Watford v Brentford

[ladbroke8745]

Trying to understand how they said he was onside.
Pundits, even fans, think he is offside.

On field call was offside. So wasnt a case of official didnt think it was. He flagged.
ball was crossed to him who flicked it on to back post. Yellow is attacking.

 

[ASM]

That’s all to do with camera angle and perspective. Our eyes cannot perceive 3D elements from a 2D image very well and the angle of the camera further distorts the relative position on things.

 

[ChasObserverRefDeveloper]

Interesting one! The yellow player has a foot on the VAR line, his arm doesn't count for offside purposes, but the defender has an arm goalside of the VAR line, thus playing him on.

 

[cwyeary]

When the graphic presents the green line it means it was within the 5cm margin of error.

It looks like an odd one but I guess we just need to trust that the software mapped his head correctly in space related to the defenders foot or upper arm.

It's one where the new graphics with semi automated offside in the World Cup and in the PL starting in 23/24 would help a lot.

 

[bloovee]

That’s all to do with camera angle and perspective. Our eyes cannot perceive 3D elements from a 2D image very well and the angle of the camera further distorts the relative position on things.

Does the VAR have a different sort of eyes to the rest of us?

 

[bloovee]

Interesting one! The yellow player has a foot on the VAR line, his arm doesn't count for offside purposes, but the defender has an arm goalside of the VAR line, thus playing him on.

What's the defender's arm got to do with it?

 

[ChasObserverRefDeveloper]

What's the defender's arm got to do with it?

It is playing the attacker onside.

 

[bloovee]

It is playing the attacker onside.

Am I missing something here? No-one's arm counts.

 

[cwyeary]

Am I missing something here? No-one's arm counts.

The upper arm counts. Look at these images. Most of the lines are being drawn from the upper arm.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1500837482405023744

 

[ASM]

Does the VAR have a different sort of eyes to the rest of us?

No, that’s why’s the technology judges position not the human eye

 

[JamesL]

No, that’s why’s the technology judges position not the human eye

A human places the lines.

 

[bloovee]

If that's not offside, it's pointless even showing the pictures. It looks an offside duck and quacks like an offside duck but the computer says no.

 

[ASM]

A human places the lines.

Yes, I know; but that is done by cross-hair click to a static image.
The technology the judges the relative position based on its calibration. Dale Johnson has tweeted ad infinitum about it is his explanations

 

[ASM]

You lit carry on, I’ve had enough

 

[cwyeary]

You lit carry on, I’ve had enough

We're four years into this already. If people don't understand how it works it's because they're choosing not to.

 

[ChasObserverRefDeveloper]

Am I missing something here? No-one's arm counts.

The attacker's arm doesn't count as they can't score with it. Nothing in law about defender's body parts. . .

 

[cwyeary]

The attacker's arm doesn't count as they can't score with it. Nothing in law about defender's body parts. . .

The hands and arms of all players, including the goalkeepers, are not considered. For the purposes of determining offside, the upper boundary of the arm is in line with the bottom of the armpit.

First page of law 11.

 

[RustyRef]

@ASM is spot on here. A person doesn't draw the lines, rather VAR clicks on the the part of the body that can legally play the ball that is furthest forward. The technology then draws the lines. We just have to trust that it is calibrated correctly and therefore the lines are accurate.

Looking at a still image that isn't in line doesn't really let the human eye make a correct judgement if it is tight, but, in theory at least, the technology can do what the naked eye can't.

 

[ladbroke8745]

This is the image in its fullest.
I can see where they've drawn the line (on the defenders foot) but it just looks like the head/shoulder of the yellow attacker is ahead of it.
Don't see how they can be 100% certain and wish in these type of situations they go with on field decision.

 

[cwyeary]

Don't see how they can be 100% certain and wish in these type of situations they go with on field decision.

That was a decision made by the premier league. In most competitions if it's within the tolerance or error level it goes with the on-field decision. The Premier League decided in those situations it will be onside.