A&H

Really, coach?!

ChasObserverRefDeveloper

ChasObserverRefDeveloper

Regular Contributor
Watched a game this week (as a spectator, not an observer) in which the referee sent the home captain (a qualified referee) to the sin bin for the second time after 60 minutes.
Three minutes later the team's coach made his third and final substitution (no injury involved, so presumably tactical)
After 70 minutes the coach and captain were shouting for the captain to come back on. Request refused, explanation given, coach used language which resulted in a red card for him.
Captain offered the view that the referee should have explained the law.
Match continued after some 7 or 8 minutes . . . and the 10 men lost 1-0.
 
The Referee Store
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
Watched a game this week (as a spectator, not an observer) in which the referee sent the home captain (a qualified referee) to the sin bin for the second time after 60 minutes.
Three minutes later the team's coach made his third and final substitution (no injury involved, so presumably tactical)
After 70 minutes the coach and captain were shouting for the captain to come back on. Request refused, explanation given, coach used language which resulted in a red card for him.
Captain offered the view that the referee should have explained the law.
Match continued after some 7 or 8 minutes . . . and the 10 men lost 1-0.
Click to expand...
Tough titty IMO
 
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
Watched a game this week (as a spectator, not an observer) in which the referee sent the home captain (a qualified referee) to the sin bin for the second time after 60 minutes.
Three minutes later the team's coach made his third and final substitution (no injury involved, so presumably tactical)
After 70 minutes the coach and captain were shouting for the captain to come back on. Request refused, explanation given, coach used language which resulted in a red card for him.
Captain offered the view that the referee should have explained the law.
Match continued after some 7 or 8 minutes . . . and the 10 men lost 1-0.
Click to expand...
Take off your spectator hat and put on your observer/coach cap and what would you say to the referee? Could he have avoided this situation?
 
As I recall, all coaches and Captains were able to attend the numerous presentations that County FAs organised a couple of years back to educate us all on the sin bin and how it works. If neither of them have that knowledge - that's for them to worry about. Plenty of info and learning available on the internet. As per usual though, it's somehow the ref's fault ... :rolleyes:
 
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
Watched a game this week (as a spectator, not an observer) in which the referee sent the home captain (a qualified referee) to the sin bin for the second time after 60 minutes.
Three minutes later the team's coach made his third and final substitution (no injury involved, so presumably tactical)
After 70 minutes the coach and captain were shouting for the captain to come back on. Request refused, explanation given, coach used language which resulted in a red card for him.
Captain offered the view that the referee should have explained the law.
Match continued after some 7 or 8 minutes . . . and the 10 men lost 1-0.
Click to expand...

This Captain "referee" doesn't sound very qualified to me ...
 
What harm is done by telling the player his game is over, and can only be substituted after the elapsed time? Or even letting manager know?

Situation of manager off and team not reduced to 10 is totally avoidable here and if I was observing a referee, I think I'd be at minimum be mentioning this off the record.

Personally I am thinking about protecting a club mark here, which doesn't apply to everyone, I know. But at steps 5-6, these small things can mean getting promoted or staying where you are.

Yes, they attended a seminar 2 season ago, since then very little football has been played, and what has been, severely punctuated. We as refs keep on top of the laws and it is our duty to know. I would like players to know, and managers to know, but reality is they don't, even if they did attend and no harm is caused, in fact I would say there is more of a benefit by explaining the repurcussions in this situation.

Edit: on a side note a 'qualified ref' 1) getting 2 dissent cautions is disgraceful. And 2) not knowing the laws around temporary dismissals...
 
While we don't owe it to them to explain here. It's uncommon enough that it seems certainly worth doing to me. Little effort, no harm, potentially avoids an issue. I think we can make our lives easier by communicating more than we have to.
 
Agree with SL and James. For example, in a Cup game with the pens to decide if a draw, if I'm referee or senior AR I will always remind benches that only 11 on FOP at the end can take pens.
 
PinnerPaul said:
Agree with SL and James. For example, in a Cup game with the pens to decide if a draw, if I'm referee or senior AR I will always remind benches that only 11 on FOP at the end can take pens.
Click to expand...
Be careful @PinnerPaul, that’s not strictly true. A player who is still serving a temporary dismissal at the end of the match is permitted to take part in kicks from the penalty mark (penalties).
Kind of tied into this scenario.
 
That's not applied whenever I've given out the advice, but thanks for pointing out that exception - easily forgotten in the heat of the moment.

I have a County Cup S/F line on Sunday, so you never know, it may come up!
 
JamesL said:
What harm is done by telling the player his game is over, and can only be substituted after the elapsed time? Or even letting manager know?

Situation of manager off and team not reduced to 10 is totally avoidable here and if I was observing a referee, I think I'd be at minimum be mentioning this off the record.

Personally I am thinking about protecting a club mark here, which doesn't apply to everyone, I know. But at steps 5-6, these small things can mean getting promoted or staying where you are.

Yes, they attended a seminar 2 season ago, since then very little football has been played, and what has been, severely punctuated. We as refs keep on top of the laws and it is our duty to know. I would like players to know, and managers to know, but reality is they don't, even if they did attend and no harm is caused, in fact I would say there is more of a benefit by explaining the repurcussions in this situation.

Edit: on a side note a 'qualified ref' 1) getting 2 dissent cautions is disgraceful. And 2) not knowing the laws around temporary dismissals...
Click to expand...
I agree that the Ref is on top form if he/she is astute enough to notice and negotiate this potentiality. However, I see it as bonus marks for 'attention/awareness', rather than being marked down for slipping this evil banana skin
 
Big Cat said:
I agree that the Ref is on top form if he/she is astute enough to notice and negotiate this potentiality. However, I see it as bonus marks for 'attention/awareness', rather than being marked down for slipping this evil banana skin
Click to expand...
Hence why as an observer it would likely be an off the record. This doesn't affect your report from me but it will from them type conversation.
That said if the game goes totally south from here then it could creep into match control section
 
Yampy said:
Take off your spectator hat and put on your observer/coach cap and what would you say to the referee? Could he have avoided this situation?
Click to expand...
I spoke with the referee after the game, and we discussed whether a word of advice before the substitution would have been appropriate.
The referee's approach may have been coloured by the fact that the same coach had screamed at the referee a minute before half time - "You've got to ####ing send him off" in relation to an opponent having fouled one of his players in the penalty area. The careless offence was on the goal line between the goal area line and the penalty area line. The penalty was missed.
At the half time whistle the coach came onto the f. o. p. to complain that the referee "Don't know the ####ing rules"
I offered guidance about dealing with such behaviour in the future, and help with the report (his first, as he qualified just before lockdown #1)
The captain, at the centre of the issue, was on the same referee course as the match referee (and I was a tutor on that course, so I guess it's all my fault!) 🤔
 
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
I spoke with the referee after the game, and we discussed whether a word of advice before the substitution would have been appropriate.
The referee's approach may have been coloured by the fact that the same coach had screamed at the referee a minute before half time - "You've got to ####ing send him off" in relation to an opponent having fouled one of his players in the penalty area. The careless offence was on the goal line between the goal area line and the penalty area line. The penalty was missed.
At the half time whistle the coach came onto the f. o. p. to complain that the referee "Don't know the ####ing rules"
I offered guidance about dealing with such behaviour in the future, and help with the report (his first, as he qualified just before lockdown #1)
The captain, at the centre of the issue, was on the same referee course as the match referee (and I was a tutor on that course, so I guess it's all my fault!) 🤔
Click to expand...
Hopefully the RDO will get wind of his antics and have a word in his hear about how he should be expected to behave!!

Coach entering FOP to remonstrate with a match official is a listed red card offence now. Which can be very daunting as a new referee. Lucky to have got some nice impartial advice afterwards 👍 sounds like a game that could of got the person wondering what they were in for
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top