goal.
Has Player B infringed on the laws of the game by leaving the field of play without the permission of the center referee and then played the ball. Leaving the field of play has allowed Player B to develop more speed at the point he plays the ball from Player A and perhaps also involves some trickery as the other team might not have accounted for this player to defend.
USSF answer (February 5, 2010):
Players are permitted to leave the field without the referee’s permission (1) during the course of play to avoid an obstacle (opponent, teammate, referee), (2) to retrieve the ball when it has left the field, (3) to put the ball back into play at a throw-in or a kick restart, (4) to signal that they are not involved in play during a possible offside situation.
Players are not allowed to leave the field of play simply to station themselves conveniently for a restart being taken by another player. As we said in an earlier response, with the exceptions noted above, players are expected to be and remain on the field of play. Leaving under the circumstances described would NOT be in the course of play and, if the referee decided that it was being done for unfair tactical reason, the action would be cautionable.
POSTED IN "INVENTIVE COACHES", LAW 12 - FOULS & MISCONDUCT, LAW 18 - COMMON SENSE
The fans pay the refs' wages.
They know what's "fair", and it isn't always what's in the laws. A vastly larger law book may have helped avoid some inconsistencies but in the end "does it really matter?" is a useful starting point for revisions.
A good illustration - like attackers off the FoP within the goal - of stuff that matters.
R
Runner-Ref
Guest
Not really sure what you mean by your first point.
Whilst in the grand scheme of things it doesn’t really matter, referees merely apply the laws. Laws that are created by IFAB, not the referees.
This does sound like one of the scenarios which will be clarified in the next 1 or 2 versions of LOTG. Similarly to the clarification of ‘deliberate play’ by a defending player.
No they don't, PGMOL pay their "wages". PGMOL isn't funded by clubs, so by definition the fans can't possibly pay the officials' wages. Not to mention only a miniscule of money coming into football comes from fans paying to enter stadiums to watch games.
Never could a more inaccurate statement have been made. It is just wrong on every possible level.